So...I test drove the new 2012 WRX STI

[justa25thTA]

Originally Posted by SleepWarz

I think all these people with degrees need to stop taking their cuts from people who actually do the hard work.

Subaru, I'd love to have one for camping and logging road cruises.

If getting a degree is so easy (since I don't do any hard work), why don't you get one?

[JusticePete]

Union began hundred of years ago with a key element being apprenticeships and thee teachings of a trade. My grandfather (born in 1895) was a union organizer in Chicago. Heath and Safety along with a livable wage were the issues of the day. The work force desperately needed unions as advocates at that time. The pendulum swung on the 60s too far to the labor side. That is my opinion.

I am a business owner and have been for many years. I received my college education at the University of Illinois. Some of my employees have degrees and some don't. I do not measure thier value based on a sheet of paper. I measure it by thier contribution to the success and growth of my business. There is no such thing as a menial task at Pedders. Everyone is expected to do whatever it takes here in the USA and in AU. No one is above taking out the garbage. Do some make more than others? Absolutely. Would anyone last in our orgaization in the USA or AU that considered cleaning the shop floor to be a menial task? Not on my watch.

The stronger the middle class in the USA the better we all will be. I know there is 'cheap' labor available in Mexico, India and China. The question we face is do we want to compete with that labor force on wages or do we want to compete with that labor force by skill, productivity and quality? If we import third world wages (transplant mfgs) we must accept the fact that we are importing the same standard of living. In order to compete, foreign markets must be as open as our markets. This isn't a political or sophisticated economical theory. It is commonsense business.

Would I buy an Asian vehicle? Absolutely not. There are countries I will not travel to because of thier contempt for for the USA. I also will not buy brand-x suspension parts. It has nothing to do with the quality of those parts, it has to do with my belief on our products and my commitment to the success of my company. That is protectionist or closed market thinking. I know where my bread is buttered. There is an old expression. Even a dog don't shxx where it eats. As consumers we need to remember that and so do we as a country.

The fight isn't here between business owners and workers or 'degreed' vs no-'degreed' workers or even political parties. The fight is with everyone out side our borders that want to export the American Dream at our expense.

[Sleestack]

Originally Posted by SSOOCH

At the end of the day it's still a Subaru...

Ya, not really upscale like a GM..... can u pass the Grey Poupon...

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

Here we go, another economics debate filled with protectionism and backyard economics. It never fails.

[hypurone]

Originally Posted by mouse

Mine was not Stock!, CAI, 3" non cat exhaust,, Larger iner-cooler, larger injectors, underdrive pullys, street-port on housings, Pettit-Racing Computer. 3mm-Apex seals. Giant Alum Radiator, for extra cooling, Rotarys produce heat like Atomic Reactors. My 2ss/rs vert is as good looking, as the "7" , more comfortable to drive, almost as fast, but a 4200 lb car just can't handle and be as tossable as a 2700 lb car. The Wife and I really like the Camaro a lot, but I Loved the 3rd Gen RX-7, and yes I know! it was a Rice burner.

I do miss mine some days...

But then I go out in the garage and

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Union began hundred of years ago with a key element being apprenticeships and thee teachings of a trade. My grandfather (born in 1895) was a union organizer in Chicago. Heath and Safety along with a livable wage were the issues of the day. The work force desperately needed unions as advocates at that time. The pendulum swung on the 60s too far to the labor side. That is my opinion.

I am a business owner and have been for many years. I received my college education at the University of Illinois. Some of my employees have degrees and some don't. I do not measure thier value based on a sheet of paper. I measure it by thier contribution to the success and growth of my business. There is no such thing as a menial task at Pedders. Everyone is expected to do whatever it takes here in the USA and in AU. No one is above taking out the garbage. Do some make more than others? Absolutely. Would anyone last in our orgaization in the USA or AU that considered cleaning the shop floor to be a menial task? Not on my watch.

So do you pay the people that take out the trash and wash the shop floor the same wage you pay the individuals that contribute to new product design and development? Of course not. Are any of your employees paid near minimum wage? I'm sure I could work just as hard at making some new suspension components for you as any current employee you have. The product would end up being a hunk of junk, but I'd deserve the same wage, right? You are dancing around the base of the debate. Do you honestly believe that the people bolting wheels onto the cars are contributing $73/hr to General Motors' further development as an international company? It'd be great if we could all get compensated based on effort, but that's not how the world works.

The stronger the middle class in the USA the better we all will be. I know there is 'cheap' labor available in Mexico, India and China. The question we face is do we want to compete with that labor force on wages or do we want to compete with that labor force by skill, productivity and quality? If we import third world wages (transplant mfgs) we must accept the fact that we are importing the same standard of living. In order to compete, foreign markets must be as open as our markets. This isn't a political or sophisticated economical theory. It is commonsense business.

