Appraisal surprise. Apparent accident not reported

[miguelfranco]

Originally Posted by fp115

This has been done often. In fact, I had to cover 2 cases just like that in law school. You end up suing the dealer, the dealer names the previous owner as the defendant. It is the seller's responsible to make the buying party aware of any issues during sale.

Not surprisingly, 25% of the cases I had to do related to car sales. Things like buying cars "as is" are not a legal argument that holds up in court.

Hmmmm really? Even if it's a non-disclosure state?

[Paladinjc]

Originally Posted by pickwithaustin

HUH?
Good luck with that concept.

+1.

People really need to read the contacts they sign, before signing them! It would amaze most people how much of their rights and right to sew they sign away. At best you would get binding arbitration. Not to mention the amount of money you would need to spend in legal fees would far out weight any monetary gains you MIGHT receive.

I will bet this dealership will go to the mat with you before they give up one red cent!

But, best of luck.

[punkindave]

Originally Posted by fp115

This has been done often. In fact, I had to cover 2 cases just like that in law school. You end up suing the dealer, the dealer names the previous owner as the defendant. It is the seller's responsible to make the buying party aware of any issues during sale.

Not surprisingly, 25% of the cases I had to do related to car sales. Things like buying cars "as is" are not a legal argument that holds up in court.

And you speaking of Canadian law or USA (where the OP is from)
The only claim the buyer MIGHT have is diminished value. Nobody was hurt and the car isn't broken due to improper repairs. Explain how this would work even if the car wasn't sold as-is. Just curious.

If it was purchased from a GM dealer as Cerrtified pre-owned, here's the poop on that. Apparently a CarFux report is included.
http://www.gmcertified.com/?seo=goo_...%20pre%20owned

[pickwithaustin]

Originally Posted by fp115

This has been done often. In fact, I had to cover 2 cases just like that in law school. You end up suing the dealer, the dealer names the previous owner as the defendant. It is the seller's responsible to make the buying party aware of any issues during sale.

Not surprisingly, 25% of the cases I had to do related to car sales. Things like buying cars "as is" are not a legal argument that holds up in court.

I have traded in MANY cars over my years and not ever once did the dealer ask me any questions about the car such as, "Has it ever been in an accident? Did you ever have to do any repairs?"

There exists no law that REQUIRES you to disclose repairs done to a vehicle. (in the USA)

You might want to go back to law school, unless Canadian laws are different than in the U.S., where the original poster is from. There exists no obligation, when trading in a car, to tell the car's history to the dealer you are trading it to.

[pickwithaustin]

Originally Posted by fp115

Things like buying cars "as is" are not a legal argument that holds up in court.

It holds up perfectly in a U.S. court... Unless there was fraud involved.

[fp115]

Originally Posted by punkindave

And you speaking of Canadian law or USA (where the OP is from)
The only claim the buyer MIGHT have is diminished value. Nobody was hurt and the car isn't broken due to improper repairs. Explain how this would work even if the car wasn't sold as-is. Just curious.

If it was purchased from a GM dealer as Cerrtified pre-owned, here's the poop on that. Apparently a CarFux report is included.
http://www.gmcertified.com/?seo=goo_...%20pre%20owned

Usually when you sell something as is, it is your responsibility as the seller to ensure the buyer is aware the condition is different than their expectation. While the major of the cases I looked at were indeed part of the Commonwealth legal system (Canada and Europe), some were within the US.

One in particular from the US was in NY. A dealer sold a car as is, the buyer didn't take the car out on a test drive. Turns out the car couldn't even move. When the buyer tried to give the car back and ask for his money, the seller refused and said the car was bought as is. Sure the facts are different, but the morale of the story is the same. The seller lead the buyer into thinking what they were getting was a good deal, but in theory there were some details missing.

Another one I covered is where the VIN number was changed. The VIN in the windshield was one of a clean vehicle (same year and model). The VIN was taken from a car that was sent to be scrapped since most of the internals were no longer working. The car the VIN was put on was in 4 different accidents. The VIN was swapped by the previous owner, not the dealer. While the VIN was never actually looked at and the buyer bought without knowing the history, this was still negligent. The buyer was alerted by a mechanic that he had to fix the frame due to a prior accident. That raised red flags and led to the lawsuit.

Originally Posted by pickwithaustin

I have traded in MANY cars over my years and not ever once did the dealer ask me any questions about the car such as, "Has it ever been in an accident? Did you ever have to do any repairs?"

There exists no law that REQUIRES you to disclose repairs done to a vehicle. (in the USA)

You might want to go back to law school, unless Canadian laws are different than in the U.S., where the original poster is from. There exists no obligation, when trading in a car, to tell the car's history to the dealer you are trading it to.

I'm surprised the dealer hasn't ever asked you about accidents. It is an obligation to state truthful comments regarding the vehicle during a sale. The same goes with a home. If the seller deceives, you have a case against them. Plain and simple.

And before telling someone to "go back to law school" you should look into the DMV, as it states you must disclose when a car is rebuilt. In this case, frame damage is the car being rebuilt.

Originally Posted by pickwithaustin

It holds up perfectly in a U.S. court... Unless there was fraud involved.

In this case, fraud is involved. Op is taking a financial hit due to the seller's failure to disclose the true history.

[Demon War Horse]

Originally Posted by pickwithaustin

I have traded in MANY cars over my years and not ever once did the dealer ask me any questions about the car such as, "Has it ever been in an accident? Did you ever have to do any repairs?"

.

When I traded my Charger in on the '14 they asked me about repairs or damage in N. Texas. I had none, but my dealer did ask.

[hworth18]

When my ex took her Yukon to Carmax, they claimed the frame was bent even though it wasn't. I think they will tell you anything so they don't have to pay as much for the car. I'd take the Camaro to a reputable bodyshop and have them inspect it for a second opinion.

[Demon War Horse]

Carmax would not take a Formula I was selling several years ago for a decent offer since I had the weld on subframe connectors... they considered that to be frame damage... WTF.

Oh well.

[1stgxp]

Whenever I traded a car in the dealer ALWAYs asked has the car been in any accidents and was the odometer correct and had to sign paperwork that said so.

[el ess A]

I had to sign a statement on the trade-in part of my purchase order contract on my truck back in 2010 stating stuff to the fact that the 2006 truck I was trading in had full disclosure to the condition, mileage, etc. Meaning I would be on the hook for any lies I told the dealership about the vehicle, if I did so. So technically, the dealer doesn't have to verbally ask, as they get it in writing.

[mpiersd]

i hate Carmax. They told me my Dodge Ram had been repainted and offered me half Blue Book. As the only owner of that truck I KNOW it had the original paint.

[191185]

Gee willy, then sell it private party

[Want Convertible]

The CarMax process can be time consuming. The "team" that appraised my car had an average age of 21 at most. I ended up selling my car outright to the dealer I bought it from, for $2,000 more, and still thought I didn't felt enough.

It's definitely hit & miss with CarMax.

Rule 1 always get at least 2 bids for your car.