RiderGraphix - AVOID

[BLUEMARO]

Just refuse shipment, that way no return shipping charges. No proof of delivery so no charges to your credit card that can stick.

Originally Posted by ElManny

ugh man i feel like a idiot i want to cancel my order now but he shipped it yesterday

[Moonsault]

I have to say I think a lot of confidence would be restored and fears set aside if he just did the right thing and refunded my money...

[TheNetGarage]

At the risk of "getting involved", I feel the need to lend my expert opinion to the situation. I have nothing to do with either party, except to share this great forum with them both.

As someone who does thousands of vinyls a month in the NY Tri-state area, for big store windows, fashion showrooms, signage, etc. I will lend the following.

Knowing that the vendor uses Avery is great, but what series. There are many for multiple uses:

A9 is the only series that should go on a car. It is a 9 year vinyl (10 year on the white and black) and is made permanent solvent adhesive and is a CAST VINYL. This is very important, because it has less shrinkage, and can be made thinner than a "Calendered" Vinyl. The advantage is that it can conform to shapes easily, and is less likely to catch wax or get caught by your microfiber as you clean the car.

Here is more about vinyl types if you are interested:

http://www.signindustry.com/outdoor/...alendered.php3

With that said, if the vinyl is that series than it is the BEST money can buy....and it IS NOT CHEAP. It runs in excess of $15 - $25 a linear foot for an 18" wide roll of some materials, which will only do one side of the stripe. Plus there is the expenses of the machine and Transfer tape. For every foot of vinyl you use a foot of transfer tape. Then comes the time to weed the vinyl and the design and test fitting is grueling. After the vinyl gets cut, you need to peel away the part not being used WITHOUT damaging the useable part. There is a LOT of waste when cutting vinyl. You need a leader and an advance to cut the material. Material only comes in fixed widths, so much gets wasted, so it gets pricey. The prices people on here are charging are very good prices.

Now here is the part that is an issue. Selling a product that needs to get installed on the outside. The bubbles are not from cheap vinyl, but from installing dry usually. If the surface was properly prepped and a solution is used to "FLOAT" the vinyl, then when you position and squeegee the vinyl down, the solution comes out and the surface is bubble free. If it is installed dry, then what happens is pockets of air get caught when either side of the vinyl sets in place and the squeegee has no way of pushing the air out. At this point you can insert a pin and squeegee or hope the vinyl will set in the sun. It is 50/50 depending on the size of the bubbles. But if you have bubbles and leave the car in the sun for 24 hours, usually what is there after that point stays there.

As for the shape, this is the tricky part. I look at those photo's and it appears to be installed improperly. Here is why I say that. Vinyl is VERY stretchy. It appears as if he started at the top and worked from the outside toward the middle of the hood. On these stripes, you need to anchor the top inside and follow the center hoodline. If you do that and let the outside fall, the curve will fall naturally and it will appear perfectly straight. Who ever installed it did not follow the centerline.

I do however see one issue. If these are made from the factory stripe template, but just set out further apart, the Front Edge Angle needs to be adjusted to be less of a point. You can see in the picture where the angle is too sharp in front for the wider spacing.

I hope my UN-OBJECTIVE opinion helps people in making a further decision.

I am in the business of vinyl, but above that I am a Camaro lover and hate to see a fellow Camaro lover in such pain. If you were local to me, I would be happy to help you install a new set. The hood is a bitch to install because you are working so far away from your body and you need to work from the side so it is hard to see what you are doing. You have to make sure that the installer cuts the backing away from the top inside corner, lays it down (lined up) and then tapes the graphic down so it does not move as he peels the backing, sprays solution and begins application!

Good luck to you both!

It is up to each owns business sense as to what the right decision is.

[Dan3]

IF you placed an online order and didn't use a Credit Card, you my friend might be mildly retarded. If you did use a credit card, report it to the credit card company, they will refund your money and go get their money from the merchant themselves.

I do agree Moon sounds like an obnoxious and impatient prick, but I do believe the customer is always right. Give him his money back and let your work speak for itself, as we see there are other people who have ordered, let them decide on the quality of your work.

[2010SLVRBULIT]

Just have RGFX send you straight cut stripes as depicted on their website..end of story.

