Shno's House of Z

[Jeb114]

Most of you forget Emissions. GM's Camaro being the only American gas hog last year was not a public relation win. The bar is getting tighter not wider. They absolutely have to put the money into eco engines, it's 95% of there sales.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

Just curious what gives you that impression? The Corvette still got the LT1, LT4, M7 and A8 before any other vehicles.

Where it makes sense, sure - Corvette is the perfect test-bed, and profit-generator to try new, 'crazy' things.

Camaro pushed many performance "boundaries" over the course of this 5th generation. And it's been stated a couple times that development teams have been told to "just make it fast"...never minding Corvette limits. Camaro was the first car to play with true downforce in the ZL1. First to mess with heat extractors, A/C deletes, awesome racing seats. It was the risk-taker for dramatic styling, black "racing" wheels, etc.

Don't mistake my comments for meaning that the Corvette won't be fast, or special. It is, and will continue to be. I just don't think it's being artificially protected, any more. Think back to the 4th-gen, where the hopped-up LS1 in the Camaro was rated at 325hp...while Vette had 350...they were both the same, at least. That's not going to happen, anymore.

Originally Posted by Jeb114

GM's Camaro being the only American gas hog last year

It was?

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

Where it makes sense, sure - Corvette is the perfect test-bed, and profit-generator to try new, 'crazy' things.

Camaro pushed many performance "boundaries" over the course of this 5th generation. And it's been stated a couple times that development teams have been told to "just make it fast"...never minding Corvette limits. Camaro was the first car to play with true downforce in the ZL1. First to mess with heat extractors, A/C deletes, awesome racing seats. It was the risk-taker for dramatic styling, black "racing" wheels, etc.

Don't mistake my comments for meaning that the Corvette won't be fast, or special. It is, and will continue to be. I just don't think it's being artificially protected, any more. Think back to the 4th-gen, where the hopped-up LS1 in the Camaro was rated at 325hp...while Vette had 350...they were both the same, at least. That's not going to happen, anymore.

Sure, they could do all they want with aero, heat extractors, racing seats, A/C delete and all that stuff but the Camaro will never be faster than the Corvette, comparing equal models. All that work to the Camaro has no impact on the Corvette. They don't share bodywork, aero pieces or that kind of stuff. The stuff they do share, like engines and transmissions, the Corvette will always come first, which I think is a mistake. The Mustang has no such limit and the Hellcat Challenger makes more than the Viper. If GM wants the Camaro to compete at all levels, then they need to develop engines to do so. The LT1 and LT4 won't be enough.

Even the ultimate track Camaro didn't get a single extra horsepower when they developed it. The only reason the Camaro got the LS7 was because the Corvette didn't need it anymore. The ironic thing is the Camaro needs more horsepower than the Corvette but doesn't get it.

[Mr. Wyndham]

The ZL1 was benchmarked against the C6 Grand Sport...and I'm fairly certain the Z/28 made the Z06 pucker up....but so long as the Corvette sports a supercharged engine...you're right - the Camaro will never be faster, spec for spec...

...as it should be.

But I have a funny feeling this new generation is going to break some "rules".

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

The ZL1 was benchmarked against the C6 Grand Sport...and I'm fairly certain the Z/28 made the Z06 pucker up....but so long as the Corvette sports a supercharged engine...you're right - the Camaro will never be faster, spec for spec...

...as it should be.

But I have a funny feeling this new generation is going to break some "rules".

I have no doubt they will be taking the 6th gen Camaro very seriously. I just don't see them taking it seriously enough to develop a one off engine for a Z/28.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

I have no doubt they will be taking the 6th gen Camaro very seriously. I just don't see them taking it seriously enough to develop a one off engine for a Z/28.

Maybe not one off but co-developed with Corvette for a GS or ZR1 or ??

Gen 3 mag ride appeared on the ZL1 first. The Z/28's brakes were co developed with the C7 Z06 team but appeared on the Camaro first.

Things seem different. They want to build the best car possible

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by hotlapZL1

Maybe not one off but co-developed with Corvette for a GS or ZR1 or ??

