OHIO CAMARO ENTHUSIASTS/OWNERS REPORT HERE

[wwddnnone]

If you're looking for a quick learn on suspension, etc. take a look at this.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...t=book+pedders

It's a good read. Not saying you need to buy Pedders, but a good explanation regardless.

[blue-bayou]

Very interesting; but not too helpful for me. I guess I am looking for something that addresses the fundamentals. So far my searches have been somewhat fruitless.

Thanks though

[IROCanSS]

Wow, um... Yea I don't really know the nuts and bolts of most parts and what the sole purpose is. Here is my best explanation:

Springs: control the bounce of the car. Dampen the bumps. Stiffer springs, tighter ride

Shocks: control rebound and stop the car from bouncing forever as it would with the spring only

Sway bar: transfers load between the right and left wheel. Stiffer bar, more torsion to rotate bar, more evenly distributed forces

End link: attaches sway bar to control arm.

Toe bar: used to adjust/maintain the toe of the rear wheels. Upgraded bars would withstand more stresses

Trailing arm: Assist in planting the wheels, sort of like a traction bar I think


Don't take this as gospel, just what an engineering degree, a basic knowledge of cars, and seeing what's improved as I've replaced the parts.


Now if you're looking to upgrade, springs and sways make a huge difference. If you're going with sways, get end links too. Coilovers are great if you have money to burn or track the car A LOT and want to always screw with alignment issues if you keep adjusting.

I did toe bars and trailing arms to control wheel hop and add traction. Seems to help.

Another good upgrade is replacing all the rubber bushings. I did inserts and it really made it tight. Some do solids which really REALLY make it tight.

Next time were together you can drive my car. It's really a huge difference over stock!

[TLSTWIN]

Originally Posted by blue-bayou

Well, I think I have a handle on ladder bar, four link, and leaf spring suspensions but I am unfamiliar with the suspensions in say something like a G-body car (which uses soemthing that reminds me of 4-link) and IRS (our cars specifically).

Now, what I am looking for is someone who can give good explanations on the various components of our rear suspensions. Things like naming conventions, point and purpose, and be able to compare and contrast said components against cars with a live axle. For example, I understand that our rear upper and lower control arms are instrumental in alignment and help to keep the tire contact patch at a maximum when cornering and going over bumps. But a control arm in a G-body car does not do that since live axle type suspensions have no rear alignment to consider. Or is it more appropriate to call a live axle control arm a trailing arm. If this is true, then how would they compare to the function of our trailing arms. And what purpose does our trailing arms serve that the control arms, toe rods, springs, sway bar don't take care of?

OK, lets start with the live/solid axle... there is no need for toe link or trailing arm when referring to those pieces that we have on our cars... regardless of how good a solid axle is, it is impossible to get the BEST traction you possibly can on both tires at the same time UNLESS you only drive on straight flat roads.

Our upper & lower control arms allow each wheel to move independently of the other AND keep the most rubber on the road at best as possible. The trailing arming is help stabilize rotation of the wheel under power and off of power since there really is no other parts (axle housing of a live axle) to keep the parts from twisting. This also explains the toe link. Not only does it allow for adjustability (not really a word, but sounds good) of toe to further ensure more contact patch of tire to the track while cornering.

Obviously the I.R.S. allows for more adjustment and more contact patch of the rear tires to the ground than a live axle...

I hope that helps, sometimes I get lost in my own thought process and forget where I was going Hopefully I answered at least one of your questions and didn't loose you in the process

[TLSTWIN]

Here are a few more of a really nice race camaro.

[TLSTWIN]

Pretty cool...

I would love to have that '55 chevy, but don't have the cash or place to store it.

[blue-bayou]

WOW! I ask a question and get better information than all my searches. I should have asked a long time ago. I guess to be fair I should put things into perspective.

First of all, I really can't get into the details of what I'm thinking because I honestly believe people will tell me to forget it/it can't be done/etc (which only drives me more-All Things are Possible).

Perspective: God willing, I would like to drag race competively in the relatively near future, preferably in Stock class.

Originally Posted by IROCanSS

Trailing arm: Assist in planting the wheels, sort of like a traction bar I think

Trailing arms are my real concern at this point and I believe you may be right. I didn't look at it from this perspective.

Originally Posted by TLSTWIN

UNLESS you only drive on straight flat roads.

Our upper & lower control arms allow each wheel to move independently of the other AND keep the most rubber on the road at best as possible. The trailing arming is help stabilize rotation of the wheel under power and off of power since there really is no other parts (axle housing of a live axle) to keep the parts from twisting. This also explains the toe link. Not only does it allow for adjustability (not really a word, but sounds good) of toe to further ensure more contact patch of tire to the track while cornering.