[TaylorRyanSS]

I am still going to order from you autoguy This issue seems rare and if your company was really that horrible and your products were horrible you probably wouldn't be in business anymore... so I will see for myself \

and bumblebees stripes aren't cut straight anyway they curve slightly

[buster6070]

Kinda 50/50 I think. If his installer screwed up the first set then that's his fault. And if he's willing to send the second set back then refund his money for one set and keep the money for the first set that was damaged by the installer. And the customer isn't always right, but sometimes you just give them their money back so they'll leave you alone. Good luck to both parties

[CGM2SSRS]

Moonsault,

Thank you for sharing your experience, and sorry to hear your nightmare. Please keep us informed on how this play's out. I hope you are able to reach a resolution.

[CGM2SSRS]

I hope everyone who has purchased from ridergraphix.com will chime in as to their experience.
I should have read the entire damn thread before posting.....
He said/ he said. Sounds to me like there is a little fault maybe both way's. As was already noted in here,sometimes it should be a tie goes to the runner,er buyer. One thing for certain those stripes look like a 36 hour straight Wyoming chicken ranch madam. Bowlegged. And just wrong.

[Xanthos]

Originally Posted by TheNetGarage

At the risk of "getting involved", I feel the need to lend my expert opinion to the situation. I have nothing to do with either party, except to share this great forum with them both.

As someone who does thousands of vinyls a month in the NY Tri-state area, for big store windows, fashion showrooms, signage, etc. I will lend the following.

Knowing that the vendor uses Avery is great, but what series. There are many for multiple uses:

A9 is the only series that should go on a car. It is a 9 year vinyl (10 year on the white and black) and is made permanent solvent adhesive and is a CAST VINYL. This is very important, because it has less shrinkage, and can be made thinner than a "Calendered" Vinyl. The advantage is that it can conform to shapes easily, and is less likely to catch wax or get caught by your microfiber as you clean the car.

Here is more about vinyl types if you are interested:

http://www.signindustry.com/outdoor/...alendered.php3

With that said, if the vinyl is that series than it is the BEST money can buy....and it IS NOT CHEAP. It runs in excess of $15 - $25 a linear foot for an 18" wide roll of some materials, which will only do one side of the stripe. Plus there is the expenses of the machine and Transfer tape. For every foot of vinyl you use a foot of transfer tape. Then comes the time to weed the vinyl and the design and test fitting is grueling. After the vinyl gets cut, you need to peel away the part not being used WITHOUT damaging the useable part. There is a LOT of waste when cutting vinyl. You need a leader and an advance to cut the material. Material only comes in fixed widths, so much gets wasted, so it gets pricey. The prices people on here are charging are very good prices.

Now here is the part that is an issue. Selling a product that needs to get installed on the outside. The bubbles are not from cheap vinyl, but from installing dry usually. If the surface was properly prepped and a solution is used to "FLOAT" the vinyl, then when you position and squeegee the vinyl down, the solution comes out and the surface is bubble free. If it is installed dry, then what happens is pockets of air get caught when either side of the vinyl sets in place and the squeegee has no way of pushing the air out. At this point you can insert a pin and squeegee or hope the vinyl will set in the sun. It is 50/50 depending on the size of the bubbles. But if you have bubbles and leave the car in the sun for 24 hours, usually what is there after that point stays there.

As for the shape, this is the tricky part. I look at those photo's and it appears to be installed improperly. Here is why I say that. Vinyl is VERY stretchy. It appears as if he started at the top and worked from the outside toward the middle of the hood. On these stripes, you need to anchor the top inside and follow the center hoodline. If you do that and let the outside fall, the curve will fall naturally and it will appear perfectly straight. Who ever installed it did not follow the centerline.

I do however see one issue. If these are made from the factory stripe template, but just set out further apart, the Front Edge Angle needs to be adjusted to be less of a point. You can see in the picture where the angle is too sharp in front for the wider spacing.

I hope my UN-OBJECTIVE opinion helps people in making a further decision.

I am in the business of vinyl, but above that I am a Camaro lover and hate to see a fellow Camaro lover in such pain. If you were local to me, I would be happy to help you install a new set. The hood is a bitch to install because you are working so far away from your body and you need to work from the side so it is hard to see what you are doing. You have to make sure that the installer cuts the backing away from the top inside corner, lays it down (lined up) and then tapes the graphic down so it does not move as he peels the backing, sprays solution and begins application!