Gen 3 mag ride appeared on the ZL1 first. The Z/28's brakes were co developed with the C7 Z06 team but appeared on the Camaro first.

Things seem different. They want to build the best car possible

Possibly a GS, but that doesn't seem likely. The C6 GS came around towards the end of the C6 lifespan to pump up sales.

If they do build a ZR1, I would expect it to have a supercharged or turbocharged engine, which don't belong in the Z/28 anyways.

Yes, the 3rd gen mag ride was first on the ZL1 and the Z/28 got the CCBs first but that's not my point. The 5th gen Z/28 was built because they had the LS7. They had the LS7 because of the Corvette.

They are building the best car they can, with the parts they have. That doesn't mean they will be allowed to develop the appropriate power train for a 6th gen Z/28.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

Possibly a GS, but that doesn't seem likely. The C6 GS came around towards the end of the C6 lifespan to pump up sales.

If they do build a ZR1, I would expect it to have a supercharged or turbocharged engine, which don't belong in the Z/28 anyways.

Yes, the 3rd gen mag ride was first on the ZL1 and the Z/28 got the CCBs first but that's not my point. The 5th gen Z/28 was built because they had the LS7. They had the LS7 because of the Corvette.

They are building the best car they can, with the parts they have. That doesn't mean they will be allowed to develop the appropriate power train for a 6th gen Z/28.

I understand your point. GM has a bigger umbrella given the Corvette, Camaro and V. Engine development has (needs) to overlap and has always favored Corvette. However, recent behavior shows a seriousness toward Camaro and a willingness to release Corvette tech in it first.

I don't see another NA engine for Z/28 happening. Following C7 Z51, the 1LE will be the NA track car and FI will be used on the Z/28, ZL1

[JusticePete]

Track ready engines do not have to be NA.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by hotlapZL1

I understand your point. GM has a bigger umbrella given the Corvette, Camaro and V. Engine development has (needs) to overlap and has always favored Corvette. However, recent behavior shows a seriousness toward Camaro and a willingness to release Corvette tech in it first.

I don't see another NA engine for Z/28 happening. Following C7 Z51, the 1LE will be the NA track car and FI will be used on the Z/28, ZL1

If they don't have a good N/A engine in the pipeline, then they should drop the Z/28 badge. There is no need to use it when they have the ZL1.

I guess we have to wait and see how far that willingness will go. 10 days and counting for the first taste.

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Track ready engines do not have to be NA.

I'm not saying they do but GM needs something to counter the 5.2 Voodoo and the future GT500 engine. I don't see the LT4 doing both effectively.

[JusticePete]

Attention in the HouZ!

Ben Parker was an EOD and also is a Camaro owner. Ben was medically retired about two years ago. He could use your votes.

http://yourherosnamehere.nascar.com/

Benjamin Parker, 28, of Cincinnati, O.H. is a retired army Staff Sergeant who was deployed to Afghanistan twice as an Explosive Ordnance Disposal Team Leader. Safely disarming more than 300 IEDs and saving countless lives during his tours of duty, Parker received two bronze stars for his bravery. “I don’t consider what I did heroic I was just doing my job,” said Parker. “I am deeply honored and humbled to be a finalist.” After his second tour, Parker returned home and was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis. Devastated to have to end his army career, Parker decided to pursue another passion and against all odds received his pilot’s license and now works as an aircraft mechanic. Born in Indianapolis, Parker is an avid NASCAR fan and used to set alarms and call his dad from a satellite phone overseas so they could watch races together. Parker looks forward to returning to the Brickyard 400 as a finalist and watching his favorite driver Dale Earnhardt Jr.



The contest allows Chicago style voting. Vote early and vote often!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

Possibly a GS, but that doesn't seem likely. The C6 GS came around towards the end of the C6 lifespan to pump up sales.

If they do build a ZR1, I would expect it to have a supercharged or turbocharged engine, which don't belong in the Z/28 anyways.

Yes, the 3rd gen mag ride was first on the ZL1 and the Z/28 got the CCBs first but that's not my point. The 5th gen Z/28 was built because they had the LS7. They had the LS7 because of the Corvette.

