When Was The Last Time You Worked Out At The Gym

[CFD]

Originally Posted by Mydivorcegift

I didn't want you to take a quick look. I wanted you to actually read.....and from your comments it's obvious you didn't with comments like "It's breaking down the workouts to smaller muscle groups and using much lighter weight loads"...that had ZERO to do with the articles I posted. If you read that you would know.

Guess you have to be chalked up as one of those old dogs that can't be taught a new trick....

Again how do you take the general and make them the not general.

They are both similar but one of the articles breaks down the workouts in some cases to 2-3 exercises per workout with the lighter workouts at 50% max, and uses various grips to target the muscles differently, what didn't I read?

It's not that you can't teach an old dog new tricks, it's just the new tricks suck lol. Just kidding, I didn't say it was junk, I said if you follow it as prescribed it's fine, guess we'll chaulk it up to not understanding what you're reading. lol.

[Mydivorcegift]

Originally Posted by CFD

They are both similar but one of the articles breaks down the workouts in some cases to 2-3 exercises per workout with the lighter workouts at 50% max, and uses various grips to target the muscles differently, what didn't I read?

It's not that you can't teach an old dog new tricks, it's just the new tricks suck lol. Just kidding, I didn't say it was junk, I said if you follow it as prescribed it's fine, guess we'll chaulk it up to not understanding what you're reading. lol.

You didn't read...

"It's breaking down the workouts to smaller muscle groups and using much lighter weight loads".

The articles are about how to incorporate more training sessions than 4 times a week.....

And if you would have read just the first paragraph of the first article you would know it's about how you turn the general into the not general.

And you'd be a fool to call Westside training "junk"....

[Dznts]

Chest today

[CFD]

Originally Posted by Mydivorcegift

You didn't read...

"It's breaking down the workouts to smaller muscle groups and using much lighter weight loads".

The articles are about how to incorporate more training sessions than 4 times a week.....

And you'd be a fool to call Westside training "junk"....

There is a lot more to it than you are reading, There are many specialization programs that are similar to this and some that are much different and as I said I didn't say they were junk. They do not outline the exact details but you can easily see where they are going and the logic behind it. They do not directly work the same muscle groups with heavy loads two days in a row, they also vary grips, grip width's etc. in doing this, again you do not directly work the same muscle groups. For example, you can take the bench press, when done with correct form it is a chest exercise, use a close grip and you now made it an arm exercise, mainly triceps. so if you follow what they are referencing across the board they talk about varying these factors to target the muscle groups or the muscle fibers that have not been worked or underworked, this helps to eliminate the overtraining of particular muscles. They talk about on certain exercises on the "extra workouts" to use 50%-60% of the 1RM. Generally speaking, beginners make decent progress at these levels but intermediate and upward most gains are made at about 80% max which they use on the heavy days, lighter loads.

The other thing with these types of programs they are very hard for the average trainee to follow as he does not see where the work is needed as a result of muscle growth unless he is very dedicated and religiously records and measures because the mirror lies. This is evident when you see the majority of joe shmoes going in and out of the gym with no proportions to their physiques.

And still you did not get all of what I said, these guys are looking at muscle recovery. There is also the nervous system involved which is a whole different subject. If you look at writings and programs from guys like Charles Poloquin, considered to be one of if not the best coach in strength training they do not recommend training more than two days in a row for this reason. You cannot argue with his success stories.

There is a big difference in recommendations made here to those other than professional lifters or body builders who can devote the time and commitment to follow those types of programs and general rules of thumb and known to work techniques that I might suggest to fellow enthusiasts.

[Liltuffgirl]

So... Anyone know of a good stationary bike/recumbent bike for the home? I'd like to lift at work and cardio at home. Bike until I can run again.

[CFD]

Originally Posted by Liltuffgirl

So... Anyone know of a good stationary bike/recumbent bike for the home? I'd like to lift at work and cardio at home. Bike until I can run again.

There are many choices but I would think the intended purpose would be important, such as for simple cardio or for fat loss, muscle building or conditioning. If for general cardio any well built one would be fine but for any of the others mentioned you would want one with various degrees of adjustments and possibly one with pre written programs for HIIT or IT.