Good luck to you both!

It is up to each owns business sense as to what the right decision is.

This is exactly what I was thinking when I saw it. I don't have experience with vinyl on cars, but I do have experience with painting and you get the same issue when you're taping off an area - the tape will stretch, so any straight lines must be done first.
- X

[ITZHIZZ]

Been in Customer Service over 40 years. Auto Body and Mechanical.
Have a track record of very satisfied Customers, except for the ones I fired because they were hostile, arrogant, or placed NO value on the product we were providing.
Threats, and public harrassment will also guarantee a firing.
The Customer is not always right. The Customer does deserve the benefit of the doubt.
If a Customer lies to me or my staff, or threatens us, they are done!
In the 40 years have only been to small claims court three times as the defendent. Won all three. One BBB complaint in the last 26 years. Offered arbitration, Customer would not accept unless they were guaranteed the outcome they demanded.
Most businesses do take their Customers seriously.

This issue is now in the "Court of Public Opinion".
So far we have some Flames and a Response.
Is there enough information for a Verdict?
Maybe everyone should be sworn in.
Perhaps we should start a Poll to decide.

Why is this thread even being allowed?
Seems to fit under the threatening criteria.
Don't give me the "trying to protect others" answer.
When the smokes clears, all I see are threats on top of more threats.

[AuburnEd]

Autoguy's product is getting slammed unfairly and here is the basis for my OPINION. I ordered graphix from him, read the instructions very carefully, and did my own installation with no problems and have a great looking finished product.

My good friend, r0cketdr, ordered three ridergraphix sets and opted to have them professionally installed. Big Trouble... total disaster. The pro agreed to stop before he ruined all three sets.

Fast forward a couple of days...replacement graphix purchased from Rider received. Professional installer with 20 years experience NOW on the job. He made installation look so very easy, fast and perfect. He commented that Avery vinyl is as good as you can get and was pleased that quality product was being used.

Moral of this story - There are professionals, and there are those who profess to be professionals. Sometimes you do not know which one you have until it is too late.

.

[1320junkie]

Originally Posted by autoguy

I haven't been sending it out and replacing it. I replaced the rear piece that I admitted needed to be changed. He purchased a second set of hood stripes because he told me himself he was not happy with the job the installer did. If I sent the wrong ones to him (which has not even been addressed yet), I am offering to send a replacement set of hood stripes. It is not a matter of the cost of the vinyl. I am merely trying to do the right thing and send him the right pieces if he claims they are wrong.

I offered to send these without even seeing or having the supposedly wrong ones sent back. What more needs to be done in order to avoid a public Lynching?

There needs to be a line between customer service and a customer recognizing who is in the wrong like Adam said above. It is all too easy for an installer to screw up and since they did not provide the kit, it is not their problem.

I am thinking the installer is the weak link...

[Moonsault]

Again, I can account for the ability of the installer. However, this is neither here nor there. As I mentioned, there is NO way these stripes could be applied to look like the implied graphic. It would make no difference if I did it personally, my installer did it, Mr Rider did it, or anybody on the face of this earth did it. My point is they do not install straight. Yes, there has to be a slight curve to the design to account for the contours of the hood. But there is NO way you can install them and have two perfectly parallel and equal width spaced stripes. Take a look at his graphic of the stripes and imagine how they will fit when laid onto the hood with the large central bulge - it is only going to amplify the outer curve of the stripe regardless.

We did discover there was a mistake with the spoiler stripe - it was too wide to correctly line up. So who is to say that the design of the hood stripe is not flawed which accounts for the over-curvature and the spacing? I am not trying to bash Mr Rider's technical design ability (as he is clearly very talented) but this is how it is.

I am just trying to get my money back and move on as this is stressing me out and is just piling upon my overall disappointment and frustration. I have further in the last several hours been called an impatient prick and slammed for even bringing this up. The truth is after waiting so long for this car I wanted it to be perfect. I hope others can sympathise with this. And I have spent $600+ on stripes, and then installation, and all I have is drama and stripes that aren't working out. Can you imagine how I feel?

I would just like to have a refund, close this door and move on, and as I have never once used derogative language against anybody else I would appreciate it if others would do the same. I do not relish being called an impatient prick thank you, and I am sure you would not either.