GM fined 35 million

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by Sweet Zness

Are you really trying to say that anyone who died in an accident that it was their fault for not knowing how to drive. Spin control in 5...4...3...2

The improper driving skills argument is another almost word for word response from GM's bloggers on numerous sites. I would like to see where in GM's ads, it stated: "Superior driving skills are needed to drive a Cobalt, Solstice, Ion or Sky. In addition, our ignition switches are designed to hold only a key". I don't recall seeing that in any GM ads.

This thread although of interest to Camaro owners, has been moved to a south 40 site for threads. You don't suppose GM had anything to do with that, do you? Happened on the other car model sites also. Including the recalled cars that were affected.

[McRat]

Not sure how any of us old timers ever survived.

We had to know how to start a car with ether and what to do if the carb caught fire.

We had to know how to change a tire safely.

We had to know how to get a foul handling POS under control when it decided to missbehave.

We had to know how to react to the throttle spring screwing up and the car going WOT.

AND we had to know how to react when the engine shuts off, as a car dying while driving wasn't that unusual.

Here's to the dumbing down of American Driver, and to the Grand Future of Cellphones, texting, blacked out windows, driving too fast in poor conditions, and 1000w car stereos.

Perhaps it's finally time for us to retire the automobile. We as a society are no longer smart enough or well-trained enough to operate one.

I will miss them. As will the legal community.

Exaggerated? Go buy a 3 wheel ATC. They are perfectly safe when operated by somebody with an IQ larger than their shoe size. A slippery slope starts somewhere.

Today, we are too stupid to check our tire pressures, use a seatbelt, know how to handle a car in an emergency, what the redline on the tach means, how fast the car can be operated on a closed course, etc, etc, etc. And we are getting dumber in a non-linear exponential fashion. Opening car doors will be a struggle for future generations.

[McRat]

Originally Posted by citabria7

The improper driving skills argument is another almost word for word response from GM's bloggers on numerous sites. I would like to see where in GM's ads, it stated: "Superior driving skills are needed to drive a Cobalt, Solstice, Ion or Sky. In addition, our ignition switches are designed to hold only a key". I don't recall seeing that in any GM ads.

This thread although of interest to Camaro owners, has been moved to a south 40 site for threads. You don't suppose GM had anything to do with that, do you? Happened on the other car model sites also. Including the recalled cars that were affected.

Did they tell you what to do when the engine shut off or went WOT during driver's training?

They did for us. But then again, they told us not hang junk from the ignition switch. Back then, the goal of driving was to do it safely. Today, it's just ticket avoidance. Obey the law, and you will never crash.

What puzzles me is the millions of these cars on the road with such a low fatality rate. Many have over 200,000 miles.

[McRat]

Originally Posted by citabria7

...
This thread although of interest to Camaro owners, has been moved to a south 40 site for threads. You don't suppose GM had anything to do with that, do you? Happened on the other car model sites also. Including the recalled cars that were affected.

Oh please. GM doesn't run this web forum.

Your peers apparently didn't think this was 5th Gen Camaro news. Probably because it is not.

It's essentially a political thread.

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by McRat

Did they tell you what to do when the engine shut off or went WOT during driver's training?

They did for us. But then again, they told us not hang junk from the ignition switch. Back then, the goal of driving was to do it safely. Today, it's just ticket avoidance. Obey the law, and you will never crash.

What puzzles me is the millions of these cars on the road with such a low fatality rate. Many have over 200,000 miles.

But the accidents were caused by bad engineering, lies and zero quality control. They KNOWINGLY accepted parts they KNEW did not meed specs.
Trumps anything else

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by McRat

Oh please. GM doesn't run this web forum.

Your peers apparently didn't think this was 5th Gen Camaro news. Probably because it is not.

It's essentially a political thread.

How many pages did the thread get in a day? Obviously, members thought it was important. Don't tell me the car companies don't have input with the forum operators. Protecting the image is foremost

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by McRat

Not sure how any of us old timers ever survived.

We had to know how to start a car with ether and what to do if the carb caught fire.

We had to know how to change a tire safely.

We had to know how to get a foul handling POS under control when it decided to missbehave.

We had to know how to react to the throttle spring screwing up and the car going WOT.

AND we had to know how to react when the engine shuts off, as a car dying while driving wasn't that unusual.

Here's to the dumbing down of American Driver, and to the Grand Future of Cellphones, texting, blacked out windows, driving too fast in poor conditions, and 1000w car stereos.

Perhaps it's finally time for us to retire the automobile. We as a society are no longer smart enough or well-trained enough to operate one.

I will miss them. As will the legal community.

Exaggerated? Go buy a 3 wheel ATC. They are perfectly safe when operated by somebody with an IQ larger than their shoe size. A slippery slope starts somewhere.

Today, we are too stupid to check our tire pressures, use a seatbelt, know how to handle a car in an emergency, what the redline on the tach means, how fast the car can be operated on a closed course, etc, etc, etc. And we are getting dumber in a non-linear exponential fashion. Opening car doors will be a struggle for future generations.

Again, where was the disclaimers in GM ads? Andy why haven't other manufacturers had these same problems?

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by citabria7

But the accidents were caused by bad engineering, lies and zero quality control. They KNOWINGLY accepted parts they KNEW did not meed specs.
Trumps anything else

Explain how shutting off an ignition switch causes an accident?

[KMPrenger]

Pretty obvious to me that citabria7 has an agenda. Why even try talking to him?

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

Pretty obvious to me that citabria7 has an agenda. Why even try talking to him?

Yep he does, over half his posts he has made are on the GM Recalls. I wonder who is paying him and how many other forums is he doing the same thing on?

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Explain how shutting off an ignition switch causes an accident?

Well, think about it...if a knee hits the key, or a bump in the road jars it, an unsuspecting person loses control. No airbag with the ignition off. By the way, it happened to a GM Exec, driving a Cobalt to the press reveal. Ran off the road, and had to have the engineers figure it out. Still went on with production with no changes. Great integrity, right?

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Yep he does, over half his posts he has made are on the GM Recalls. I wonder who is paying him and how many other forums is he doing the same thing on?

Agenda? Hah! Any agenda if you wish to call it that, is to get GM to stand up and do what is right, instead of hiding and lying. New concept for some people, right? And before you lie any more, way fewer than half my posts are about the recalls.

[citabria7]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Yep he does, over half his posts he has made are on the GM Recalls. I wonder who is paying him and how many other forums is he doing the same thing on?

Since you are so absorbed in protecting GM...hmmmmm.....

[McRat]

Originally Posted by citabria7

But the accidents were caused by bad engineering, lies and zero quality control. They KNOWINGLY accepted parts they KNEW did not meed specs.
Trumps anything else

How long have been an engineer now?

And exactly how much QC experience you sitting on?

Bad engineering was the Tacoma Narrows bridge, SRB's on the shuttle, and the Hubble telescope. Honorable mention would the version of iPhone where holding the phone affected the antenna signal.

More to the point, what have you designed in your life? Show us.