54000 KM - clutch worn out

[d4rknezz]

Hi,

The last few weeks on shifting quickly to 2nd after a stop, I have had experienced grinding. It will shift, grinding noise, won't catch, I have to shift back to neutral and shift it back to 2nd.

The dealership just got back to me and told me I need the whole thing replaced - $2600 CAD.

Is this normal for a 54000 km? V6 Camaro 2011, end of year.
I don't slip or ride the clutch often, though I do coast to a stop at red lights on neutral.

Opinions?
I kind of want to take it to another dealer for a second opinion, the last time they diagnosed me with carbon buildup for engine light I had my car in and out 4 times because they couldn't fix it/had probably diagnosed it wrong.

[Synner]

Try replacing your clutch/brake fluid first as old fluid will commonly cause shifting issues in these cars.

[d4rknezz]

Thanks Synner,

So I went to the dealer today to pick my car up. So this is what they think need to be replaced :
- Slave + bearing
- Pressure
- Fly wheel
All in all, plus labour = $2600.
Also, i asked about clutch fluid replacement - and the guy says they don't typically do it, and he can't even tell how much it would cost as its not even in their system.
...I don't know much about cars, but it looks like clutch/brake fluid is the same, yes? So possibly this guy doesn't know that?


I drove my car away - and immediately felt the clutch slipping on 3rd, and its now shaking when i shift to 1st.
I called them back - and asked whether they opened the car up or did anything to it. He said they didn't. But he said he did warn me that my clutch is failing.
Well...I know he said that, but i wasn't expecting it to fail immediately as i drove away from the dealership. Especially because when i came this morning all it did was grind when i shift to 2nd, sometimes. Now its shaking every single time i move to 1st.


Can someone tell me what these are?
slave + bearing ,pressure and fly wheel, and how can they tell i needed these replaced if they haven't actually done anything to the car?

Thanks...

[mp51998]

Originally Posted by d4rknezz

Thanks Synner,

So I went to the dealer today to pick my car up. So this is what they think need to be replaced :
- Slave + bearing
- Pressure
- Fly wheel
All in all, plus labour = $2600.
Also, i asked about clutch fluid replacement - and the guy says they don't typically do it, and he can't even tell how much it would cost as its not even in their system.
...I don't know much about cars, but it looks like clutch/brake fluid is the same, yes? So possibly this guy doesn't know that?


I drove my car away - and immediately felt the clutch slipping on 3rd, and its now shaking when i shift to 1st.
I called them back - and asked whether they opened the car up or did anything to it. He said they didn't. But he said he did warn me that my clutch is failing.
Well...I know he said that, but i wasn't expecting it to fail immediately as i drove away from the dealership. Especially because when i came this morning all it did was grind when i shift to 2nd, sometimes. Now its shaking every single time i move to 1st.


Can someone tell me what these are?
slave + bearing ,pressure and fly wheel, and how can they tell i needed these replaced if they haven't actually done anything to the car?

Thanks...

Most clutch kits come with all of the above. Some people do not feel the need to change the TO bearing or slave cylinder but it's good insurance since you are in there already. I cant believe they can tell you all that needs to be replaced with out at least oepning it up. They probaly drove it around the block and felt it slipping and just threw that out there.

I'd be pissed if it's worse now than when you took it in especially since they told you they did not open it up. Find out how they came to that concusion without looking at it physically. I could see it maybe getting worse if they opened it but probably not. They may have been doing some big burnouts in order to make it worse and have you do the repair now rather than milk it a while and wait. If your going to have a dealer do it I would go somewhere else. Also look around you can get a better clutches for less. A stock clutch for sure is less. Install at a local shop here is about $400-$500.

[d4rknezz]

Thanks mp51998,

I brought it to a different mechanic to get an opinion. he drove it around the block with me.
This is what he said :

- clutch is a little worn , but its definitely *not* slipping. So there is life in it yet.
- He is unsure of what that vibration is, but said maybe there is some shattering? in the clutch - needs to open it up to see what kind of damage is in there.
- My original concern - the gear grinding towards second? He would look at the transmission first. He doesn't think I should replace the clutch without looking at the transmission.
Theirs is not a transmission shop, so he told me to look for a transmission shop.

I am going to get a third opinion now, but I feel that maybe (hopefully), the transmission fluid was old, or low, (it was due for regular service, which i did at the same time I had the original dealer check my clutch - i hope they changed my transmission fluid) - which is why it was grinding on 2nd.
However, they looked at the clutch, saw that it was a little worn, and decided to quote me to replace it, even though a different mechanic drove it with me and told me it was definitely not slipping yet.

I don't know. I am not impressed with the dealer's / GM's mechanics, on the other hand, other shops here don't seem to want to touch a camaro 2011.

In the worse case scenario that something is indeed wrong with the transmission on a 2 year old car, i am not sure how to proceed.

Question : What is a better clutch? how do I find out any reviews on them? I have seen some things being sold by Phasetek - are they trustworthy?