The middle class can't go anywhere if the UAW forces the big three to pay their lowest salary employees higher and higher wages. When employees require too high of a salary, you find ways to pay less employees, like making layoffs. UAW requires higher wages for members, big three cuts down on employees to be able to pay the employees they require to stay afloat, and you directly contribute to the disappearing of the middle class. You act like it's just the import automakers that don't pay comparable rates to what the UAW requires of the big three. What about American companies like the fast food businesses you brought up? How about all the gas stations, grocery stores, bars, factories, private businesses, etc? Last time I checked, KFC and Kroger workers weren't costing their employers anywhere near $73/hr. What makes the assembly line workers and members of the UAW entitled to so much more wealth, or do you think every starting labor position should be compensated $16/hr plus benefits?

Would I buy an Asian vehicle? Absolutely not. There are countries I will not travel to because of thier contempt for for the USA. I also will not buy brand-x suspension parts. It has nothing to do with the quality of those parts, it has to do with my belief on our products and my commitment to the success of my company. That is protectionist or closed market thinking. I know where my bread is buttered. There is an old expression. Even a dog don't shxx where it eats. As consumers we need to remember that and so do we as a country.

How far do you take that position? Do you buy American made and assembled TVs, computers, furniture, materials, food. . . everything? Is all the gasoline you pump into your vehicles refined from American crude? Do you believe your own lifestyle could be supported by the US economy if every single product and material within it were US sourced? Absolutely not. You can't just decide you don't want trade with other countries for one product when our way of life can't possibly be sustained if we were to impose an embargo. Chevrolet sold just under 300,000 vehicles in China so far this year and over 300,000 in Brazil. They sold about 900,000 in the USA. If Chevy only sold vehicles in these three countries, exports to China and Brazil would make up 40% of GM's sales. That's something to keep in mind.


The fight isn't here between business owners and workers or 'degreed' vs no-'degreed' workers or even political parties. The fight is with everyone out side our borders that want to export the American Dream at our expense.

:flag1:

[Nessal]

Originally Posted by toesuf94

Subaru makes some neat cars...but since they are owned 20% by Toyota, I would not touch them with YOUR 10-foot pole.

Hell Toyota is more American than your Camaro...


oooh no I didn'tttttttt

[snizzle]

I agree. The WRX is just not a great looking car. Even though it's much more than a hype econobox, that's still what it looks like. The EVO was much more attractive.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by Nessal

Hell Toyota is more American than your Camaro...


oooh no I didn'tttttttt

Toyota will never be American until they move their headquarters to the US, no matter how much BS they spread.

[THUMPER20X]

Having owned both cars. The 5th is awesome looking and is a really sweet machine. However.... my 04 Sti was a much funner car and handled better, just as fast and got about twice the mileage. Im a huge rally fav so I may be biased. I'm actually looking at another 04 Sti right now. They are not rice, the wing is a little overdone but if you really see whats in them, even above the regular WRX the Sti is as much of a driving machine than a 5th gen,....... maybe even more as far as a drivers car. I pushed my STi closer to the edge and did far more radical driving than the 5th gen is capable of.

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by THUMPER20X

Having owned both cars. The 5th is awesome looking and is a really sweet machine. However.... my 04 Sti was a much funner car and handled better, just as fast and got about twice the mileage. Im a huge rally fav so I may be biased. I'm actually looking at another 04 Sti right now. They are not rice, the wing is a little overdone but if you really see whats in them, even above the regular WRX the Sti is as much of a driving machine than a 5th gen,....... maybe even more as far as a drivers car. I pushed my STi closer to the edge and did far more radical driving than the 5th gen is capable of.

I was with you until the last line. The 5th gen is an incredibly capable automobile.

[FINALLYSATISFIED]

Originally Posted by 04Ram2500Hemi

The WRX STI is a cool car. One of the main reasons I didn't go that route was because I'm a freaking ogre (6'9") so I had to have something big enough that I could fit in it. The Camaro 2SS is more than fast enough for me, and it's comfortable. However, if the WRX STI makes you happy, I say go for it. It's your money.

I'm 6'3 and the Camaro is a tight squeeze coming from a Challenger with obviously more room. So you being 6'9 has to be uncomfortable at times, especially on long drives. No one in hell is comfortable for you, no freakin' way.

[04Ram2500Hemi]

Originally Posted by MY1STCAMAR0

I'm 6'3 and the Camaro is a tight squeeze coming from a Challenger with obviously more room. So you being 6'9 has to be uncomfortable at times, especially on long drives. No one in hell is comfortable for you, no freakin' way.

Honestly it's not bad at all. The trick is to not have a sunroof (I wanted one but it would have never worked). My brother (the little guy at 6'5") and I took the Camaro for a road trip last fall and spent 3 hours in the car one way no stop and I was more than comfortable. I agree, the Challenger is a bigger car inside, and I really do like them. However, the price tag on the SRT-8 made it too high to consider for a toy car.

[philipdistefano]

Foreign vs. domestic is total bullcrap. Buy what you like and enjoy it. Half of the people here screaming about buying American probably have half of their goods made in China.