(jalopnik) Chevy’s Anti-GT500, Pro-Camaro ZL1 Smack-Talking Powerpoint

[evolve]

Originally Posted by GT Premi

When you don't have a valid retort, break out the trusty ol' reliability reports.

Thats exactly why I left it at that lol.

[Brent Hinds]

Originally Posted by Uneducated Guess

I'm not trying to win anything. I have no doubt that the GT500 will be a very capable muscle car. I'd just hate for you to misquote somebody then have it blown way out of proportion or blow up in your face when they aren't "equal". People will take what you say and run with it.

I'm sure the GT500 will be fast, but I doubt it will be able to keep up with our ZL1s on a road course.

The second "blow up in your face" part of your statement is why I get nervous about things like the powerpoint and Mr. Oppenheiser's commitment to very public trash talking. I think we've all already accepted that GT500 will beat the ZL1 in the quarter, but he's laid down the gauntlet that GT500 won't beat ZL1 to 60. And alot of the cars reputation is riding on road course performance. What if the GT500 gets to 60 quicker and what if Ford goes to one of the road courses ZL1 has recently been tested at and beats the tar out of the time the ZL1 put down?

I don't care in the practical sense because it doesn't change what the ZL1 that will be sitting in my garage is capable of, but what if he ends up being wrong about pretty much everything? Why would the company talk so much trash publicly, leaving their customers to be the ones getting mocked? I just want to enjoy the ZL1 I'm going to plunk down $55k+ of hard earned money when it gets here. Not have to listen to every kid that gets on the internet tell me why my car sucks and the team that designed it are idiots and blah blah blah just because they couldn't let the product itself do the talking.

p.s, saw my first ZL1 on the road last week on Telegraph road in Michigan!

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by YourBlindingBias

I think a camaro, especially an SS is definitely designed to be much more than a daily driver.

I don't think anybody that bought a Camaro 1SS/2SS thought they were going to buy the highest end Camaro to do groceries. I have no clue whre that GoldenBear guy is talking about. He's out of touch with reality because he's buying an upgraded SS (ZL1).

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

As a matter of fact I do consider a stock Camaro SS a grocery getter, along with stock Mustang GTs and Challenger R/Ts.

Obviously, you are out of touch with reality. They were not marketed as grocery getters, nobody (except for you) expected them to be grocery getters especially the all new Gen5 Camaro.

Originally Posted by Brent Hinds

I'm sure the GT500 will be fast, but I doubt it will be able to keep up with our ZL1s on a road course.

The second "blow up in your face" part of your statement is why I get nervous about things like the powerpoint and Mr. Oppenheiser's commitment to very public trash talking. I think we've all already accepted that GT500 will beat the ZL1 in the quarter, but he's laid down the gauntlet that GT500 won't beat ZL1 to 60. And alot of the cars reputation is riding on road course performance. What if the GT500 gets to 60 quicker and what if Ford goes to one of the road courses ZL1 has recently been tested at and beats the tar out of the time the ZL1 put down?

I don't care in the practical sense because it doesn't change what the ZL1 that will be sitting in my garage is capable of, but what if he ends up being wrong about pretty much everything? Why would the company talk so much trash publicly, leaving their customers to be the ones getting mocked? I just want to enjoy the ZL1 I'm going to plunk down $55k+ of hard earned money when it gets here. Not have to listen to every kid that gets on the internet tell me why my car sucks and the team that designed it are idiots and blah blah blah just because they couldn't let the product itself do the talking.

p.s, saw my first ZL1 on the road last week on Telegraph road in Michigan!

I think you grossly underestimate 70-90hp. difference between the 2013 GT500 and the 2012 ZL1.

[evolve]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I don't think anybody that bought a Camaro 1SS/2SS thought they were going to buy the highest end Camaro to do groceries. I have no clue whre that GoldenBear guy is talking about. He's out of touch with reality because he's buying an upgraded SS (ZL1).



Obviously, you are out of touch with reality. They were not marketed as grocery getters, nobody (except for you) expected them to be grocery getters especially the all new Gen5 Camaro.


I think you grossly underestimate 70-90hp. difference between the 2013 GT500 and the 2012 ZL1.

The trunk space says it all

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I don't think anybody that bought a Camaro 1SS/2SS thought they were going to buy the highest end Camaro to do groceries. I have no clue whre that GoldenBear guy is talking about. He's out of touch with reality because he's buying an upgraded SS (ZL1).



Obviously, you are out of touch with reality. They were not marketed as grocery getters, nobody (except for you) expected them to be grocery getters especially the all new Gen5 Camaro.


I think you grossly underestimate 70-90hp. difference between the 2013 GT500 and the 2012 ZL1.

So everybody who has an SS tracks the car? Nope.

ZL1 = an upgraded SS? So what? SS = upgraded LT.

HP is great if it can be put to use. Look at the GT-R beating the ZL1 with a HP deficit. It remains to be seen how much of the GT500's HP will go to the ground in the lower gears with those non-upgraded tires.

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I don't think anybody that bought a Camaro 1SS/2SS thought they were going to buy the highest end Camaro to do groceries. I have no clue whre that GoldenBear guy is talking about. He's out of touch with reality because he's buying an upgraded SS (ZL1).

Obviously, you are out of touch with reality. They were not marketed as grocery getters, nobody (except for you) expected them to be grocery getters especially the all new Gen5 Camaro.

Evidently, your reality is quite a bit different from my reality.