[mp51998]

I am not familiar with the products Phastek is selling without looking but they are a reputable vendor here on the board. I see you have the V6 but the 1st to 2nd grind is common on the V8 TR6060 transmission when shifting at high RPM. You could check with Monster Clutches or Tick performance to see what they have for the V6 in stock configuration. We have several other vendors on this board as well. Just look in the vendor section and start calling around. They tend to advertise for the V8 crowd but somebody has to carry something for the V6. If your not going to mod best bet is to buy the stock clutch again and have a local shop do the install. It's not that hard and will be tons cheaper than a dealer. 54000 km is pretty quick on a clutch but that's about what I got on mine. We pulled my wife's stocker in April and she could've gone another six months easy. She has an early 2011. Mine is late late 2011.

Make sure you do like Synner said and change the fluid. It is shared with the brake fluid. May want to consider a seperate reservoir. It's in the DIY section.

[d4rknezz]

Thanks!
I am bringing it to a different dealer today to take a look, and tell them to also change the fluids. The first dealer agent didn't even know that the clutch fluid is the brake fluid, and when i mentioned it to him, he said changing clutch fluid is not even an option in their system. >_<. I don't know much of cars either, so I didn't know what to tell him.

I was limping home yesterday, no power on the gears. It seems the longer I drive it the worse it becomes. I am really upset at the original dealer - i was complaining about some grinding when shifting to 2, but the car certainly wasn't having this issue.

Thanks for the help guys, hopefully i have a good update tomorrow.

[d4rknezz]

So a little update :

I brought my car to a different car dealer.

1. I asked about whether my clutch fluid / transmission fluid would have been flushed with the last annual i did last week. They said no, only the levels would have been checked. I should have received the GM certified checked work order piece of paper from my original dealer. (I never received one).
2. I had the fluids flushed.
3. I asked if the transmission and clutch can be looked at. They said that unless they can replicate the grinding problem, it will cost me 6-7 hours of labour for them to take it apart.
4. I asked whether the clutch was problematic. The mechanic told me, while pointing to the bottom of the car, that to look at the clutch he needs to take the transmission out, because thats how the car is designed. He wouldn't recommend doing it at this point.

So : My original dealer told me i need a whole new clutch replaced (bearing, plate, fly wheel, clutch etc + labour ) , and charged me $50 to $60 to diagnose this - when they haven't even looked at the issue yet.

There are so many things wrong with this that I don't even know where to begin. Imagine going to a doctor with a chest pain and was recommended for a heart surgery without looking at what your problem is. And then charging you for that diagnoses.

My clutch is going, i am sure, at one point or another. All 3 mechanics says it shows signs of getting worn out. Whether its only the bearings, or everything, who knows? I don't want to deal with a dealer who basically says i need to replace everything , everytime something goes wrong.

Also, the chattering on the flywheel : I read up on it, and it looks like you can get problems by having a leaky valves dripping oil on it.
Well : In March, they replaced a ton of valves and gaskets in my car in their attempt to fix my carbon build up issue.

Is this related? Who knows? I dont know whether we are talking about the same valves, since I am not a mechanic. but its making me icky, that people can take me for a ride.

Was this a transmission problem all along?
In the first year of owning the car, I came to the dealer complaining that sometimes the car won't shift to 1st. I have to shift to 2nd gear first, neutral, then try again. Their suggestion was : This is normal, when it refuses to shift to first, just let go of the clutch a little bit while pushing it into first, and it will shift in.
Was this sound advice? Or was this a problem with synchro that I am now making worse because of their advice?

I think the problem I have is that I have a problematic car (this car sputtered and died on cold start this year's winter, a 2 year old car! What a lemon. And now the clutch is going, at 54000. Sheesh. ) that was not being serviced properly. When the dealer rotated my tires on my first semi annual when they shouldn't have been rotated, i should have listened to some guys in the forums who said i should never go back to the dealer who does this. I am not impressed with either the Camaro itself or the dealer I had earlier.

[mp51998]

Ok so NEVER GO TO THAT DEALER AGAIN. It is possible that that while replacing your valves oil could have leaked down onto the clutch causing it to be contaminated and shortening its life.
I would find the forum that covers your area and look for recommended dealers if you must go to a dealer. You can find good mom and pop garages that do quality work. Don't be afraid to use them if you feel you can trust them.
Before you do anything do some research on how a clutch works and what the parts are. A little knowledge will help keep you from being taken. Also talk to some car buddies. I'm sure you know someone who's into cars. Maybe they can go with you to help you understand the diagnosis or talk to the mechanic to see if they even know what they are talking about.
Bottom line, it sounds like you at least need a new clutch. Gonna have to suck that up.

[d4rknezz]

Yeah. I figure that too, hopefully with some careful driving it will last another few months, when I have some money where I can have both the transmission and the clutch looked at.

Thanks!

[Destructo09]

Does your Camaro not have a drivetrain warranty still?

[Nasty1970]

second gear grind is unfortunately common. My SS has it, I have avoided it in the way i drive. My tranny is not damaged or worn, its done it from day 1. I just usually skip second gear and go straight to 3rd. Im guessing its not synchronized correctly from the factory. dunno.

sounds like your having obvious clutch issues. I would recommend doing a kit. turn your flywheel, replace TO bearing, and clutch. All of those should eliminate slipping, and shaking issues. might even fix second gear grind.

If you've had this fixed already, what was the issue?