GM VP: Camaro Z28 confirmed (again)! 6th Gen Camaro on Alpha platform.

[BLUESMOKE69]

Originally Posted by LostInMoscow

Come on guys! A few years ago, I never dreamed that there would be a 500 HP+ Camaro! This is just awesome no matter how they do it! Happy days are here again! Enjoy them while they last. The future of performance isn't in V8s. This is the new golden age of V8 HP! We'll look back on this time later and smile, especially when all the newest Hi-Po cars are electric or 1/2 electric.

Eight cylinders will never completely disappear. They will continue to evolve to more fuel efficient smaller displacement engines. Also, car companies will build hybrid cars just like Ferrari did with the Hybrid 599GTB to lower their CAFE average. GM would be totally crazy to mess around with their Hi-Po cars by not having an eight cylinder engine as an option.

[rez333]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

"Weight Savings" alone....isn't worth diddly.

They are going to use Alpha...which was designed to be a better overall chassis. Supposedly, a large portion of that is weight savings...but there are other things about it, I'm sure...that justifies its development cost.

Also -- you really can't compare the platforms...Malibu and Alpha...FWD and RWD have too many components NOT in common to draw comparisons. For example...if you take your comparison to the Malibu...add a V8, a driveshaft and associated powertrain components to make it to the rear tires...wider tires, bigger brakes, etc and a change in structure to compensate....You could very easily see 300lbs AT LEAST added to the weight of the car....fwiw

If the next Camaro is in fact on the Alpha platform...the best advise I think we could take is to pay CLOSE attention to the new Caddy insiders are referring to as the "BMW killer" because the cars will be very close automotive cousins....this new VP claims they will beat them with tech and weight savings....so take a 3-series...subtract weight....MAYBE.....

If weight wise, the Camaro can compete with the 3 series, it would make me hate my Gen5 if I bought one. It's my greatest dream to have a light weight, high powered American sports car with 2+2 seating. We've had to make so many compromises (eg. settling for heavier cars) because American companies weren't up to snuff.

If GM were to release a 3 series weighted Camaro, it would be the perfect car and make the gen5 look like it's big fat ugly sister. But 2014 is so far away!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by rez333

If weight wise, the Camaro can compete with the 3 series, it would make me hate my Gen5 if I bought one. It's my greatest dream to have a light weight, high powered American sports car with 2+2 seating. We've had to make so many compromises (eg. settling for heavier cars) because American companies weren't up to snuff.

If GM were to release a 3 series weighted Camaro, it would be the perfect car and make the gen5 look like it's big fat ugly sister. But 2014 is so far away!

I would....disagree....

None of this (IF it happens like some are expecting) would give any reason to "hate" the 5thgen...not logically, anyways. It's still a BEAUTIFUL car...arguably the best-looking car on the road today...and Camaro designs have always tended to be timeless.

The M3 is much smaller than the Camaro, it uses all sorts of lightweight materials...yet is only weighs 150 lbs less than the manual SS. And the 535i, a better match to the Camaro's size, weighs 4000+lbs with a V6!!. So...at a price almost 30k less, how is it Chevy wasn't "up to snuff?"

Despite my earlier statements...I don't expect to see any more than a 300lbs reduction by switching to Alpha...at MOST. But I'm no engineer, and the GM folks seem determined -- so who knows?

[Qdiesel]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Don't get me wrong. I don't even know if there's that much to gain out of that exhaust while still keeping the manifolds and cats'; I'm just saying It's my understanding that exhaust is around 2.5", so maybe coming up to ZR1-sizes would yield better flow. I can't say I wouldn't want a 600 horse' Z28, though I'm really only looking to get the car up to about 550-600 at the tires anyways, so it should be even easier to reach that goal, reliably, if GM can get the numbers that high

A man can dream can't he???

[LostInMoscow]

Originally Posted by BLUESMOKE69

Eight cylinders will never completely disappear. They will continue to evolve to more fuel efficient smaller displacement engines. Also, car companies will build hybrid cars just like Ferrari did with the Hybrid 599GTB to lower their CAFE average. GM would be totally crazy to mess around with their Hi-Po cars by not having an eight cylinder engine as an option.

I hope you are right! However, your statement about GM having to be totally crazy doesn't give me a warm fuzzy. They've shown their lunacy before - know anybody that has an '83 'vette? I'd love to see them do something like develop a super efficient DI V8 or V10 even. It seems that even Audi and BMW are going to turbo sixes now too. I guess we'll see...........

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by LostInMoscow

I'd love to see them do something like develop a super efficient DI V8...........

Odd you mention that.....

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80458

They are....and they're going to kick ass!!!

[daphatgrant]

[camaro1324]

2015 was just a prediction from Motor Trend, right?

Why don't they use the alpha platform on the 5th gens?