Regardless of how the 5th Gen Camaro SSs were marketed, I know several individuals in San Jose who use their 5th Gen Camaro SSs as daily drivers and grocery getters.

Therefore, there are at least some others beside me who expected the 5th Gen Camaros SSs to be daily driver grocery getters.

[Brent Hinds]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I think you grossly underestimate 70-90hp. difference between the 2013 GT500 and the 2012 ZL1.

How? You think the GT500 will actually be able to beat a ZL1 on a road course?

You do know that ZL1 was developed on the Nuremburger right?

[69NMYSS]

Originally Posted by Brent Hinds

I'm sure the GT500 will be fast, but I doubt it will be able to keep up with our ZL1s on a road course.

The second "blow up in your face" part of your statement is why I get nervous about things like the powerpoint and Mr. Oppenheiser's commitment to very public trash talking. I think we've all already accepted that GT500 will beat the ZL1 in the quarter, but he's laid down the gauntlet that GT500 won't beat ZL1 to 60. And alot of the cars reputation is riding on road course performance. What if the GT500 gets to 60 quicker and what if Ford goes to one of the road courses ZL1 has recently been tested at and beats the tar out of the time the ZL1 put down?

I don't care in the practical sense because it doesn't change what the ZL1 that will be sitting in my garage is capable of, but what if he ends up being wrong about pretty much everything? Why would the company talk so much trash publicly, leaving their customers to be the ones getting mocked? I just want to enjoy the ZL1 I'm going to plunk down $55k+ of hard earned money when it gets here. Not have to listen to every kid that gets on the internet tell me why my car sucks and the team that designed it are idiots and blah blah blah just because they couldn't let the product itself do the talking.

p.s, saw my first ZL1 on the road last week on Telegraph road in Michigan!

The only time you can compare times is when they are tested head to head on the same day. You cannot compare one vehicle to another six months apart even if it is the same track. If one car that is equipped with performance summer tires is tested at 40 degrees and the other at 75 degrees with different humidity levels, obviously times will be skewed. Thats why cars are always tested together on the same day.

[YourBlindingBias]

Originally Posted by Brent Hinds

How? You think the GT500 will actually be able to beat a ZL1 on a road course?

You do know that ZL1 was developed on the Nuremburger right?

[SSBUSDRVR]

You do know that ZL1 was developed on the Nuremburger right?

[OldScoolCamaro]

Originally Posted by Brent Hinds

How? You think the GT500 will actually be able to beat a ZL1 on a road course?

You do know that ZL1 was developed on the Nuremburger right?

.....quickly...you might want to don one of these outfits......<the way things are going on the board today, it would be standard issue equipment>

[evolve]

I'm not even going to comment on that.

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

So everybody who has an SS tracks the car? Nope.

ZL1 = an upgraded SS? So what? SS = upgraded LT.

HP is great if it can be put to use. Look at the GT-R beating the ZL1 with a HP deficit. It remains to be seen how much of the GT500's HP will go to the ground in the lower gears with those non-upgraded tires.

You don't have to track the car "to expect" that car to run well on a track if it's a freaking sports car man. Get real.

SS is not an upgrade of an LT the motors are "totally" different along with other things. The ZL1 is based on the SS, with some upgrades to the same motor, upgrades to the same suspension, upgrades to the same tranny. It's not a re-design of the Camaro dude. Just look around you can get ZL1 parts and put them on an SS from several vendors. What's does that say to you?

If you don't agree that okay, but don't make up dumb stuff for the sake of disagreeing.

Unlike you I don't belive Ford executives to be complete morons (they didn't take any bailout dollars are are doing very well), so my "expectation" is that they will make sure they can use that extra 90hp. otherwise you're correct it's useless. The Boss 302 seemed to fair quite well against the ZL1 with some upgrades to the GT500 and 90hp. Is it so un-believable it will beat the ZL1 on the track? Be "honest" for once.

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

Evidently, your reality is quite a bit different from my reality.

Regardless of how the 5th Gen Camaro SSs were marketed, I know several individuals in San Jose who use their 5th Gen Camaro SSs as daily drivers and grocery getters.

Therefore, there are at least some others beside me who expected the 5th Gen Camaros SSs to be daily driver grocery getters.

I know a lot of people that use their Ferraris as grocery getters too. So what? Are Ferraris grocery getters because moma bear gets oatmeal with it at the local Whole Foods? Whatever man.

I use my SS to go to work, and run errands to, but by far an SS is or was marketed as a regular car for moma bear.

You come accross to me as one of those guys that just like to be right "all the time" so just like hearing yourself speak or seeing your writings on-line. As some of the things you say are just plain rediculous and there's never any compromise of your views.

I can say the ZL1 is a great vehicle, and I can understand everyones appeal to it even though I personally don't like it and prefer my SS with the mods I've done, but the ZL1 it is not a grocery getter, neither is the SS (or expected to be), and definately not a GT500 or Challenger or Charger. Saying that is just plain loopy.

Originally Posted by Brent Hinds

How? You think the GT500 will actually be able to beat a ZL1 on a road course?

You do know that ZL1 was developed on the Nuremburger right?

Answer #1: Yes I do. With the right suspension and an extra 90hp. you damn right I do.

Answer #2: I was totally un-aware that GM had a plant on the Nurem"burg[er]" in Germany. They must have some great BBQ's there.

[Bolt-onC6]

Why do some on the forum feel the need to be so rude. Sure wouldn't make some of the same comments face to face.