2014 Camaro Z/28 pricing announced at $75,000

[the_fast_one]

Originally Posted by Blueclyde

Do some research on the LS7. It is well documented. It's hand built and therefore low volume.



When the Z/28 is complete and fully released the performance figures will speak for themselves. The comparisons will come once they are further along and I'm sure the gaps between the ZL1 will widen.

There were 30,548 z06 and 427 verts produced for the C6. Over 6k during the 2006 MY
so its not that low of volume engine. Anybody that ordered a z06 received one and also the 427 vert, no restriction on how many were built. Also liked to drop valves and chew up the motor.

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by FISHTAIL

I remember paying 22k for my brand new 1992 25th Anniversary Z28. The good old days!

I remember paying $12500 for my brand new 1985 Z28, those were the good ol' days Winning!

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by AZCamaroFan

the Z/28 is built for the track.

the ZL1 is built for roads.

[OldScoolCamaro]

Originally Posted by G-Oil Guy

How did they get the ZL1 and the Z/28 "ass backwards" please?

...they snookerd a handfull of dealerships the all aluminum ZL1 427 big block, R&D cost for the motor included to the few that ordered them. The motors were almost 7K alone back in the day, mass exodus occurred and an order bailout happened. No one knew about it. IT was the over the top price ride....drag race only mind you. Study your history. The Z/28 was more pedestrian and accessible. They sold the crap out of them in '69.

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by OldScoolCamaro

...they snookerd a handfull of dealerships the all aluminum ZL1 427 big block, R&D cost for the motor included to the few that ordered them. The motors were almost 7K alone back in the day, mass exodus occurred and an order bailout happened. No one knew about it. IT was the over the top price ride....drag race only mind you. Study your history. The Z/28 was more pedestrian and accessible. They sold the crap out of them in '69.

Don't forget all the clones made over the years At least with the 5th Gen ZL1, it will be a lot harder to do with the MR suspension.

[Todd in Vancouver]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Agree that officially this will be the fastest "factory" Camaro, according to the order sheet anyway.

But, will it be the fastest Camaro that can be purchased directly from GM? Well, if somebody puts both cars on the same rubber and Z28 beats the ZL1 fair and square, I will admit: it is the fastest factory Camaro. But not until then.

All the track comparisons between the 2 cars (Milford 2.87 seconds, Nurburgring est 10 seconds) have been heralded loudly, except for one important point: the tires.
In effect, ZL1 brought a knife to a gun fight. Tires are always a key factor at any track "game" and even in pro racing, there is a level playing field. But not here, unfortunately.

The "factory" makes the car, but they don't make the tires. Plus the tires are "consumables" especially on a track car. Besides I am sure a GM dealer will be delighted to take my money and sell me Z28 rims with Pirellis on them. I would expect the same response for those nice Recaro seats.

So technically, I could purchase a ZL1 (possible for $48,250, as a friend just got one), add the rims (est $6,000?) plus the seats (est $2,000?) and have the (possibly)fastest Camaro, directly from GM for $56,250. But let's round it up to $60,000 to be certain I am not sand-bagging my own expectations. As a value added bonus, we have gained some weight reductions: let's assume 100lb all in, which will make it even faster. Plus I still have an AC and stereo, fog lamps and other bits that got deleted from the Z28.

These simple and readily available enhancements could make the ZL1 if not actually faster, then likely as fast as the Z28 on a road course, straight from a GM dealership. And of course I am saving at least $15,000 (more if I shop aftermarket). This would also include already having a spare set of (original) rims and street tires to store the car on in winter (a necessity for any future Z28 owner living in a 4 seasons climate). Chock the savings up by another 2 or 3 grand minimum. Hence the current offer makes no sense to me.

Totally agree with you on the comparison and that the tires need to be the same for a fair race. But, they've made this the flagship Camaro so I really don't believe they will have engineered the Z28 slower than the ZL. I am also bias as I have a ZL but remember the Z28 track day was also wet so that beast is probably good for another 3-4 seconds off that time yet. You still don't have the CF brakes, extra ground effects, dry sump. When all is said and done you are going to be knocking on that $75K door. And don't forget a hand built 427 that has got to be in the $15K range.

Originally Posted by james347

Minus A/C, Navigation, Insulation, HID headlights and fog lights.

Well you do get One Speaker and a K&N air filter.

Yep. A real bargain.

Get a ZL1 or 1LE.

Maybe not a bargain but it would be really tough to duplicate all the features of this car for that price. Yes you are right if we look at the history of the Z28 the current 1LE is probably really close to what the Z28 traditionally has been. But at the end of the day the 1LE is an awesome, affordable, track able car. Let the Z28 be the super track hero we want to have to kick the competitions butt.

Originally Posted by EnlighteningYou

The z/28 doesn't have magnetic suspension either, something that was touted as the best most advanced suspension on earth, why doesn't the Z/28 have it? Is the Z/28's non magnetic suspension better?

In a simple answer NO. The ZL1 and the mag. suspension is good for ALL uses of the car. Yes the Z28 suspension may out do the ZL1's suspension at the track only, then it can rattle every filling you have loose every time you drive over the painted lines on the street. The Mag ride and PTM system is leading edge for all manufacturers because it can do anything, anywhere. I can drive my car everyday and enjoy a comfortable ride then change the PTM mode and go to the track and be more than competitive. It's about being able to do everything and the Z28 is only concerned with one thing. Track days.



Also, don't forget with the new Mustang now having IRS that GM maybe wanted to make sure they had something in the lineup that will hold the track car crown and not let Ford have it.

