Al O. believes ZL1 still faster

[OldJedi]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

wellllll..........I didn't do 70mph on I-94 -- but on days that the sun came out - and it was above freezing......YES! (...I know....I'm nuts... Also important to note: CTF cars were all over the U.S. and Canada - the goal is to accumulate mileage quickly - (great excuse to drive to Florida and back!)

Come on down to Ft. Lauderdale, Fl. I have space in my garage while waiting for the ZL1 to arrive and you can keep your car in there and I have a spare bedroom. It is 68 deg. in the morning and low 80's in the afternoon. Leave the winter tires up north and come on down. Bring your suntan lotion!

[nanokpsi]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

It's not a matter of knowing details before they've released it.

It's a simple matter of being professionals in a business with far more cumulative intelligence and computing capabilities that we do, here. They don't bench-race. They can simulate conditions to near-reality with a negligible margin of error...

I'm sure they've benchmarked everything on their GT500 tester. I'm sure they could build that car themselves if they wanted to. With that in mind -- they could take what Ford has released, get some random factoids from suppliers, and as engineers with expertise in the field; use their best judgement to do what they're 99% sure Ford would do...and simulate. I'd be shocked if they didn't use a best-case scenario (from Ford's view) to ensure they've got their bases covered...

And then answer questions candidly when asked to tick off the competition.

It's not that impossible (pun regarding the picture, . They DO know more than we think they do...(on both sides of the battle).

It is obvious they were surprised with the 2013 specs. Given the past few weeks worth of interviews with Al O, it is plainly obvious they did not use a car with similar output in their benchmarking. With his bolstering, he could have easily said they "no one said we used a stock car as a benchmark", or something similar. Instead, you get "the ZL1 is quicker to 60mph in our simulations". To ME, it seems they took the specs Ford revealed and plugged them into a computer model, and with the gearing, weight and power output they were. However, we don't know what curve they used, IE it makes 650hp at 6250 but 670hp at the 7000 rpm over rev.We also don't know how FOrd's TC system will stack up against the ZL1's. Maybe it is better....do you think they fasctored that in?

[Truck Norris]

I honestly dont see how Al O. could make these sort of public statements after hearing that the 2013 GT500 can reach 62mph in first gear and only has to shift twice down the quarter mile.

Shifting costs a lot of time. Just look at the Z07's 0-60 time of only 3.8 seconds because its revised gearing requires shifting into 2nd gear giving it a slower time over the base even though it is lighter and has a lot better tires.

I could easily stand behind his statement if Ford didn't change the GT500's gearing but I just don't see the Z beating the GT500 being down 70-90hp, and having extra one extra shift to 60mph and down the 1/4.

Taken from MT's Z07 review

"Our associate road test editor claims our time could have been as low as 3.5 seconds if it weren't for gearing that places 60 mph right at the top of first. Shifting at 60 mph often involved bumping the rev-limiter before the 1-2 upshift, resulting in lower quarter-mile acceleration times. We opted to optimize quarter-mile runs at the expense of a slightly slower 0-60-mph sprint."

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/..._edition_test/

[fbodfather]

Did it ever occur to some..............












............that we did simulations on our OWN car prior to completing it?

[zero]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

Did it ever occur to some..............












............that we did simulations on our OWN car prior to completing it?

NEVARRRRRRR......We the internet forum folk are the experts in R&D
jk

I`m sure the ZL1 was bench marked by GM by a slightly modded 11 GT500

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by Truck Norris

I honestly dont see how Al O. could make these sort of publstatements after hearing that the 2013 GT500 can reach 62mph in first gear and only has to shift twice down the quarter mile.

Shifting costs a lot of time. Just look at the Z07's 0-60 time of only 3.8 seconds because its revised gearing requires shifting into 2nd gear giving it a slower time over the base even though it is lighter and has a lot better tires.

I could easily stand behind his statement if Ford didn't change the GT500's gearing but I just don't see the Z beating the GT500 being down 70-90hp, and having extra one extra shift to 60mph and down the 1/4.

Taken from MT's Z07 review

"Our associate road test editor claims our time could have been as low as 3.5 seconds if it weren't for gearing that places 60 mph right at the top of first. Shifting at 60 mph often involved bumping the rev-limiter before the 1-2 upshift, resulting in lower quarter-mile acceleration times. We opted to optimize quarter-mile runs at the expense of a slightly slower 0-60-mph sprint."

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/..._edition_test/

Gearing is one of the most straight forward metrics to simulate. I’m sure this was not overlooked.

If what Al O. is saying is true, the run will probably go something like this:

ZL1 has better traction from the start, gets a jump
ZL1 shifts, GT500 gains
ZL1 beats GT500 to 60 by a slim margin, posts better 0-60 time.
GT500 overtakes ZL1 after 60mph for a better ¼ mile time.

[ffrcobra_65]

The new GT500 will beat the ZL1 in a straight line race. Road course is where GM targeted to whoop the snake.

[Black GT]

Originally Posted by zero

I`m sure the ZL1 was bench marked by GM by a slightly modded 11 GT500

lightly modded, as in conservative street tune only?

[fbodfather]

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

The new GT500 will beat the ZL1 in a straight line race. Road course is where GM targeted to whoop the snake.

ah!

I see!


Now - where was that drag race held???

[Wondering]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

ah!

I see!


Now - where was that drag race held???

He "simulated" it...............

[fbodfather]

Originally Posted by Wondering

He "simulated" it...............

[radz28]

'father:

When can we expect full disclosure on everything in/on ZL1? I'm itching from the wait

[Brent Hinds]

Hi fbodfather, I just had a couple quick questions.

Originally Posted by fbodfather

something to think about..... Do you honestly think he'd be foolish enough to post something like he has if he didn't have reason to believe what he's posting?

Do you not think he has thought this through and understands that IF he's wrong he loses credibility?

Now that Mr. Oppenheiser has made a specific statement that he doesn't think the GT500 will be able to beat ZL1 0-60 based on simulation, should the GT500 end up being able to better the ZL1 time of 3.9, what do you foresee him stating in response?

It will be interesting to see what happens 0-60, especially now that there is some credibility riding on it. He obviously feels confident in the engineering simulations done to this point.

Originally Posted by fbodfather

I'm also trying to make people stop and thinkfor a moment. Al is a brilliant engineer - and I can tell you that he's well aware of the consequences if he's wrong.....

Can you share what Al would consider the consequences of being wrong?

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

ah!

I see!


Now - where was that drag race held???

Fbod, can you confirm that GM will back the warranties if ZL1 owners break something on the race track? That would be awesome for peace of mind of some future ZL1 owners here!