Obviously the I.R.S. allows for more adjustment and more contact patch of the rear tires to the ground than a live axle...

I hope that helps, sometimes I get lost in my own thought process and forget where I was going Hopefully I answered at least one of your questions and didn't loose you in the process

Straight and flat roads-I'm good with that. And I disagree; I believe adjustability is a word unless it's misspelled. It's possible it may not be in a dictionary but antidisestablishmentarianism probably isn't in the dictionary but it's a word. As long as no prefix/suffix rules are broken-ahh sorry about the grammar crap. I'll move on.

More perspective: NHRA rules for Stock class allow using a different rearend from the same manufacturer as long as OEM trailing arms are retained/used. They can be beefed up but cannot be adjustable (I believe this is to prevent changes to wheelbase; which is also against the rules). Upper trailing arm can be adjustable (pinion angle)- but we don't have upper trailing arms. In a live axle car (using a Gbody as an example) the lower control/trailing arm is like a traction bar and I assume that the upper trailing arm keeps the diff from rolling over. This kind of setup seems remarkably close to a 4link setup without the adjustability. NHRA does not permit 4link adaptations (nor coilovers). I believe since our pumpkin is mounted, there is no need to worry about the differential turning in opposite direction of the tires. Furthermore, NHRA allows the upper control arm mounting location to be modified at the rear housing. As far as I can tell this probably does me no good as it is most likely meant for live axle type suspension. Also our control arms are positioned parallel to the axles. If you look at earlier vettes (C3) I believe their control arms/trailing arms are perendicular to the axles.

Which brings me to my problem-trailing arms. What are ours doing?(I believe y'all both answered this question appropriately) If utilizing a live axle, upper trailing arms are a must and all should be perendicular to the axles (I still need to do the calculations to verify this). We don't have upper trailing arms but I believe our control arms are comparable in functionality and our lower trailing arms are toed in roughly 45 degrees.

Anyway, I keep getting confused as I read over the rules and try to apply them to my car and to other types of suspensions.

[BVaughan77]

Originally Posted by Whitehambone

I'm in the Cleveland area and putting on Kooks Signature Stepped Headers, Hi-flo CATS and Kooks Street Sleeper Cat back system this winter. When spring hits and the salt clears off the roads, I plan on making a drive straight to a tuner. So I am looking for a full dyno tune and have heard that some write directly to the ECM. I have a Diablo Predator and thought it would be nice to be able to go back to stock if I ever really needed too. But I have heard it is better to write directly to the ECM. Anyway can someone in the area recommend a tuner within a reasonable distance from Cleveland?

I would recommend IPS Motorsports [IPSmotorsports.net] in Lewis Center, OH just north of Columbus. They have done a lot of work on my car and a ridiculous amount on Darth emma's car. They use HP Tuners and have two dynos at their shop. A mustang dyno and a new dynojet. You can check out the stuff I have done to my car as well as the tuning and power torque numbers in my sig.

[IROCanSS]

Phil... Look at the rules concerning driveshafts and axel shafts. Especially axel shafts. Ours are prone to breakage.

DO NOT go with a Richmond gear if you're planning on changing.

The diff is mounted in 3 locations. Two front, one rear lower I believe. No worry about twisting unless it breaks but the actual pumpkin is pretty strong. It's what's in it that's not.

Now, if you can change stuff but must come from the same manufacture... Look into replacing everything (diff, axels, driveshaft) with ZL1 parts. All are improved but still "OEM"

Probably quite costly but... Pay to play my friend.

Hope that helps some...

[blue-bayou]

Originally Posted by IROCanSS

Probably quite costly but... Pay to play my friend.

Hope that helps some...

True........so true. Thanks

[ChriSS84]

I'm thinking about the LPE gears.... Haven't heard a single bad thing about them

[TLSTWIN]

Originally Posted by cash84

I'm thinking about the LPE gears.... Haven't heard a single bad thing about them

They are putting them through the paces aren't they...

[IROCanSS]

Chris, if I ever do gears again, JRE/LPE 3.91 it will be.

[ChriSS84]

Originally Posted by IROCanSS

Chris, if I ever do gears again, JRE/LPE 3.91 it will be.

I learned from your Richmond gears to STAY away... LPE makes great stuff, and they know it. Costs an arm and a leg...

Just gotta find a good shop to do them. LPE isnt far from us. I might have them do it.