[the_fast_one]

Originally Posted by OldScoolCamaro

...they snookerd a handfull of dealerships the all aluminum ZL1 427 big block, R&D cost for the motor included to the few that ordered them. The motors were almost 7K alone back in the day, mass exodus occurred and an order bailout happened. No one knew about it. IT was the over the top price ride....drag race only mind you. Study your history. The Z/28 was more pedestrian and accessible. They sold the crap out of them in '69.

I think that was his point. ZL1 should be the new z/28 price, rarity, and all that and the ZL1 should have been the Z/28. Mind you not a strictly drag car but you get the idea.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by Bad@ssCamaro

I remember paying $12500 for my brand new 1985 Z28, those were the good ol' days Winning!

Again the good old days...,

LG4 Z28

The LG4 engine that came in the 1985 Z28 was a 5.0-liter, 305-cubic-inch V-8. This engine had a compression ratio of 9.5-to- 1.This engine produced 155 hp at 4,200 rpm and 245 foot-pounds of torque at 2,000 rpm. This particular Z28 came in both a manual and automatic transmission to put the power of the engine to the ground.

LB9 Z28

The LB9 engine that came in the 1985 Z28 also was a 5.0-liter, 305-cubic-inch V-8 with a 9.5-to-1 compression ratio. This engine produced 215 hp at 4,400 rpm and 275 foot-pounds of torque at 3,200 rpm. This Z28 only came with an automatic transmission.

Iroc-Z28

The Iroc-Z came in three different engine options. The first option was almost exactly the same as the LG4 Z28; the only difference was that it had 3.23 rear end gears in the automatic version of the car rather than the 3.08s that were in the Z28. The next option was an L69 5.0-liter, 305-cubic-inch V-8 engine. This Iroc had 190 hp at 4,800rpm and 240 hp at 3,200 rpm. This was the only Iroc to come in only a manual transmission in 1985. The third option for the Iroc-Z was the LB9 Z28 engine.

[OldScoolCamaro]

....Norwood, X33, fogy memory...white book, I used to quote the Chevy bible on that stuff, my memory grows weaker by the day...true though, know your numbers, get involved, do the research, be a Chevy Z/28 disciple.

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Again the good old days...,

I had the LG4, manual are you sure about the 155 Horsepower? I could've sworn I had the 215 HP version

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by Bad@ssCamaro

I had the LG4, manual are you sure about the 155 Horsepower? I could've sworn I had the 215 HP version

From this website: http://www.iroczone.com/2009/10/1985...pecifications/

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Bad@ssCamaro

Sounds like you're contradicting yourself. First you mention the "fastest factory Camaro" then you're talking about buying a used ZL1, buying tires from a dealer (not from the Factory) and adding the Recaro seats (which have no impact on performance - other than how it holds you in when you're doing 1.08 g's) This kind of argument has been made before by plenty of ZL1 owners, mostly because their car is no longer "Top Dog" of the Camaro's(when it comes to the road course).

The only reason GM made a comparison to the ZL1 was to show how much more focused it is when it came to the twisties. The ZL1 is king in the department of overall capabilities, there is no denying that. But you insist on bringing up this issue with the tires, and yes, according to some people it might improve some of it's time on the Z/28, for a lap or two, but what happens when heat soak sets in, you didn't mention that? The Z/28 will be the master of the road course....for the Camaro Just wait until spring when all the magazine reviewers get a hold of one and then you'll know what the rest of us already know.

Who said I was taking about a USED ZL1?! I meant brand new ZL1. I purposly indicated I could get the rims, tires, seats from GM dealer, so technically the car came from GM. But yes, I could go to CCW for rims, Tirerack for tires and Recaro for seats and save some $. All these would result in weight savings hence better performance and likely the seats the most. BTW What heat sink are you refering to? Brakes?
Z06 motor is nothing "exotic". Yes it is hand built, so what? Yes it needs a dry sump. Speak to z06 owners whose engines went "boom" when tracking the car.
Any why less power when ZL1 has the best motor GM has produced ?
Anyhow, you seem to believe that the car will somehow sprout extra capabilities from what has been shown already. I do hope so, as at the current level I don't think its performance is that impressive at all. Exotic - yes. Performance - no.

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

From this website: http://www.iroczone.com/2009/10/1985...pecifications/

Thanks for the link, The car that I purchased was a "brass hat", like the CTF cars today. Maybe they snuck in the L69 motor , because I don't remember my car being that anemic...I had a friend who had a 5.0 at the time...that would explain why he would always pull away on me.

[gto406]

Originally Posted by 2cnd chance

I'm reading this post differently from your first post. This post above relates to the ZL1 for drag racing, correct. The Double-COPO would have been a track performer. The 69' ZL1 engine weighed close to the same as a DZ. The ZL1 was made for track cars hence it being a "Can Am" engine. You would have had the choice of rear-end ratios per track configuration. This 2014 Z/28 relates perfectly to the Double-COPO.

My original statement " I don't think GM ever viewed the ZL1 to be a corner bender, it was to be an all-out street/strip car during the 'muscle-car wars'." should likely have read:

"I don't think GM ever viewed the original 1969 ZL1 to be a corner bender, it was to be an all-out street/strip car during the 'muscle-car wars' of the late 1960's and the early 1970's."

I would check around some of the muscle-car sites on the original ZL1. While the 1969 ZL1 had the F41 heavy-duty suspension, their intended purpose was for NHRA drag racing. Indeed, I would say that the 69 ZL1's that were built likely ended up in the hands of drag-racers (e.g. guys like Bill 'Grumpy' Jenkins).

It is possible some of them ended up in road-race applications, but likely would have required a rear-axle ratio change.

I would also note the 1969 Z-28 had the JL8 option which enabled someone to order a 1969 Z-28 with 4-wheel disc brakes. I am not certain how many ZL1's had this option (or whether you could even order it on the ZL1).

Cheers,
Brian.