2012 Camaro ZL1 at Jay Leno's Garage Video

[Shurenuff]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

I think that GM knows that if the ZL1 is priced much more than ten percent higher than a "similarly equipped" GT500 or in the CTS-V range, most potential ZL1 buyers will choose to purchase other vehicles. The ZL1 needs to be priced in the range where its target demographic can and will purchase it.

Exactly. Everyone just needs to calm down and think logically. While the ZL1 won't start at $48k, it definitely won't start at $60+k. The CTS-V starts at about $63k.

I'll eat my words if it starts at $60+k.

[OldJedi]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

I think that GM knows that if the ZL1 is priced much more than ten percent higher than a "similarly equipped" GT500 or in the CTS-V range, most potential ZL1 buyers will choose to purchase other vehicles. The ZL1 needs to be priced in the range where its target demographic can and will purchase it.

I might be able to pull the extra money if it costs $75,000 but I am not sure that I would. They have a loaded Black Diamond CTS-V with 4500 miles on it for $62,000 at Carmax. I really want the ZL1 but I think $75,000 puts it into a totally different range for most of us. Justice Pete and Ligenfelter are putting together a L/28 Camaro and they will announcing pricing soon. At $75,000 there will be a lot of other alternatives to the ZL1.

[OldJedi]

Originally Posted by Z_Rocks

Took a ride in my friend's brand new CTS-V coupe and I tell you, look & feel wise, it's even better than M5 [that he traded in]. Might be a tad slower than ZL1, but it turns ahead every where.

I spent a week in a CTS Coupe and loved it. If Chevy over prices the ZL1 ($75,000), my going to a CTS-V will not be too hard a decision.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by OldJedi

I spent a week in a CTS Coupe and loved it. If Chevy over prices the ZL1 ($75,000), my going to a CTS-V will not be too hard a decision.

If the price even gets CLOSE to that amount, I'll be banned for what I'll be posting...

[Inferno Orange 2SS-RS]

Very Nice, I know I will not be getting one, but can't wait to see them at the car shows when the wealthy people buy them.

[Inferno Orange 2SS-RS]

Originally Posted by radz28

If the price even gets CLOSE to that amount, I'll be banned for what I'll be posting...

My guess is somewhere between $60k to $74k.

[Rice Killer]

Originally Posted by OldJedi

I might be able to pull the extra money if it costs $75,000 but I am not sure that I would. They have a loaded Black Diamond CTS-V with 4500 miles on it for $62,000 at Carmax. I really want the ZL1 but I think $75,000 puts it into a totally different range for most of us. Justice Pete and Ligenfelter are putting together a L/28 Camaro and they will announcing pricing soon. At $75,000 there will be a lot of other alternatives to the ZL1.

Don't know where you live but my wife wanted to get a CTS-V instead of the ZL1 and she found a CTS-V coupe on auto trader in black diamond with 9xx miles for $54,995 in Texas. I called her a liar and had crow for supper haha.

This was a week or so ago.

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by tooslow

I respectfully disagree. I think GM has already done it's homework and knows how many of these cars they can sell on an annual basis based on brand-loyalty alone. Let's face it, even if the updated GT500 outperforms the ZL1, there are still a ton of people who would never buy one based simply on the fact that it is produced by Ford. IMO, GM is counting on those people to buy this car, not your average unbiased consumer. And if the price is too high for "a Camaro", they will likely lean to staying in the GM family and go for a Corvette (performance) or CTS-V (luxury/performance).

It would be interesting to see GM's actual marketing information and surveys with respect to the ZL1. I think that GM is trying to expand its customer base with the ZL1 and is not just relying on current Chevy loyalists to purchase the ZL1.

I'm not so sure there are a large number of potential ZL1 customers that GM can count on based solely on brand loyalty, especially at likely ZL1 prices. I think there is a relatively limited market for a Camaro with an MSRP over $50K, and with each $1K price increment over $50K, the pool of potential Camaro buyers shrinks. I think that there are many potential ZL1 buyers who are Chevy loyalists who will be stretching to make the purchase with a price in the the low to mid $50K's, and if it's priced much beyond that, those buyers will be forced to purchase a different vehicle.

