2018 Dodge Challenger T/A

[lbls1]

I wouldn't necessarily say that its outclassed, but the styling has been out way too long. Dodge needs to think of something in terms of a styling update.

[KJZ28]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

It's quick and comfortable and handles good enough.. That's fine for majority of people.

That is what I was going to say! Honestly if there was a used Challenger available at the time I bough my 2010 SS used I would have bought it. I was looking for something cool looking, V8 powered, and comfortable. It ticked off all the marks.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by lbls1

I wouldn't necessarily say that its outclassed, but the styling has been out way too long. Dodge needs to think of something in terms of a styling update.

It has recently been selling better than the Camaro, what does that say about the Camaro's styling?

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by newmoon

It has recently been selling better* than the Camaro, what does that say about the Camaro's styling?

* 1 in 3 Challengers is a rental car

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by hotlap

* 1 in 3 Challengers is a rental car

If there was a demand for Camaros in the rental fleet do you think Chevy would decide not to sell these cars? Problem is there is little demand otherwise it would be on the rental lots. I think Dodge is doing just fine with its 10-yro platform Challenger and Chargers.

[McBeevee]

Originally Posted by newmoon

If there was a demand for Camaros in the rental fleet do you think Chevy would decide not to sell these cars? Problem is there is little demand otherwise it would be on the rental lots. I think Dodge is doing just fine with its 10-yro platform Challenger and Chargers.

I agree....I like this "old platform" so much, I bought a second one to drive daily! Although I did like my 5th gen, that thought never came close to entering my mind while owning it.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by newmoon

If there was a demand for Camaros in the rental fleet do you think Chevy would decide not to sell these cars? Problem is there is little demand otherwise it would be on the rental lots. I think Dodge is doing just fine with its 10-yro platform Challenger and Chargers.

You are distorting reality. Camaro has sold 10,766 more retail units than Challenger with an average transaction price that is $3,925 higher. Those are one on one transactions verses a no/low profit volume dump for Challenger.

GM Will Continue Cutting Rental Sales Through 2018
Jun 15, 2017

General Motors has prided itself on being a decidedly more disciplined automaker since emerging from bankruptcy. One of the major places it has pulled back is in the rental sales market. With fewer cars sold to Hertz and Enterprise, GM loses out on big sales figures but also remains a more profitable automaker in the process.

Alan Batey, GM North American President, told Automotive News the cuts would continue into 2018 and will mark four straight years of cuts. GM’s rental sales are on pace to fall 50,000 units this year, though, next year’s sales have not been disclosed yet. In 2014, GM’s rental sales made up 16.1 percent of its overall sales numbers—that figure was 11.7 percent in 2016.

The additional cuts could bring the percentage into single digits—a very good thing for GM.

“We like the rent-a-car business from a seats-in-seats perspective because it’s great test drives and it’s a great opportunity to expose new people to our products,” Batey said. “We don’t like it when it’s bringing too many nearly new vehicles back into the market to compete with our new business and compress our resale values.”

Vehicles returning to the market after rental duty wreak havoc on new car sales and cause residual values to plummet on many models. Not to mention, rental fleet sales are often a money-losing business for automakers. GM’s old way of thinking would pump thousands of cars into rental fleets to keep assembly lines humming and total sales figures high.

Under CEO Mary Barra, the company has completely cut out markets and areas that regularly lose money. Those include Russia, India, and manufacturing vehicles in Australia.

GM must combat a different front, however: rising overall inventories. The automaker has 44 percent more vehicles on hand than this time last year. The automaker insists it’s stockpiling cars as it plans for long periods of downtime at many U.S. plants. However, if sales continue to plateau, it could spell trouble.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2017/06/gm-will-continue-cutting-rental-sales-through-2018/

I’m not saying Chevy is happy with the current volume but everything points toward them wanting Camaro, CTS and ATS to carry the plant with retail sales. CTS and ATS are doing much worse but the new CT5/4/3 are coming beginning 2019

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by hotlap

You are distorting reality. Camaro has sold 10,766 more retail units than Challenger with an average transaction price that is $3,925 higher. Those are one on one transactions verses a no/low profit volume dump for Challenger.

