My first run-in with a dealership today

[MS3DALE]

Originally Posted by Nutro

He said there was a recent GM bulletin about Synergy Green not matching when doing re-sprays or repairs so he was worried about that.

Heres the TSB on that issue.....

Service Information



2012 Chevrolet Camaro | Camaro VIN F Service Manual | View All Bulletins | Document ID: 2772621
#12-08-51-001: Synergy Green Paint Formulas and Suppliers - (Feb 23, 2012)

Subject:Synergy Green Paint Formulas and Suppliers

Models:2011-2012 Chevrolet Camaro

This information pertains to shops spraying Solvent Basecoat or Waterborne basecoat paint systems.
It has come to our attention that many painters have great difficulty matching Synergy Green (WA 708S, color code GHS) in the repair facility. Some water borne matches are being made using tri-coat application methods. Synergy Green is not a tri-coat color, so warranty reimbursement may be problematic when the only color match is through a tri-coat formula for some paint brands. Contact your specific paint supplier for details concerning the color match of the brand of paint being used in the repair facility. The following is the “best match” formulas that we have evaluated from each of the following GMW15406 approved paint suppliers. These “best matches” are spray outs matched to a certified color standard spray out of Synergy Green. Our target is to provide you the best representative color match from each company to the certified color standard.
For Access to the GMW 15406 recommended paint systems go to: http://www.genuinegmparts.com/ Click on “accept” in the dialog box. Then roll your mouse over “Collision Repair” and select “Paint Shop” from the drop down box that appears. Then click on the “2011 GM Approved Refinish Materials” for the materials listing.
If the paint system you are using requires use of a tri-coat formula to properly match Synergy Green, submit the claim with the tri-coat material allowances added.
Synergy Green Best Match Formulas:




Paint Manufacturer



Paint Products



Paint Codes



Sherwin Williams


Ultra 7000 Solvent Basecoat

Waterborne AWX Basecoat


5106181

5159957


PPG


Envirobase HP Tri-Coat

Global BC/CC

Nexa Aquabase Plus Tri-Coat


923679 Special VI (X9)

923679 Special L (X8)

94YPB Special C (X9)


Akzo-Nobel (Sikkens)


Autobase Pluse Solvent Basecoat

Autowave 10: Waterborne Basecoat


CHE-10 GHS

GMA-10 GHS


DuPont


Spies Hecker Permacron Solvent

Cromax Pro Waterborne: Basecoat


818290

861388


BASF


R-M Diamont Solvent

R-M Onyx Waterborne

Glasurit 55 Line GM Solvent

Glasurit 90 Line GM Waterborne


GM WA708S Standard

GM WA708S Standard

WA708S Standard

WA708S Standard

GM bulletins are intended for use by professional technicians, NOT a "do-it-yourselfer". They are written to inform these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or to provide information that could assist in the proper service of a vehicle. Properly trained technicians have the equipment, tools, safety instructions, and know-how to do a job properly and safely. If a condition is described, DO NOT assume that the bulletin applies to your vehicle, or that your vehicle will have that condition. See your GM dealer for information on whether your vehicle may benefit from the information.

WE SUPPORT VOLUNTARY TECHNICIAN CERTIFICATION

[MR.CamaroSS]

i would have it painted...in my opinion regardless if it was painted or not. second, feel around the edges of your deck lid and the quarter jambs because if a dealer repainted it there is going to be some evidence of them taping it up and it will leave a hard or hazing edge. i have been painting for 10 years and that looks like who ever put it on over tightened it and the paint was soft meaning it was probably repainted because it also did it around the edges of the spoiler. the paint on these cars shouldn't be that fragile. it can be argued both ways and i could be wrong but there will be some evidence of them repainting it if it was... the only way to know 100% is to sand those areas and feather the paint out and count the layers.

also tell them weather you pay them or its covered to blend the quarter panels if its a three stage color. i spray the BASF water borne 90 line and our formula is not three stage for that color. when they paint the deck lid there shouldn't be a color match problem because the damage isn't all over and they can blend the color within the deck lid keeping it away from the quarters. make sure when you fix the problem to put those fuzzy washers in between the bolts so the vibration doesn't cause it to happen again good luck with the situation

[Nutro]

Originally Posted by MR.CamaroSS

i would have it painted...in my opinion regardless if it was painted or not. second, feel around the edges of your deck lid and the quarter jambs because if a dealer repainted it there is going to be some evidence of them taping it up and it will leave a hard or hazing edge. i have been painting for 10 years and that looks like who ever put it on over tightened it and the paint was soft meaning it was probably repainted because it also did it around the edges of the spoiler. the paint on these cars shouldn't be that fragile. it can be argued both ways and i could be wrong but there will be some evidence of them repainting it if it was... the only way to know 100% is to sand those areas and feather the paint out and count the layers.

also tell them weather you pay them or its covered to blend the quarter panels if its a three stage color. i spray the BASF water borne 90 line and our formula is not three stage for that color. when they paint the deck lid there shouldn't be a color match problem because the damage isn't all over and they can blend the color within the deck lid keeping it away from the quarters. good luck with the situation

Ah ok I just saw that you edited. So they shouldn't have to blend the quarters?

That's what he said today. I also said "Everyone that owns a newer GM knows the paint is horrible" and he said he disagreed with me and the paint is excellent.

I've got 3 "newer" GM vehicles in my immediate family. It sucks.

[PercyJWellingtonIII]

Originally Posted by Nutro

I removed my stock spoiler to clean out all the dirt and debris that has collected there and to make sure the ralley stripes were holding up well under there.

As you can imagine, with this high quality GM paint, there was damage! The pain is trashed under there.

