2014 Camaro Z/28 pricing announced at $75,000

[LostPony]

I go back and forth on whether I think the price is fair or not. On the one hand I see that it's only a few grand more than a loaded GT500. Then I think, but the GT500 is LOADED and the Z/28 is stripped.

Then I think about how much better the car is on a road course, my favorite thing. Then I think that if I did get a GT500 I could do quite well with a spring change, and a brake fluid flush and pad change, and would only be getting the PP and TP in the GT500 thus lowering initial cost.

Then I think about what else is out there for less money but a little more livable day to day. A used C6 Z06 would fit the bill. So would a number of Porsches. Then I remember that you can find used GT3s for up to $20k less.

If I think about it too much my head starts to hurt. I don't know if it's worth it, and since I can't afford one I really don't care. I like that they built it and I just hope to see one come to Summit Point. As the head of the HPDE program, I'll just have to drive it to make sure it's safe for the student!

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Yet the key parts are "bolt ons" not brand new components requiring tons of r+d, design, enngineering and testing. Case in point: the z06 engine, 3rd party suspension, 3rd party brakes, etc. Indeed it has to be tested as a package, but it is not even close to say developing a new motor. I don't dispute that the z28 has a lot of new (to Camaro) parts, but they are not necessarily "new".
I think it is misleading to suggest the car's price is high because of "testing". It is high because it is a limited production car with a limited target clientele. At this level it wouldn't matter if it cost 85Gs. I am sure GM would find 1000-1500 folks with fat wallets.

If a shock goes south, who's to "blame"?

If a brake caliper or disc has an issue, who's to "blame"?

That totals 12 of the 200+ new parts.

Who's durability testing, with warranty costs on the line, will be more rigorous? And who's "word" on the overall suitability and durability of these 200+ parts do YOU expect/want/DEMAND?

And how many parts did they research/spec/fit/test/refit/test...to get to the final now-OEM-spec'd parts?

Two years and how many engineering man-hours, spread over how few cars $well$ that "tried, tested and true" slogan stolen from elsewhere...

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by 72MachOne99GT

*puts hand on shoulder*

That looked like it hurt.

Time-limited offer, no deposit-no return, void where prohibited, age of majority required, pill-excluded prescriptions allowed, see your doctor if the swelling persists...

FDIC-guaranteed, FDA-approved...

[Angrybird 12]

As they say in the collector car world, "It's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it."
The actual buyers will be the ones to ultimately determine if the Z/28 is actually worth $75,000 or more.

[Iron Lung Jimmy]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

As they say in the collector car world, "It's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it."
The actual buyers will be the ones to ultimately determine if the Z/28 is actually worth $75,000 or more.

Bingo.

This whole thread is essentially 37 pages of nonsense.

GM can price a car at whatever it wants but the market ultimately determines what it is actually worth.

If GM had announced a $60K price for the Z/28, Camaro5 would be doing back flips of joy... only to be bitterly disappointed when no Z/28 could actually be purchased at that price due to demad swamping supply.

At $75K we have nonsensical whining about "value". If the market agrees, Z/28's will sit unsold and the price will drop. If it drops to a point to where it is now worth it to any given individual, guess what, he can buy one. If it does not, then his value assessment did not agree with the market.

Free market capitalism... a beautiful thing.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

If a shock goes south, who's to "blame"?

If a brake caliper or disc has an issue, who's to "blame"?

That totals 12 of the 200+ new parts.

Who's durability testing, with warranty costs on the line, will be more rigorous? And who's "word" on the overall suitability and durability of these 200+ parts do YOU expect/want/DEMAND?

And how many parts did they research/spec/fit/test/refit/test...to get to the final now-OEM-spec'd parts?

Two years and how many engineering man-hours, spread over how few cars $well$ that "tried, tested and true" slogan stolen from elsewhere...

Two years?! It took GM two years to plunk in an old motor, outsource suspension, brakes, seats, wheels and tires? Wow!
But seriously, get ANY car, no matter the price, beat on it at the track and things will break. Nobody to blame here, as even with F1 budgets things do break there too. Just a nature of the beast. So nobody to "blame" but sinply go back to the dealer and if the part is under warranty: get a new one. Now about those ZL1 motors losing power due to heat soak...somebody ought to be blamed for that for sure.

[ShmRocc]

Saw dealership pricing for only 3k over MSRP in NJ

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Two years?! It took GM two years to plunk in an old motor, outsource suspension, brakes, seats, wheels and tires? Wow!
But seriously, get ANY car, no matter the price, beat on it at the track and things will break. Nobody to blame here, as even with F1 budgets things do break there too. Just a nature of the beast. So nobody to "blame" but sinply go back to the dealer and if the part is under warranty: get a new one.

it's all so simple, right?!

Program green-lit summer '11, and it's now....

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy

Bingo.

This whole thread is essentially 37 pages of nonsense.

GM can price a car at whatever it wants but the market ultimately determines what it is actually worth.

If GM had announced a $60K price for the Z/28, Camaro5 would be doing back flips of joy... only to be bitterly disappointed when no Z/28 could actually be purchased at that price due to demad swamping supply.

At $75K we have nonsensical whining about "value". If the market agrees, Z/28's will sit unsold and the price will drop. If it drops to a point to where it is now worth it to any given individual, guess what, he can buy one. If it does not, then his value assessment did not agree with the market.