[Liltuffgirl]

I don't really need any programs. I've never used any of those I just adjust to what I feel I could do.
General cardio and rehab of my knee.

Looking at the ones on walmarty website there are a lot of crap reviews so in worried... It's not like it'll fit in the Camaro to go back lol

Also don't know of it makes a differance if I go recumbent bike or stationary bike.

[Mydivorcegift]

Originally Posted by CFD

There is a lot more to it than you are reading, There are many specialization programs that are similar to this and some that are much different and as I said I didn't say they were junk. They do not outline the exact details but you can easily see where they are going and the logic behind it. They do not directly work the same muscle groups with heavy loads two days in a row, they also vary grips, grip width's etc. in doing this, again you do not directly work the same muscle groups. For example, you can take the bench press, when done with correct form it is a chest exercise, use a close grip and you now made it an arm exercise, mainly triceps. so if you follow what they are referencing across the board they talk about varying these factors to target the muscle groups or the muscle fibers that have not been worked or underworked, this helps to eliminate the overtraining of particular muscles. They talk about on certain exercises on the "extra workouts" to use 50%-60% of the 1RM. Generally speaking, beginners make decent progress at these levels but intermediate and upward most gains are made at about 80% max which they use on the heavy days, lighter loads.

The other thing with these types of programs they are very hard for the average trainee to follow as he does not see where the work is needed as a result of muscle growth unless he is very dedicated and religiously records and measures because the mirror lies. This is evident when you see the majority of joe shmoes going in and out of the gym with no proportions to their physiques.

And still you did not get all of what I said, these guys are looking at muscle recovery. There is also the nervous system involved which is a whole different subject. If you look at writings and programs from guys like Charles Poloquin, considered to be one of if not the best coach in strength training they do not recommend training more than two days in a row for this reason. You cannot argue with his success stories.

There is a big difference in recommendations made here to those other than professional lifters or body builders who can devote the time and commitment to follow those types of programs and general rules of thumb and known to work techniques that I might suggest to fellow enthusiasts.

Funny with this post you have showed how much you could learn and how far back you are stuck in the stone age...

They train the same muscle group 2 days in a row...

I love what is highlighted in red...oh really? I'm natural and have over a 3x bw squat and over a 2x bw bench....raw...I use these principles (as well as people a lot stronger than me and professional teams and accomplished professional athletes)...I wonder where I fall? Beginner, intermediate, or upward...

And again the point was to show how you can NOT be "average"...

Funny you mention Charles Poliquin...

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Artic..._Training.aspx

Really read the articles...

If you want to (insert athletic description here) train more with short extra workouts...

[Mydivorcegift]

Originally Posted by Liltuffgirl

So... Anyone know of a good stationary bike/recumbent bike for the home? I'd like to lift at work and cardio at home. Bike until I can run again.

No but if it's going to be temporary I'd save the money and look on CL.

[Liltuffgirl]

Won't be temp ill use it a lot. Alternate between it and running. Well when I can run.

[CFD]

Originally Posted by Mydivorcegift

Funny with this post you have showed how much you could learn and how far back you are stuck in the stone age...

They train the same muscle group 2 days in a row...

I love what is highlighted in red...oh really? I'm natural and have over a 3x bw squat and over a 2x bw bench....raw...I use these principles (as well as people a lot stronger than me and professional teams and accomplished professional athletes)...I wonder where I fall? Beginner, intermediate, or upward...

And again the point was to show how you can NOT be "average"...

Funny you mention Charles Poliquin...

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Artic..._Training.aspx

Really read the articles...

If you want to (insert athletic description here) train more with short extra workouts...

I am not saying they don't work. Most well written programs do work. In fact, the most gains are made by using a variety of programs, but as was said at the beginning of all this is that for the program to produce good results it should be followed as closely as written and for the full duration without changes until completed.

Poloquin uses many different training methods and weight/rep ranges depending on the goal but if you read his as well as many other trainers writings you will see that they still follow the basics until a point where specialization is needed. Kind of like building a motor, there are certain things known to do that will produce similar results in most cases, once those basics are met you can expand on them.