[OverZeaLouS]

Sounds like the 6th gen camaro might be that cross between an engine that's muscular and a chassis that's true sports car agile... imagine a camaro that competes against bmw m3, and 370z in handling. Yet has the unrivaled power of a v8 muscle car. I been waiting for GM to do something like this since 1992. Maybe I can start buying american again??? Lol.

[OverZeaLouS]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I would....disagree....

None of this (IF it happens like some are expecting) would give any reason to "hate" the 5thgen...not logically, anyways. It's still a BEAUTIFUL car...arguably the best-looking car on the road today...and Camaro designs have always tended to be timeless.

The M3 is much smaller than the Camaro, it uses all sorts of lightweight materials...yet is only weighs 150 lbs less than the manual SS. And the 535i, a better match to the Camaro's size, weighs 4000+lbs with a V6!!. So...at a price almost 30k less, how is it Chevy wasn't "up to snuff?"

Despite my earlier statements...I don't expect to see any more than a 300lbs reduction by switching to Alpha...at MOST. But I'm no engineer, and the GM folks seem determined -- so who knows?

Weight isn't the only factor in a car not being up to snuff. The camaro. Though kool looking and agile for its size. Is SUV wide, has a 112 inch wheelbase which does not allow for sharp handling and is nose heavy in aggressive driving compared to a BMW M3.
GM needs to shrink the wheelbase by 6 to 8 inches. And reduce weight to 3500lbs.
If the 6th gen kept the same horspower, reduced the wheelbase and weight by the stated and stayed in the price of affordability. Then the camaro will be unstoppable. Yes there is a 30k price tag over on the bimmer. But that price tag isn't just power. The amount of technology packed into an M3 is ridiculous.
Either way. Stracke said he's aiming at bimmer for performance. Audi on interiors. He looking in the right places. The camaro was built to destroy the mustang. Stracke sees that the world market looks seriously on a combination of high performance, reliability and AGILITY. Agility has been selling cars more than power has. The athlete vs the bodybuilder, in the auto world most choose the athlete in the world market.
GM has made cars only for middle america. Going this direction will bring GM to the front of the world market.

[AZCamaroFan]

Originally Posted by camaro1324

2015 was just a prediction from Motor Trend, right?

Why don't they use the alpha platform on the 5th gens?

Because Alpha hasn't gone into production yet.

[OldJedi]

"Either way. Stracke said he's aiming at bimmer for performance. Audi on interiors. He looking in the right places. The camaro was built to destroy the mustang. Stracke sees that the world market looks seriously on a combination of high performance, reliability and AGILITY. Agility has been selling cars more than power has. The athlete vs the bodybuilder, in the auto world most choose the athlete in the world market."

Aiming for BMW and Audi instead of just Mustang is a very zealous leap for GM thinking. It will be tough but not impossible to improve build quality and performance and keep the pricing in check. I am glad to see that GM is expanding it's target. Now GM has to make their words a reality, starting with the the Z28.

[Shurenuff]

Originally Posted by OldJedi

"Either way. Stracke said he's aiming at bimmer for performance. Audi on interiors. He looking in the right places. The camaro was built to destroy the mustang. Stracke sees that the world market looks seriously on a combination of high performance, reliability and AGILITY. Agility has been selling cars more than power has. The athlete vs the bodybuilder, in the auto world most choose the athlete in the world market."

Aiming for BMW and Audi instead of just Mustang is a very zealous leap for GM thinking. It will be tough but not impossible to improve build quality and performance and keep the pricing in check. I am glad to see that GM is expanding it's target. Now GM has to make their words a reality, starting with the the Z28.

Good points. With the 5th gen platform being what it is, I don't see a way to truly implement this approach until the 6th gen.

With that being said, I'm very interested to see what GM comes up with in regards to the rumored 2012 interior redesign for the Camaro. I'm hoping they offer different level interiors, with the high end package offering high quality materials (ie real aluminum trim instead of faux aluminum painted plastic, etc). It's not realistic for a car that starts in the low 20's to offer an Audi level interior, but I'm hoping GM steps up their game starting with the 2012 model.

[rez333]

I think the faux aluminum is the worst aspect of the Gen5 interior. People keep saying that it looks good blah blah blah, but when I look at it, it clearly looks to me to be silver colored plastic.

I've seen some 4 year old mustangs where the silver paint has worn off the plastic and the result is hideous.

With regards to Stracke's target cars, I agree with everyone that GM is heading in the right direction. Always aim for the top, then if you don't reach there at least you're second best. You aim for the middle, and if you don't reach the middle you're below average.

The next gen cars should be ABSOLUTELY amazing. They will stun some people at how good they are I think (if Stracke can follow through), so much so that you will look at your gen 5 and feel it is lacking, even if it does look terrific. Just my prediction.