Rx or IPF supercharger?

[kuzman89]

From my perspective in making and installing my own V2 SQ supercharger kit and all the dilemma's that came up, the biggest issue I had was reliability and keeping it simple. I'd gladly sacrifice a bit of power for good engineering. Was on abit of a budget at the time but regret it the choice I've made.

[lesson1]

Man what gives? Reading this thread doesnt make sense. Its funny to see grown men talk about nothing imo. Question still not answered. So to answer your question I dont know anything about either but for what it worth go with a turbo more hp and torque from what I have read on this forum. From guy like gretchen, cant c me, sc150, z madness and a few more. All I can say is do your own reseach for the power you want. If its a supercharge than get it. One thing I have learn on this forum no matter what you go with "you have to pay to play" if not stay stock till you can.

My .02 cent

[SC2150]

Originally Posted by Make It Rain

1. In my opinion the the additional tensioner adds additional stress, it is my understanding the factory engines with SC's have beefier cranks.

False, same crankshaft. There is absolutely no extra stress....no different than the extra stress your system with the extra tensioner puts on. The RX system just uses a separate belt as that is the beiggest stress any component puts on the belt, and ask SC owners that have had belt failures. I assume as you dont have the credentials showing you are trained in this industry it is someone else manipulating you with this stuff.

But I have corrected you with the facts time and again and yet you still come into each thread posting false statements. I know you qualify them with "in your opinion", but the facts have been given time and again. If your not aware, I have been doing this for over 38 years, and have been known as a FI specialist for much of those years. And I have yet to slam the IPF system....lookat my replies. It works, we both use the same head unit, we just designed ours the way we did to address issues past systems have had over the years and to add flexability for those wanting different power options.

2. What pictures? There is an oil evac system with the IPF system, call IPF and they can explain it to you.

I have, they have to date refused to even give a description, much less pictures....yet I go into great detail. But I thought you have the system? Do you not know what you have?

3. I found dyno's for three IPF systems, and 1/4 mile time for one. Of course proof the system works is important, and all I did was say I haven't seen any numbers on the RX system, please show me where they are.

Don't understand what I am lying about? The OP asked for opinions and I gave mine. Sorry you get upset with my opinions. I never called you a liar like you did me, but I have been called worse on tis thread.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but in this entire forum I can only find one dyno graph, but as I have pointed out to you everytime I see you post untruths about the RX system I can only take that as your choosing to lie. I point each out in detail everytime you do....but again, I suspect some one is "playing/manipulating" you as you keep saying "as I understand".

So, since you have the system, praise it while condeming ours, can YOU please post your dyno graphs and 1/4 mile times? Can YOU eplain and post a picture of the oilseparating crankcase evacuation system you praise? Why IPF will not is the only real area I wonder why if they truely have a effective solution, as it would be the first FI company besides us to have one. (read the threads on all the issues everyone else has with systems done incorrectly, this is critical with the LLT & LFX).

So, agin, I see no reason anyone choosing to should not buy the system you did.....and thats why I am not interfering in YOUR threads and do not slam theirs.

[SC2150]

Originally Posted by Fr3e4gent

That car was the company's I was first customer with the kit. I would know because they made the instruction guide for the kit using my car.

I am 20yrs old not a UTI grad with years of experience in cars so ask me realistic questions, your questions can only be answered by IPF. I did not install or create the kit.

Make It Rain can speak for himself.

No offense but you guys are ganging up on me when I suggested to not bash each other or the companies.
I am on here to show everyone the kit and what I have experienced with it. Not here to get put into the ground.
I definitely don't know most facts on RX's kit because I have IPF. You guys might have RX but don't have IPF so leave your storytelling at home. Because when most of you talk about IPF, it's nonsense as well.

I will not post pictures of inside my hood because it seems unnecessary. Explain please. I have had the SC for over 3 months, no problem. The company has 2 other cars with the SC, 1 had it for a year and the other(LFX) 3 months too and those have no problem either. SC2150, I understand you are confused but talk to IPF as a company to another company.

Also. My question about fuel economy was unanswered.

Brandon.

Smoke1lt drove 1100 miles home with a average of highway & city of over 26 (he did not do a reset from the 16 or so it showed from before).