There are the potential ZL1 buyers who can afford the vehicle at whatever price, but are wiling to (or who have a boss that will let them) pay only so much for a Camaro (remember the difficulty there was in selling the 9560 COPOs). Of those buyers, those who want a 2+2 vehicle will not purchase a Corvette. Some may purchase a CTS-V, but some will likely purchase a GT500, and I think that many will opt for a Porsche, BMW, or Mercedes.

There are some Chevy enthusiasts who won't buy a Ford, and vice-versa, but I think those individuals make up a very small percentage of the automobile buying public. One may tend to get a skewed view of those loyalist percentages if one tends to frequent enthusiast sites.

[kudzu74]

You all need to stop the hype your gonna scare the common man! I think what he meant is there is not other current production car under 75k that has this kind of power and performance for the price. The price will still be a lot less than a CTS-V8. I would say it still has to be below the 55k mark...if not well they just lost a customer who will now sit and wait on a new platform with a Z28 badge and if that does not happen then o well it will be time to supercharge my current ride for 5k.

[Sid Irons]

Still love my SS but the ZL1 is a monster

[OldJedi]

Originally Posted by Rice Killer

Don't know where you live but my wife wanted to get a CTS-V instead of the ZL1 and she found a CTS-V coupe on auto trader in black diamond with 9xx miles for $54,995 in Texas. I called her a liar and had crow for supper haha.

This was a week or so ago.

Did it have the yellow brake calipers? IF so, that is a really good deal. The one here is a 2011 fully loaded with Recaros and bigger sunroof and Nav. I went back and checked again. I was wrong, it is $60,995.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by Rice Killer

Don't know where you live but my wife wanted to get a CTS-V instead of the ZL1 and she found a CTS-V coupe on auto trader in black diamond with 9xx miles for $54,995 in Texas. I called her a liar and had crow for supper haha.

This was a week or so ago.

That'll probably be the route I have to go if we're talking that kind of money. I was really hoping for a different senario, but it is what it is. That price doesn't sound bad at all for that 'V.

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

It would be interesting to see GM's actual marketing information and surveys with respect to the ZL1. I think that GM is trying to expand its customer base with the ZL1 and is not just relying on current Chevy loyalists to purchase the ZL1.

I'm not so sure there are a large number of potential ZL1 customers that GM can count on based solely on brand loyalty, especially at likely ZL1 prices. I think there is a relatively limited market for a Camaro with an MSRP over $50K, and with each $1K price increment over $50K, the pool of potential Camaro buyers shrinks. I think that there are many potential ZL1 buyers who are Chevy loyalists who will be stretching to make the purchase with a price in the the low to mid $50K's, and if it's priced much beyond that, those buyers will be forced to purchase a different vehicle.

There are the potential ZL1 buyers who can afford the vehicle at whatever price, but are wiling to (or who have a boss that will let them) pay only so much for a Camaro (remember the difficulty there was in selling the 9560 COPOs). Of those buyers, those who want a 2+2 vehicle will not purchase a Corvette. Some may purchase a CTS-V, but some will likely purchase a GT500, and I think that many will opt for a Porsche, BMW, or Mercedes.

There are some Chevy enthusiasts who won't buy a Ford, and vice-versa, but I think those individuals make up a very small percentage of the automobile buying public. One may tend to get a skewed view of those loyalist percentages if one tends to frequent enthusiast sites.

I'd like to see how their brains are ticking. I'm just not seeing what it seems like they might be seeing. I don't have a real pulse on the market, but I wonder how many buyer would laugh at the thought of a +$60K CAMARO...

[TJ91]

why the hell do they keep showing two different cars?! The dash is clearly different

[Rice Killer]

Originally Posted by OldJedi

Did it have the yellow brake calipers? IF so, that is a really good deal. The one here is a 2011 fully loaded with Recaros and bigger sunroof and Nav. I went back and checked again. I was wrong, it is $60,995.

Yeah it had the black diamond package with black wheels, yellow calipers, and recaro seats. It was funny, I had told her if she could find one under $55k I'd buy that instead. Luckily she didn't make me hold true to it. Not to mention, I'm from WI and that was in Texas, although if in the market for one, it would have been worth the trip.

I just did a search for it and it's understandably gone but found a thunder gray Chromaflair with 514 miles for $56999. It's no black diamond but still nice. Here's the link: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...standard=false