ABS/PTM Engineer Comments - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Zfatuated · 03-05-2014, 10:40 AM

A fine gentleman (the engineer in the Flying Car Mode video) who did the work on the Z/28 ABS and PTM integration made comments on another forum. I'll excerpt:

"As for ABS and PTM, that's my wheelhouse! I did all the integration of the "nannies" as everyone likes to call them for this car. The ABS system in this car is almost bulletproof on the track. You can pound the pedal lap after lap and you'll be able to brake all the way to the apex. Any concerns of "ice mode" will not be in the back of your mind like it may have been in the GT3. PTM Mode 5 is setup to get the quickest lap time out of the car. It won't come in and take much power away from the car on corner exit, so you have to be careful. It'll let you have the smallest of slides without having to back out of the throttle, but if you get too crossed up it won't come in to save you. It is 100% race track traction control in the concept of lowest laptime (mode 5 specifically). All the work I did was for the Pirellis so I'm not sure what exactly will happen if you slap Hoosiers on the car. I can guess at the performance but without doing that exact comparison I can't tell you for sure.

(GM social media disclaimer: I am a GM employee and my opinions represent my own and not that of my employer) There that's out of the way. "

"There is a bead redemption (retention? I think he meant) modification to keep the tire from rotating on the rim. The TPMS do display on the dash, so you can keep an eye on them. I would target 32 hot and not let them go above 35. Between there seems to be the sweet spot.

We spent a lot of time tuning the ABS to work on the track, so with this car you can trailbrake ALL THE WAY to the apex. The controller modifies the brakes pressures at the wheel to give the car the slightest hint of understeer so that you can confidently brake all the way thru the entry phase of the corner. "

Interesting tidbits for those of us who understand the significance and appreciate this attention to detail. Also evident here is that a (racing/track/high-performance) car's entire setup and software programming is engineered around a specific tire.

Once again, GM earns my respect for 1. allowing employees to publicly comment, 2. Sweating the smallest details to make the car the best it can be for its mission in life.

To have the engineers behind the car put forward publicly in corp media and allow them as well to talk freely in forums is HUGELY admirable in my world. This Z/28 project and marketing is simply remarkable in its concept and execution. Well done GM, well fricken done!

Those five hundred 2014 cars are very special now and will be hugely desirable in a few years.

Mikebrinda · 03-05-2014, 11:37 AM

There has to have been a major culture shift inside GM for an engineer to feel free to speak directly to consumers, rather than through a marketing mouthpiece that might know as much about the technical details of the product as I know about modern art (that would be zero.)

URBAN LEGEND · 03-05-2014, 12:13 PM

Interesting information.

The Stig · 03-05-2014, 12:55 PM

link to the forum thread where he posted these comments?

Zfatuated · 03-05-2014, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Stig

link to the forum thread where he posted these comments?

PM'd

PS- thanks to the Mod that bolded my quotes, I should have done that for full clarification

Dropspeed · 03-05-2014, 01:25 PM

He is relatively new to GM as he was at a Tier 1 previously...

Hopefully he was coached on what he can and cannot disclose.

backtotintops · 03-05-2014, 05:45 PM

great find zfat...can you turn traction control on and off while driving or do you have to be stopped? I'm still amazed they used it for the 7:37 ring video...I understand it might be useful in the last minute of rain but I thought having it totally off would always be faster and yes reduce the margin for error but always faster...maybe there is a dry run in the 20's already?...they just want to wait to put it out as the first cars are doing the press runs in a month? So is mode5 better than off?

Zfatuated · 03-05-2014, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backtotintops

great find zfat...can you turn traction control on and off while driving or do you have to be stopped? I'm still amazed they used it for the 7:37 ring video...I understand it might be useful in the last minute of rain but I thought having it totally off would always be faster and yes reduce the margin for error but always faster...maybe there is a dry run in the 20's already?...they just want to wait to put it out as the first cars are doing the press runs in a month? So is mode5 better than off?

I'm sure it is on-the-fly mode adjustable. Keep in mind that the reason traction control systems are not legal in F1 (for example) is the benefit and advantage they give. A human brain and foot can't compete with a well designed and coded TC system.

Modern stability management and TC systems work very, very well. When you ask is mode 5 better than off, well that depends on the driver and the situation. If you want to hoon and spin donuts in the parking lot then "off" is the choice. If you are a skilled driver on track and looking for fastest lap times (when more than a touch of slip angle will be slower) then 5 would be the choice. If you are on the street in the rain then 1 might be good.

Smooth is fast. Consistent is fast. TC helps with both.

camaro2lt · 03-05-2014, 09:54 PM

Can you pm me, I would like to know what forum this was on

Jim968 · 03-07-2014, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camaro2lt

Can you pm me, I would like to know what forum this was on

Rennlist.

backtotintops · 03-07-2014, 03:42 PM

thanks zfat but what's the big secret...I did not see it on rennlist can you just post the link please.