They are building the best car they can, with the parts they have. That doesn't mean they will be allowed to develop the appropriate power train for a 6th gen Z/28.

They might be encouraged to do so! Z28.R, and competitive 1LEs are winning everywhere.

Camaro is getting it's own unveil. Corvette didn't get that.

I still say they have something planned. Even if it's a hopped-up, raced-out "version" of the LT1.

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

If they don't have a good N/A engine in the pipeline, then they should drop the Z/28 badge. There is no need to use it when they have the ZL1.

I completely disagree. I think it's so very narrow-minded to lose such a hallowed name just because of the method of induction. (No offense intended) That's like arguing the ZL1 is a foul reincarnation because it uses a mainstream supercharged Cadillac engine, instead of a 427.

There are other, more important features to a car that were not shared between the original Z/28 and the 5th-gen Z. But nobody complained, or hardly noticed those.

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Attention in the HouZ!

Ben Parker was an EOD and also is a Camaro owner. Ben was medically retired about two years ago. He could use your votes.

http://yourherosnamehere.nascar.com/

Benjamin Parker, 28, of Cincinnati, O.H. is a retired army Staff Sergeant who was deployed to Afghanistan twice as an Explosive Ordnance Disposal Team Leader. Safely disarming more than 300 IEDs and saving countless lives during his tours of duty, Parker received two bronze stars for his bravery. “I don’t consider what I did heroic I was just doing my job,” said Parker. “I am deeply honored and humbled to be a finalist.” After his second tour, Parker returned home and was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis. Devastated to have to end his army career, Parker decided to pursue another passion and against all odds received his pilot’s license and now works as an aircraft mechanic. Born in Indianapolis, Parker is an avid NASCAR fan and used to set alarms and call his dad from a satellite phone overseas so they could watch races together. Parker looks forward to returning to the Brickyard 400 as a finalist and watching his favorite driver Dale Earnhardt Jr.



The contest allows Chicago style voting. Vote early and vote often!

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Bhobbs

I'm not saying they do but GM needs something to counter the 5.2 Voodoo and the future GT500 engine. I don't see the LT4 doing both effectively.

A LT4 equipped Z/28 should handle the GT350 easily considering the power advantage and gen6 under hood space to accommodate bookoo cooling. I'm even more interested to see how close a 1LE can get to the GT350 for a fraction of the cost

Competing with the next GT500 (I guess) will take more than GM has now

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Attention in the HouZ!

Ben Parker was an EOD and also is a Camaro owner. Ben was medically retired about two years ago. He could use your votes.

Voted and calendar reminder to return tomorrow

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

They might be encouraged to do so! Z28.R, and competitive 1LEs are winning everywhere.

Camaro is getting it's own unveil. Corvette didn't get that.

I still say they have something planned. Even if it's a hopped-up, raced-out "version" of the LT1.

I completely disagree. I think it's so very narrow-minded to lose such a hallowed name just because of the method of induction. (No offense intended) That's like arguing the ZL1 is a foul reincarnation because it uses a mainstream supercharged Cadillac engine, instead of a 427.

There are other, more important features to a car that were not shared between the original Z/28 and the 5th-gen Z. But nobody complained, or hardly noticed those.

Time will tell. I've been wrong before once or twice haha.

No offense taken. I feel like after the work put in to the 5th gen Z/28, they should continue that path or not bring it back, especially when they have the perfect badge to use for a supercharged, comfort laden car. The ZL1 wasn't even a regular production car so I don't think it has the same cachet as the Z/28.

Originally Posted by hotlapZL1

A LT4 equipped Z/28 should handle the GT350 easily considering the power advantage and gen6 under hood space to accommodate bookoo cooling. I'm even more interested to see how close a 1LE can get to the GT350 for a fraction of the cost

Competing with the next GT500 (I guess) will take more than GM has now

I wouldn't be quick to assume an LT4 powered Z/28 can take down a GT350R. There will more than likely be a massive weight gap between the two.