There is nothing different enough in either to give one more or lessfuel economy.....but again, I was only asking you as you state in most of your posts "PM me with questions on the IPF system"....so I was asking as you offered since IPF refuses to. And why would you not want to show pictures of your system? Aren't you proud of it and want to show it off? EVERY system we build has detailed pictures....

[SIXJAK]

Originally Posted by Fr3e4gent

I was the first with the kit, I've posted videos and you have seen the pics.

If me vouching for what Make It Rain said is true than you have trust issues.
=)

Also the installation guide was made using my car.

Enough bashing each company's kits. Yes both are in demand by customers and there will be some contest between the two but let's keep it nice on here. Unless you could magically arm wrestle over the Internet.

If anyone has questions about the IPF kit, please feel free to message me. I have had mine for over 3 months now.

Um question, I have not seen it yet.. What is the fuel economy of with RX system for both city and highway?

The IPF SC gets 28mpg on highway at 75-80mph And 17mpg city.

My query for Make it Rain is really based on the fact that I'm not even sure he has in fact purchased two kits for his kids/grand kids etc. everyone else one here has posted up vids, pics, dyno sheets, a write up....something to demonstrate that they in fact have an FI system.

No where in my post do I knock IPF's SC kit. I'm envious right now that you have one and I don't yet. I'm glad you post here and that you're part of the V6 community. The only thing that I've said that perhaps could be construed as a knock on IPF is that the IPF system is currently not compatible with existing mods. I know they are feverishly working to remedy this.

All of my mods in my sig below are well documented with pics and/or vids here in this forum. I don't think anybody here has any doubts about whether or not I've done these mods. I believe you when you post here about your FI mod. That's all I'm sayin.

It's not that I don't believe Make it Rain, I just have no justification TO believe him because there is no evidence here to cause me to believe that he SC'd 2 cars....unless there's a thread detailing his FI builds I don't know about. More than that, I'd just like to see the cars as I think it would be very cool. I follow a lot of builds on here because it's fun.

[Fr3e4gent]

Originally Posted by SIXJAK

My query for Make it Rain is really based on the fact that I'm not even sure he has in fact purchased two kits for his kids/grand kids etc. everyone else one here has posted up vids, pics, dyno sheets, a write up....something to demonstrate that they in fact have an FI system.

No where in my post do I knock IPF's SC kit. I'm envious right now that you have one and I don't yet. I'm glad you post here and that you're part of the V6 community. The only thing that I've said that perhaps could be construed as a knock on IPF is that the IPF system is currently not compatible with existing mods. I know they are feverishly working to remedy this.

All of my mods in my sig below are well documented with pics and/or vids here in this forum. I don't think anybody here has any doubts about whether or not I've done these mods. I believe you when you post here about your FI mod. That's all I'm sayin.

It's not that I don't believe Make it Rain, I just have no justification TO believe him because there is no evidence here to cause me to believe that he SC'd 2 cars....unless there's a thread detailing his FI builds I don't know about. More than that, I'd just like to see the cars as I think it would be very cool. I follow a lot of builds on here because it's fun.

I spoke with IPF, he did buy them and they were shipped.

There will be mods soon such as headers. The IPF system should work with any mod just needs to be tuned properly.

[MrGood]

And so it continues. I for one am dying to see make it rain answer the questions Tracy has asked.... So...?

[Fr3e4gent]

Originally Posted by SC2150

Smoke1lt drove 1100 miles home with a average of highway & city of over 26 (he did not do a reset from the 16 or so it showed from before).

There is nothing different enough in either to give one more or lessfuel economy.....but again, I was only asking you as you state in most of your posts "PM me with questions on the IPF system"....so I was asking as you offered since IPF refuses to. And why would you not want to show pictures of your system? Aren't you proud of it and want to show it off? EVERY system we build has detailed pictures....

"So, since you have the system, praise it while condeming ours, can YOU please post your dyno graphs and 1/4 mile times? Can YOU eplain and post a picture of the oilseparating crankcase evacuation system you praise? Why IPF will not is the only real area I wonder why if they truely have a effective solution, as it would be the first FI company besides us to have one. (read the threads on all the issues everyone else has with systems done incorrectly, this is critical with the LLT & LFX).