Free market capitalism... a beautiful thing.

And that is the bottom line! Now if GM named this car something else, I don't think folks would have such negative response to the price. But a Z28 was never priced so much higher than a Vette. It was a "working man's" Vette.
Now it is priced at z06 level! But totally agree, all these opinions mean nothing as the market will determine the success here. And this sucks, as the market has been limited to 1500-2000 copies. I suspect every one will sell. Maybe even at premiums. But all of us who remember a z28 as a different animal and who stuck by GM waiting for one will remain pissed off, or maybe even change brands. Time will tell.

[Iron Lung Jimmy]

I don't get the "pissed off" part.

I wanted one, too. And $75K is too much for me as well. But I'm not pissed off. It just is what it is... nothing more, nothing less.

As a Camaro owner from way back I'm just happy as hell they made this car as it elevates the status of all Camaros and if they can get $75K for it more power to them.

[TrackClub]

Imagine if Ford priced its new GT (which they claim is going to be MORE track capable than the outgoing Boss LS - this will make things very interesting BTW - check Laguna Seca's lap times) at 35% premium and limited its production to 2000 units. Or priced its new LS replacement (GT350?) At 75Gs. I would suspect folks on this forum would have a very different reaction to such decisions. I suspect many would say that Ford fell on its head. I don't get everybody saying:

"I am so glad GM produced a car that's not for me".

What type of nonsense is this? Whom have they produced this car for then if not the enthusiasts who once owned them? And why are so many folks "glad" it is not for them? It makes no sense to me. Anyhow, G6 cars are not that far off into the future...

[Zfatuated]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Imagine if Ford priced its new GT (which they claim is going to be MORE track capable than the outgoing Boss LS - this will make things very interesting BTW - check Laguna Seca's lap times) at 35% premium and limited its production to 2000 units. Or priced its new LS replacement (GT350?) At 75Gs. I would suspect folks on this forum would have a very different reaction to such decisions. I suspect many would say that Ford fell on its head. I don't get everybody saying:

"I am so glad GM produced a car that's not for me".

What type of nonsense is this? Whom have they produced this car for then if not the enthusiasts who once owned them? And why are so many folks "glad" it is not for them? It makes no sense to me. Anyhow, G6 cars are not that far off into the future...

You sure spend a lot of time talking about a car you can't afford and are not interested in. What type of nonsense is that? In fact, your obsession with twisting facts and stirring dissension mirrors that of someone who was banned here a while back.

Hmmmmm

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Imagine if Ford priced its new GT (which they claim is going to be MORE track capable than the outgoing Boss LS - this will make things very interesting BTW - check Laguna Seca's lap times) at 35% premium and limited its production to 2000 units. Or priced its new LS replacement (GT350?) At 75Gs. I would suspect folks on this forum would have a very different reaction to such decisions. I suspect many would say that Ford fell on its head. I don't get everybody saying:

"I am so glad GM produced a car that's not for me".

What type of nonsense is this? Whom have they produced this car for then if not the enthusiasts who once owned them? And why are so many folks "glad" it is not for them? It makes no sense to me. Anyhow, G6 cars are not that far off into the future...

First of all, and this is a KEY point, "they" did NOT say "BOSS LS"...Dave said "BOSS". And where's the data to back the rhetoric, which this not-ready-for-prime-time launch has been full of...? They also said 200-300 lbs, but fail to release a HINT of Curb Weight specs on ANY version to ANYONE. Why?

KEY point is, every time a Ford fan, and employee, talks PRICE it's the BOSS, and when they talk performance metrics vs. "competition" (but NOT against themselves!) it's the BOSS LS. Why?

Because THAT answers the same question you keep repeating in thinly disguised format, time-after-time.

Ford built TWO BOSSES...one for VOLUME, and therefore the price leader, named BOSS (NO GM engine suffix!) and the other named BOSS LS which, built in numbers pretty equal to what we'll actually see for the Z/28, is the ONLY one that Ford authorized for track-testing. And it was "handled by the le$$-than-BOSS (NO suffix) 1LE.

Without the Hertz Rental-version BOSS (NO suffix) to counter development costs of the 444 hp BOSS engine, what might the ACTUAL selling price of those roughly-1500-only BOSS LS (WITH suffix) be? $55,000? $60,000?

Go ask Dave...and quote him CORRECTLY...

BTW, I find it charming that FORD would sell a halo Mustang with a GM ENGINE FAMILY designation on it...kinda like a Camaro with a "Coyote" badge...NOT!

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Zfatuated

You sure spend a lot of time talking about a car you can't afford and are not interested in. What type of nonsense is that? In fact, your obsession with twisting facts and stirring dissension mirrors that of someone who was banned here a while back.

Hmmmmm

Nobody that reads this forum has to agree with my opinions (yet some do).
Just like I don't have to agree with opinions of others and should be able to respond with mine. That's what forums are about. I have learnt a few things along the way and hope that others do as well. I don't pofess to be always right and stand corrected when I am not.
But if the forum folks feel that my posts are inappropriate, I will be happy to exit the scene, albeit wasn't aware that having to sing "z28 kumbaya" was a requirement to participate. Do me a favour, ask the forum guys to review my posts and decide. I will be happy to follow their direction. Thanks!