I ended up losing one of the nuts that holds the spoiler on so I went to the local GM dealership to buy a nut and to ask about the paint being trashed.

The service guy immediately said he didn't know and went to get the service manager.

The SM comes out and compliments the car and sees my window sticker and asks if I like AR-15 rifles. We chat for a minute then get down to business.

He said there was a recent GM bulletin about Synergy Green not matching when doing re-sprays or repairs so he was worried about that.

He then asks if I'm the original owner and I tell him that "No, I am the second owner" to which he replies that the trunk lid might have "already been painted by the previous owner" and then tries to convince me that there is a difference in the trunk lid and quarter panel in the shade of green and the orange peel and I disagree. I JUST put a fresh coat of sealant on the car this morning after another detail so I can see the trees, the highway and cars driving by in the paint, there is NOT a difference.

He says the body shop they use will come look at it tomorrow morning and if they deem the trunk lid paint to be original paint, GM will eat the re-paint fees and they will even paint my aftermarket spoiler for a "Small charge" but if the trunk lid has already been re-painted, all bets are off and they will not pay for anything.

What would you like to bet that somehow the guy is going to tell me that the trunk lid has already been re-painted before and they will not repaint my trunk lid?

Exactly.

Pics for reference:

Go ahead and let him check it, if you dont like his answer then take it to another GM body shop and get there opinion without telling them anything else so as they won't try to weasel out of anything, just act like you are thinking about having them repaint it out of your pocket but you first want to know if thats the original paint. If they say its original then go back to your dealer and tell them.

[PercyJWellingtonIII]

Worst case scenario is just put your spoiler back on. Out of site out of mind.

[monstertodd]

Same thing happened to me when I pulled my OEM spoiler off and installed an MPD-1. Still waiting to get it fixed.

[Chevrolet Customer Svc]

Nutro, I hope your dealer is able to get everything taken care of for you. Let us know how things go for you.

Jeff Morris, Chevrolet Customer Service

[Ir0nM4n]

Originally Posted by RJTV6A

In my small bit of experience the factory primer is grey in color. Most repair shops use vari prime which is yellow in color. I'd say most likely it's factory paint. When the expert comes they will know best.

My understanding from other posts about Synergy Green and a repaint is to use a white primer. Someone had a Synergy Green Camaro repainted and it did not turn out because of gray primer. Now this is what they said, not sure if it is the case. I am just repeating what I read.

[Nutro]

So the dealership (Capitol Chevrolet) said they will fix the paint.

They do not have a body shop there so they farm their work out to a local body shop near them.

I went to that shop today and they all agreed that the paint is factory and they gave me a quote. The painter said he can blend it on the trunk lid just fine and should be able to match it. They will also paint and install my aftermarket spoiler for an extra $150.

I took the car to a body shop that I KNOW and trust (I also know 6 employees there) and THAT painter said there is no way to match it perfectly without blending into the quarters.

He said he can tint the paint and probably get it super close to perfect on just the trunk lid but prefers to blend the quarters.

I went back to the dealership and that service manager said he doesn't care who does the work BUT my preferred shop must accept what GM is willing to pay for the repairs and that's it. He said that GM dictates what the amount should be for repair.

MY question is this: If this dealership doesn't have a GM body shop to make the repairs, how can they dictate what someone else is willing to charge for a repair?

He also mentioned trying to get me a rental for 3 days.

[flyinlow]

In most states, insurance companies regulate the amount body shops can charge for insurance work.

For your example, its something similar. If this is being covered under warranty, there is an amount that GM will allow to have it fixed and that is what the dealer is telling you. Your body shop would have to do it for that price.

[Nutro]

Originally Posted by flyinlow

In most states, insurance companies regulate the amount body shops can charge for insurance work.

For your example, its something similar. If this is being covered under warranty, there is an amount that GM will allow to have it fixed and that is what the dealer is telling you. Your body shop would have to do it for that price.

Ok gotcha. So, once they give me the allowed price for repairs, I have to find a body shop willing to do for that amount?

If they give me a GM approved price, can't I just take it to another GM dealership that has a body/paint shop and have them do the repairs?

[urr2slo]

GM has a set labor rate and materiels rate they will pay based on the going rate for the area. Its call warranty rate and that is all they will pay. If your shop will not repair it for warranty rate, you need to pay the difference and your shop assumes resposibility for the repairs. The dealers shop will only get paid warranty rate and stands behind the work, if they go out of business GM will stand behind it as it was warranty, just have the dealer use there bodyshop and look it over carefully before accepting it when done.

[Nutro]

Originally Posted by urr2slo

GM has a set labor rate and materiels rate they will pay based on the going rate for the area. Its call warranty rate and that is all they will pay. If your shop will not repair it for warranty rate, you need to pay the difference and your shop assumes resposibility for the repairs. The dealers shop will only get paid warranty rate and stands behind the work, if they go out of business GM will stand behind it as it was warranty, just have the dealer use there bodyshop and look it over carefully before accepting it when done.

Yeah I called another dealer that's 20 miles away and spoke to the Service Manager there. He said if I wanted to, just bring the car to him once GM approves the repair and they will fix it. That dealership has a body shop.

[The SwiftChancelor]

I haven't read the other responses but I work at a body shop and most trunks will look like this when the spoiler comes off. They don't all have the scratch marks where the spoiler's edges rubbed but where the bolt holes are, yes. Its just where the spoiler is tightened down tight on the deck lid rubbing the paint on the edges of the spoiler and where its bolted. The quarters match well in your photo but don't forget if the deck lid was painted the quarters may have been blended. A good shop will make a car look original like it had never been painted. We remove everything on the panel which we are painting.