I’m not saying Chevy is happy with the current volume but everything points toward them wanting Camaro, CTS and ATS to carry the plant with retail sales. CTS and ATS are doing much worse but the new CT5/4/3 are coming beginning 2019

Yes with a brand new 6th Gen platform yet still is falling behind the 10-yro platform. Bottom line Chevy knows they are in trouble thus why they are looking at budget models to try and save the Camaro. Bottom line Camaro sales should be much higher than they are with a new platform.

[rocket403]

At the local car show there is one 2015 2SS 1LE that will show up along with my friends 14 V6. We have a large group of 67 to 91 Camaro's that always show up for the shows and there is not a lot of love for the 6th gen and this is coming from the Chevy guys, we have about close to 100 cars that show up. GM has made a mistake with the direction they have taken with the 6th gen. The Challenger just keeps selling so you do the math even with GM selling at a higher price point the Challenger can sell for less as tooling is far less than the Camaro

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Yes with a brand new 6th Gen platform yet still is falling behind the 10-yro platform. Bottom line Chevy knows they are in trouble thus why they are looking at budget models to try and save the Camaro. Bottom line Camaro sales should be much higher than they are with a new platform.

If Aplha2 CT5/4/3 and gen7 Camaro can't support themselves with retail sales, that will be the end...IMO.

Bottom line. In the near term, I'd be much more worried about the Challegers future. Delay, delay, delay and if/when is comes it will be much more like the current Camaro and Mustang. In other words, smaller and lighter with emphasis on handling.

And go ahead... pat yourself on the back for the massive Challenger fleet sales.

[lbls1]

Originally Posted by newmoon

It has recently been selling better than the Camaro, what does that say about the Camaro's styling?

Its not indicative of Chevy's styling, but rather their marketing approach with Camaro. Camaro's pricing has increased a bit out of the field with their competitors (for the regular series, including 'SS). I feel that explains some of the lackluster sales with Camaro.

Remember, it wasn't long ago that Challengers were way behind Camaro and Mustang. Challenger is doing ok right now, but just think of how much better they could do with fresher styling.

[drivingagain]

Originally Posted by newmoon

If there was a demand for Camaros in the rental fleet do you think Chevy would decide not to sell these cars? Problem is there is little demand otherwise it would be on the rental lots. I think Dodge is doing just fine with its 10-yro platform Challenger and Chargers.

This is no reality in this conversation. This is a thought and nothing more to back it up with. Rental fleets are a killer for resale and for new sales. Why would it be a rash decision to buy a boat for a performance car that has a negative impact on resale value because there is so many units being destroyed by renters?

The Camaro rentals are offered more of a premium rental where challenger rentals are offered as a economy decision. I rent cars on a daily basis.
You can rent a challenger for $28 a day from hertz.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by newmoon

If there was a demand for Camaros in the rental fleet do you think Chevy would decide not to sell these cars? Problem is there is little demand otherwise it would be on the rental lots. I think Dodge is doing just fine with its 10-yro platform Challenger and Chargers.

Yes, they would absolutely refuse to sell to rental fleets. They've been intentionally chopping rental sales for the last couple of years. They brag about reducing fleet in their monthly sales reports and in their quarterly earnings reports. And wouldn't you know it ... GM's been making money hand over fist since they decided to put profitability over sales volume.

Sales to rental fleets are garbage. The cars are usually the lowest trim (ie, least profitable) and sold at a bulk discount (further reducing profit) and are abused (making them worth even less when they enter the used market, which ends up making leasing that much less attractive).

Automakers don't really sell to rental fleets to make money. They do it to dump unwanted product and to keep factories running. And to make for more impressive looking sales figures.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by lbls1

Its not indicative of Chevy's styling, but rather their marketing approach with Camaro. Camaro's pricing has increased a bit out of the field with their competitors (for the regular series, including 'SS). I feel that explains some of the lackluster sales with Camaro.

Remember, it wasn't long ago that Challengers were way behind Camaro and Mustang. Challenger is doing ok right now, but just think of how much better they could do with fresher styling.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IMO it is the design holding the Camaro back, it is not performance. Glaring problems mentioned in many reviews include lack of any functional back seat, poor visability, and a closed in feeling with the lower window sill being shoulder height. Its simply not a comfortable cruiser to anyone who isn't looking to go double the speed limit into an off ramp. If Chevy could improve on or fix these issues they would be selling 10k a month.