So, agin, I see no reason anyone choosing to not buy the system you did.....and thats why I am not interfering in YOUR threads"

I am trying to keep the peace here.

I do like my car and I am fortunate to get the first IPF kit. What I don't like is the question why you want to see the crankcase?I am sure both company's system is the same but to me I feel like your searching for ideas. If IPF won't than I am curious if they have the same thoughts as me. Not saying that you are but I am very cautious to certain questions. This is similar to a friend asking to see your homework to compare answers.

I would believe they have an effective solution because I have not experienced a single problem. No oil leaks, in fact just got my oil changed from 5,000 miles and there was no problem. Especially here in Arizona the temperatures are over 100 everyday in the summer. There has been no change or problem with the kit since I got it.

As a customer and reviewing of the company's kit... I see no reason to be confronted with subsumptions that there is problems with the kit because if something happens, I would tell everyone. I see no reason to lie, is there one?

SC2150 Please PM, not post on a thread. My dyno sheet has already been uploaded
319wtq & 391whp
and 1/4th times will be this friday at the track, if I can get off work early.


When you say you have yet to do any bashing, you have done a little. Just pointing it out but so have I when I first joined this website.

Furthermore both systems are great and who ever chooses 1 or the other will be greatful and will love it. Both companies have lots of customers with positive feedback.

Brandon

[KMPrenger]

As far as I'm concerned, nobody HAS to answer to anything. Both companies and both kits seem great to me. Make It Rain wanted to see numbers for the RX SC kit and when there were no numbers yet available, he went with the only other choice. Can't blame him for that.

When spending 6+ grand you need to search for a trustworthy and hopefully proven product, or at least go with a company that will support you after the purchase.

I think both RX and IPF would do that, and honestly I wouldn't be scared to go in either direction.

RX has had somewhat of a delay or hold up on getting dyno numbers out for its SC kit, which I think has caused some of the "bashing" issues we've seen to date. But really, through driver impressions and videos, the car really seems to run great. Its only a matter of time before we see the RX SC kit putting down the numbers on the dyno and at the strip.

IPF had one hell of hiccup with their initial announcement of their kit when they showed a video of their SC car against an SS with no real numbers. The bashing took place, they dissapeared, but now they are back with what looks to be a good product and gaining respect.

Again, in the end there is no real reason to bash either of these kits right now. They have their differences of course and one may be more appealing than the other depending on your situation.

Now lets keep the thread moving forward.

[SIXJAK]

Originally Posted by Fr3e4gent

I spoke with IPF, he did buy them and they were shipped.

There will be mods soon such as headers. The IPF system should work with any mod just needs to be tuned properly.

It's the Internet. Anybody, and I mean anybody can say anything. Where is the proof? Where is Make it Rain and his 2 SC'd V6 Camaros? Ultimately, he doesn't owe anybody anything but until he does, I don't have to buy his story either. It's pretty simple.

I am well aware that IPF is working on tunes that are compatible with LT headers and other mods which is awesome.

Each system has its +'s and -'s. A lot like Nitrous vs. TC vs. TTC vs. SC. We all have to figure out what suits each of us best.

Back in nov-dec I was very interested in the IPF SC kit. Their lack of communication and follow up to some very basic questions kinda turned me away. I'm not going to hold that over their heads for the rest of my life but it is what it is. They lost a customer because to me they just kind if disappeared after making such a big splash. kinda like Lingenfelter, Hennessey and a couple of other small speed shops that have promised the world and delivered exactly nothing over the past 2 1/2 yrs.

Kudos to IPF for hanging in there and putting together what seems to be a solid kit. As it stands right now however, their kit is not compatible with what I've done to my car nor am I certain that the warranty they offer would be compatible with my mods. Does that make it a bad system? No it's just not for me at this time. I'd have to spend a lot more than 5695.00 plus the cost of install to make this system work for me. The anodized black does not work for me either. I'd be spending a lot more $ with IPF to get what I'm getting from RX.

The tuning options with each system are different as well. I do like the idea of a set it and forget it tune that comes with the IPF set up but that solution does not work for me taking into account the rest of my mods.

I hope that helps.

[SC2150]

One thing I dosee in the description is this: CNC machined billet aluminum crankcase vent tank w/ mounting bracket & hardware.

