HP... when is enough, enough?

[shibbs]

Not enough until I'm terrified of it.

[hjdca]

Tough question because of nannys on new cars... Nannys can manage 1000 hp for a newbie.

The real question should be "without nannys", what is the most HP that you would like for the street ? For me, it is between 550 and 600 hp, this is what I like on older muscle cars.

For example, assuming no nannys available, if you powershift to 3rd gear, will the car blow off the tires and make the car hard to control and slower ?

[Raven87]

I don't really have a number because I think it depends on so many other factors such as where you will be using the HP and how as well as the reason you want 'X' HP plus how much experience you have handling cars regardless of the HP.

I just read a great article about the Bugatti Chiron - 1479 HP and the road testers all are saying the car is very docile on the street. Yes, it's a $3,000,000 car but hey, if you have the money go for it.

We all know you can make 1500 HP (or more) for a hell of a lot less money. But it still comes back to where and how you may use a lot of horsepower and why you really want it. For bench racing? For dyno wars? It could be for anything and I don't think there's a wrong answer.

I've seen people do stupid things with 300 HP cars and others driving 1000+ HP who can handle it so it comes back to how good are you at handling the car, regardless of the HP.

[4 FN 27]

Originally Posted by JUSTIFIED

As the title says, when is enough HP, enough? Like many things in life, it's easy to get trapped in the never ending quest for more.

Interesting topic for sure. I believe it all comes down to limiting factors of Time, Funding, Capability and Passion.

I was a drag racer for 25+ years. Started with my High School Car running in the low 12's and slowly progressed to 6's in an NHRA Pro Stock Car.

I found enough was enough when it consumed every free minute of everyday which were some 24 hour long days. We were limited on funding having only a handful of sponsor dollars which meant we had to apply time using our capabilities and the passion to pursue spending less time driving the car (quicker 1/4 mile times).

It was until we bought a pallet of Cylinder Heads, uncut from GM and I found myself setting my alarm 3 or 4 times a night to shovel chips out of a 5 axis CNC that I thought what the hell are you doing? I mean we spend every waking moment preparing to try 50+ combinations on a Dyno to pick up 1-2-3-4 or 5 HP. We change combinations in/on the car every pass, trying low drag ceramic bearings, matrix metal driveshafts, learning to make valve train live at 10400 RPM with over an inch of lift, engine chillers and the list goes on. Spending up to $200 per pound to save weight.

It was no longer fun. Spending thousands of dollars in diesel fuel to travel to a race to burn $20.00 VP C-18???

I retired from driving in 2008 and did clutch consulting and played crew chief until 2012 leasing my semi to another team running Top Sportsman. Once I got a taste of relaxing I retired from that too. I miss it at times but not really. I like sitting down in my Z hitting the Garage Door Opener and firing it up and going for a little spin. Come home and park it. Might wash it, change oil but I'll personally never open the motor up to make "improvements"...If I need a fix of the old way of life I just go down to the shop and work on my old Chevelle 300 Deluxe.

I have the utmost respect for the guy on the quest to find the answer to your question by trail and error..."when is enough, enough?"

Follow your passion. I always say the only thing in life I would do differently is I would do it all again only with more passion.

[BMR Sales]

Originally Posted by frogwo

A man can never have enough HORSEPOWER.
Enough TVs or a large enough TV .

You forgot Boobs!

[frenchsquared]

I like 600 at the rear wheel in a 3000lb car. Anything more then that on a street car is kinda pointless to me. I feel my Z28 is under powered for the weight. I want another 100hp out of it.

I use to want 1,000 but after getting to 622 I no longer need 1000. Its just not worth the cost to me.

[Citizen-X]

I went as far as I could n/a. I wanted to keep the car capable for what it's intended use was, the track. I've seen supercharged and twin turbos on Z's, I know it's great to say I got a 1000hp Z, but you'll never be able to put it down. I'm just over 600 at the rear wheels and I have to be super soft on the pedals, I can blow the tires off anytime I want through 3 gears. To me it did need more and with the way mine sounds, it sounds as killer as it looks.

[hammdo]

Originally Posted by BMR Sales

You forgot Boobs!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Oh yeah...