Zfatuated · 03-07-2014, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backtotintops

thanks zfat but what's the big secret...I did not see it on rennlist can you just post the link please.

No secret at all simply meant to respect this forum. I just linked it in the original post. Mods can remove if desired.

03-05-2014, 10:40 AM	#1
Zfatuated Drives: BAC Mono Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Reno Posts: 869	ABS/PTM Engineer Comments A fine gentleman (the engineer in the Flying Car Mode video) who did the work on the Z/28 ABS and PTM integration made comments on another forum. I'll excerpt: "As for ABS and PTM, that's my wheelhouse! I did all the integration of the "nannies" as everyone likes to call them for this car. The ABS system in this car is almost bulletproof on the track. You can pound the pedal lap after lap and you'll be able to brake all the way to the apex. Any concerns of "ice mode" will not be in the back of your mind like it may have been in the GT3. PTM Mode 5 is setup to get the quickest lap time out of the car. It won't come in and take much power away from the car on corner exit, so you have to be careful. It'll let you have the smallest of slides without having to back out of the throttle, but if you get too crossed up it won't come in to save you. It is 100% race track traction control in the concept of lowest laptime (mode 5 specifically). All the work I did was for the Pirellis so I'm not sure what exactly will happen if you slap Hoosiers on the car. I can guess at the performance but without doing that exact comparison I can't tell you for sure. (GM social media disclaimer: I am a GM employee and my opinions represent my own and not that of my employer) There that's out of the way. " "There is a bead redemption (retention? I think he meant) modification to keep the tire from rotating on the rim. The TPMS do display on the dash, so you can keep an eye on them. I would target 32 hot and not let them go above 35. Between there seems to be the sweet spot. We spent a lot of time tuning the ABS to work on the track, so with this car you can trailbrake ALL THE WAY to the apex. The controller modifies the brakes pressures at the wheel to give the car the slightest hint of understeer so that you can confidently brake all the way thru the entry phase of the corner. " Interesting tidbits for those of us who understand the significance and appreciate this attention to detail. Also evident here is that a (racing/track/high-performance) car's entire setup and software programming is engineered around a specific tire. Once again, GM earns my respect for 1. allowing employees to publicly comment, 2. Sweating the smallest details to make the car the best it can be for its mission in life. To have the engineers behind the car put forward publicly in corp media and allow them as well to talk freely in forums is HUGELY admirable in my world. This Z/28 project and marketing is simply remarkable in its concept and execution. Well done GM, well fricken done! Those five hundred 2014 cars are very special now and will be hugely desirable in a few years. __________________ 2014 Z/28, White "I wasn't asked to make it cheap...I was asked to make it FAST!" Mark Stielow, the new Z/28. Last edited by Zfatuated; 03-07-2014 at 05:09 PM.

03-05-2014, 12:13 PM	#3
URBAN LEGEND Drives: 20 X3M CP & 19 ZL1 1LE A10 Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Brenham, TX Posts: 3,517	Interesting information. __________________ 🔺22 RS E TRON GT 🔺21 Model S Plaid

03-05-2014, 12:55 PM	#4
The Stig knows 2 facts about ducks Drives: ...and they're both wrong Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The HMS Invincible Posts: 25,072 View My Garage	link to the forum thread where he posted these comments? __________________

03-05-2014, 01:25 PM	#6
Dropspeed 2013 Camaro SS1LECTSVZ28 Drives: 2013 AGM 1SS/1LE Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Suburbs of Detroit, MI Posts: 2,440	He is relatively new to GM as he was at a Tier 1 previously... Hopefully he was coached on what he can and cannot disclose. __________________ My 1LE Build/Journal : http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=351990

03-05-2014, 11:37 AM	#2
Mikebrinda Drives: Ferrari F430 Spider F1 Azzurro Arge Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Irvine Posts: 858 View My Garage	There has to have been a major culture shift inside GM for an engineer to feel free to speak directly to consumers, rather than through a marketing mouthpiece that might know as much about the technical details of the product as I know about modern art (that would be zero.)

03-05-2014, 05:45 PM	#7
backtotintops Drives: 14 Z/28 0# Join Date: May 2013 Location: NY Posts: 773	great find zfat...can you turn traction control on and off while driving or do you have to be stopped? I'm still amazed they used it for the 7:37 ring video...I understand it might be useful in the last minute of rain but I thought having it totally off would always be faster and yes reduce the margin for error but always faster...maybe there is a dry run in the 20's already?...they just want to wait to put it out as the first cars are doing the press runs in a month? So is mode5 better than off?

03-05-2014, 09:54 PM	#9
camaro2lt Drives: 2010 Camaro 2LT VR/RS CGM Rally's Join Date: May 2009 Location: Palmyra, PA Posts: 5,675 View My Garage	Can you pm me, I would like to know what forum this was on

03-07-2014, 03:42 PM	#11
backtotintops Drives: 14 Z/28 0# Join Date: May 2013 Location: NY Posts: 773	thanks zfat but what's the big secret...I did not see it on rennlist can you just post the link please.