As far as your level I have no idea, again I was talking as a general rule. It is well known that a combination of lighter loads higher reps and heavier loads lower reps bot work and work best when a combination of the two are used. You can't say that one works better than the other because they complement each other. You can lift for strength, as strength increases so does size, when size doesn't increase strength gains start to fall short. If you train for size you can only get so big before you need to push more weight or size gains fall short, so in short, you get bigger as you get stronger so you train for both to complement each other.

The programs you referred to practice this. On a side note, I didn't get into the details but the first one I think would cater more to sports orientated trainees but I'd have to put more time into reading it but maybe some other time. lol.

You will almost never hear me say a particular program or method of training won't work especially where what works for one may not for another. Your arguing an argument that's not there although there are plenty of self made guru's who's program is the best and all others are sub-par just like with fat loss, this diet or pill is the cat's meow and nothing else compares or those that cater to marketing more than results.

[Mydivorcegift]

Originally Posted by CFD

I am not saying they don't work. Most well written programs do work. In fact, the most gains are made by using a variety of programs, but as was said at the beginning of all this is that for the program to produce good results it should be followed as closely as written and for the full duration without changes until completed.

Poloquin uses many different training methods and weight/rep ranges depending on the goal but if you read his as well as many other trainers writings you will see that they still follow the basics until a point where specialization is needed. Kind of like building a motor, there are certain things known to do that will produce similar results in most cases, once those basics are met you can expand on them.

As far as your level I have no idea, again I was talking as a general rule. It is well known that a combination of lighter loads higher reps and heavier loads lower reps bot work and work best when a combination of the two are used. You can't say that one works better than the other because they complement each other. You can lift for strength, as strength increases so does size, when size doesn't increase strength gains start to fall short. If you train for size you can only get so big before you need to push more weight or size gains fall short, so in short, you get bigger as you get stronger so you train for both to complement each other.

The programs you referred to practice this. On a side note, I didn't get into the details but the first one I think would cater more to sports orientated trainees but I'd have to put more time into reading it but maybe some other time. lol.

You will almost never hear me say a particular program or method of training won't work especially where what works for one may not for another. Your arguing an argument that's not there although there are plenty of self made guru's who's program is the best and all others are sub-par just like with fat loss, this diet or pill is the cat's meow and nothing else compares or those that cater to marketing more than results.

In the time it took you to write all of these dissertations you could have read the articles and learned something.

And I really, really hope you aren't referring to Louis Simmons as "self made guru's who's program is the best and all others are sub-par just like with fat loss, this diet or pill is the cat's meow and nothing else compares or those that cater to marketing more than results." While self made his programs for sure do not cater to marketing.....

[fig88]

just lift heavy things up and put them down

[CFD]

Originally Posted by Mydivorcegift

In the time it took you to write all of these dissertations you could have read the articles and learned something.

And I really, really hope you aren't referring to Louis Simmons as "self made guru's who's program is the best and all others are sub-par just like with fat loss, this diet or pill is the cat's meow and nothing else compares or those that cater to marketing more than results." While self made his programs for sure do not cater to marketing.....

I'm not sure why you are being so defensive. I wasn't referring to anyone in particular especially anyone who's programs I've not read thoroughly and I'm not sure why you are so insistent that I read the programs you posted in depth either. I am very familiar with many programs outside of the classic 3-day or 4-day splits that you usually see me suggest for those getting into it as they are IMHO the best place to start. There are hundreds upon hundreds of programs that will provide great gains, there are some that require more training than the ones you mentioned, one that comes to mind would be Vince Giranda's 8 sets of 8 that train heavy 6 days a week, it's a well constructed program but it does not work the same muscle groups 2 days in a row as most don't because of the over training reason's I mentioned.

For some reason you are also trying to have me learn something I already know. I'm in no way putting down the programs or the designers of those programs but they are not for those just getting into it and not for those who are looking for fat loss as well

If you need to know the type of self made guru's I was referring to one that comes to mind who seems to be popping up every where is the founder of a new company called bio-trust, specifically Joel Marion. If you read his stuff and claims you will see what I am referring to.

One thing I have learned in my old age is this