-Don

[Olddudesrule]

Originally Posted by hjdca

Tough question because of nannys on new cars... Nannys can manage 1000 hp for a newbie.

The real question should be "without nannys", what is the most HP that you would like for the street ? For me, it is between 550 and 600 hp, this is what I like on older muscle cars.

For example, assuming no nannys available, if you powershift to 3rd gear, will the car blow off the tires and make the car hard to control and slower ?

Nannies cannot "manage" a novice bent on exceeding his/her abilities in anything close to a 1000 hp car. Nannies cannot fight the laws of physics, and are there to help manage certain conditions where the driver "out drives" the car. They will not keep you out of a wall if you're "novice" enough to get yourself there....

[The_Raging_Bull]

In track cars like a Z06 or the Z/28 IMO you need a little more above 505 hp to enable the car to push down the straights at an extra 15 to 20 mph between turns especially if you're running the wickerbill giving you 450 lbs of downforce. On the track that extra hp means lower ET's so I'm guessing 700 to 800 is getting pretty close to the max; especially naturally aspirated - so you avoid heat soak. With an extra 100 to 150 horsepower I'm guessing the Z/28 would be 7:15 - 7:19 at the Ring (perhaps better?). I wish someone would take a tweaked NA LS7 in a Z28 and find out IN THE DRY. Depending on who you believe Al O the Camaro chief engineer has been quoted saying our car did both 7:30 and 7:25 at the Ring.

I've seen cars that were pushing 1200+ hp; and it seems they're always having to have something fixed.When I bought my Z06; I test drove a 2011 ZL1 (on the street and drag strip) which had been built to 1050 hp at the wheels; it had run a 9.8 and 9.9 quarter miles. It was really fast, but my fear was that due to drag strip time > I might be buying a time bomb as it had been a companies test bed vehicle. In the end, on my first LS7 I went with a Z06 that only had 750 miles after 3½ years with owner #1 -> in retrospect it was probably the best for durability.

There are a lot of ya'll that are track rats here on our little home away from home here on Camaro5; and if there's one thing I can do its listen. This section is great for the actual how to part of DIY; so I've learned how to set the car up for tracking, best tires, pressures etc. I guess I'm an old drag strip and street racing rat - since I used to do a lot of that with my old Z28 when I was a young buck right out of college. Now I go out and autocross with the guys in the Vette club; and have plans to run at Hallett (that's the track near Tulsa). That allows me to get the desire to run above 120 mph out of my blood; since you can only tear up entrance and exit ramps so much. I would say in my intemperate youth, I would have told you there was never enough horsepower.

As an FYI...I've got a slot at Katech this thanksgiving to take my Z06 to 670 hp.It will be the second time I've had a car which was built to levels above 600hp. I'm planning on a dual disc ZR1 clutch, 3.90 gears in the differential, a DeWitts radiator to keep everything cool; ARH long tube headers and a Corsa exhaust. In the engine, I'm having Katech do their Stage 2 with a K501 cam, FAST intake,and port the current heads on the car; adding the extra cost of the bronze guides plus Ti-Mo intake and Ti-Mo exhaust valves,all to address the dropped valve issue. So perhaps next year as I'm running on Hallett I've have a better better opinion.

[frankwjr]

When you FINALLY cross the burnout bridge!

[John_C]

You can never have too much HP!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[pat_t]

My Z has 578rwhp, for circuits over here, I can't imagine having any more!

Instead I'm focussing on further weight reduction and chassis set-up.

[Avenging Orange]

I've always felt that every car (domestic) has room for improvement. The few little tweeks that make the car what it should be.....or to reach its potential. Obviously, every situation is different based on what the car will be used for. For me, the Camaro (in my case an SS) is a smokin car stock. For street purposes only....bolt on's and a tune brings the car to a pleasure to drive. A couple properly placed bushings, rear sway bar and a square set up withgood tires makes it a blast to drive. And thats where I stop. Opinions will vary......but when you give your car a few years where folks slowly figure out what the weak links are....you can pretty much improve your car relatively
Inexpensive and make it a great drive. Besides, that's what it's all about.....the drive!