You are not using a crankcase evacuation system? The description sounds like you are just venting crankcase pressure to a vented tank...Correct me if I am wrong in this assumption.

Vented crankcase is illegal in all 50 states (again, it may just be the way you worded it, but please give details).

When the evacuation process is deleted, then only excess crankcase pressure is dealt with. The damaging combustion byproducts are then left in the crankcase if not evacuated while still in a suspended state and the damage these compounds cause over time shorten engine life.

If you post pictures for all to see with an explanation then no one will wonder why the reluctance to show this.

Here is a good read for those not understanding the inportance of proper crankcase evacuation. All streetcars this is extremely critical:

Now, some will ask, "why not just delete the PCV and run breathers"? This is where we find the PCV system is the most misunderstood system on cars today and almost NO techs today, or aftermarket performance shops/vendors understand. First, most beleive it is just to releive excess crankcase pressure. This is true, but it does far more. Every internal combustion engine has a small amount of blow-by even if sealed well. This blow-by consists of unburnt fuel, water vapor,carbon particles (very abrasive), sulfer, and other compounds that are harmfull to the motor and the PCV system evacuates, or "flushes" these compounds out while they are still suspended in the gasses. If they are NOT evacuated before the enginne is shut down and cooled, they condense and mix into the oil. The moost damaging are the fuel as it dilutes the oil, the carbon particles (to small for the oil filter to remove) as they are very abbrasive, and the water & sulfur, and other compounds mix to form sulfuric acid. An oil analysis will show the levels of these compounds as well as other metals from wear. The sulfuric acid after it reaches a certain PPM will begin to etch the bearing & journals surfaces leading to premature wear and possible failure. The water causes corrosion.

This is a condensed explanation but one that most can follow and understand. Techs the last few generations have been trained only to diagnose and swap parts...not how these systems work so we are "dumbing down" service techs to just be flat-rate parts changers so very few dealer service departments know any of this any more.

Visualize how a crankcase is evacuated properly. On the 3.6, metered,filtered fresh air enters the rear of the drivers side valve cover, trvels around the valve train, down the oil returns, through the crankcase, (all the time pulling and flushing these compounds with it), up the passenger side past the valve train and out the rear of the passenger side valve cover where it is drawn into the intake manifold and is burned in the combustion chamber and further in the cats.

A proper functioning catchcan is simply plumbed inline between the passenger side valve cover oulet and the center of the intake manifold so it can condense and trap the oil before it enters the intake air charge. They need to be emptied every oil change, and the oil is NOT to be resued as it is full of contaminates. Dispose of with the rest of the drain oil properly.

[ASH@IPF-TUNING]

Hi everybody !

i'm a member of the design team at IPF-TUNING.COM

The IPF SC System was designed to be able to be road legal in most parts of the USA , EUROPA and ASIA .

For the EU application the following design rules were set by the government :

1) Crankcase Vents must be recirculated into the intake system AFTER the AFM
2) charge air must be recirculated into the intake system AFTER the AFM
3) Crankcase System must put ALWAYS a little vacuum on the crankcase !

For this reason we designed a recirculation charge air dump from the SC pressure side into the SC intake system .

All crankcase vents were collected into a oil catch tank to drain all oil spray and other corrosive fluids from the engine blowby and all the rest is vented into the SC intake system !

regards ASH@EDS

[SC2150]

Originally Posted by ASH@EDS

Hi everybody !

i'm a member of the design team at IPF-TUNING.COM

The IPF SC System was designed to be able to be road legal in most parts of the USA , EUROPA and ASIA .

For the EU application the following design rules were set by the government :

1) Crankcase Vents must be recirculated into the intake system AFTER the AFM
2) charge air must be recirculated into the intake system AFTER the AFM
3) Crankcase System must put ALWAYS a little vacuum on the crankcase !

For this reason we designed a recirculation charge air dump from the SC pressure side into the SC intake system .

All crankcase vents were collected into a oil catch tank to drain all oil spray and other corrosive fluids from the engine blowby and all the rest is vented into the SC intake system !

regards ASH@EDS

Thats what I have been trying for months to get answered. Thanks!! Straight answers from someone that knows his stuff.

[Fr3e4gent]

Thank you Ash =)

Also IPF is in the process of shipping an LLT kit and LFX kit to China =)