Trying to plan my audio installation, would love some guidance! (first post!)

[mattyjman]

you reach a point of diminishing returns with sound deadening. just don't cross that. if you want to go full coverage and you feel that it's worth it, go ahead. I prescribe to the tap test... check out the videos i posted in my build. 25% coverage made a huge difference. if i put more on, would it have sounded any deader? who knows... but i was happy with the level of deadening that i got.

the spare tire well is thin... but how much of the noise you would get from that comes through the cabin to your ears? take everything in context. everything with your goals in sight.

if it doesn't help you achieve your goal, do you do it anyway?

i'm just playing devils advocate here, to get you to think about what you are doing and why. almost all of car audio stuffs is subjective anyway, which means that the ONLY thing that matters, is if you are happy or not.

with that being said, tap test. if it resonates and you think you'll hear it. deaden it. if it resonates but you won't hear it, leave it alone. etc.

i think you've got a good plan laid out.

and remember, you can always add more. it's not "do it all now or there's no going back later..." you can always revisit, add, and upgrade...

[jhiiidoc]

Originally Posted by TheDalton

Thanks for the second opinion, and making the decision process harder ;p. Before I finally make up my mind I'll have enough saved up to just do everything!

Try it in stages...add an amp and subs...then amp the stock speakers....then swap hu....listen to your system at each stage and decide if you are happy. You already have the subs and an amp to run them...get the FARK adapter from ******** and start there.

Sound deaden the rear deck...the rear speakers vibrate the hell out of the mounting surface. The 25% rule seems to work for most other surfaces for audio purposes. Full coverage applications seem to be better at controlling road noise or exhaust drone than reducing vibration from subs. If your objective is to improve sound in the cabin by reducing road noise, then sound deaden away....

If you fade the output forward, and properly stage the output front with just enough sound coming from the rears to fill out the cabin (front stage with rear fill) this will help with the vibration (some....it's the only solution short of sound deadening if you don't amp the stock speakers) Also, if you add an amp to the speakers, changing the crossover point to about 100hz on the rears will cut the bass response (4 ch amp is recommended in this application...that way you can still run the fronts to about 60hz and get some mid-bass out of the fronts...you'll like it)

This is all subjective. Your ears will tell you if you are happy with what you are hearing. As you said, you lean more toward SPL than sound quality...I tend to lean toward SQ....so with that being said, an amp and subs may be all you need to give you the sound you are after.

[darkrider01]

Originally Posted by TheDalton

There is no difference between the HU on the BA and non BA system right? From reading other posts where they've kept the stock HU I feel pretty comfortable that the source is clean enough.

Right now I'm leaning towards:
Keeping stock HU by following http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=213330
Adding my subs and amp.
Adding a lowish power 4-Channel amp to the factory speakers.
I'll see how this sounds, most likely it'll be plenty for me.

My remaining questions - is dynamat/other products similar to the CLD tiles from sounddeadenershowdown; in that I can do the 25% coverage on doors, roof, and trunk to kill most of the panel resonance - or do I need to coat the area like you see in most applications.
Lastly, anyone recommend any must do areas for sound deadening for the Camaro? It looks like everyone at least coats the spare tire well and puts dynamat under the 6x9s.

Whoa whoa whoa! There is a significant difference between the BA and non-BA head units. The non-BA head unit has a nasty EQ applied to its output. The BA head unit has a flat output with the EQ applied at the amp. PLEASE read this thread (LINK HERE and more specifically, this post) to get a better understanding of the difference in the head units.

If you want to keep the stock non-BA head unit, AND you want a clean, flat base to start with, you're going to need a clean-sweep or an IMPRINT or some other integration processor to help with the EQ.

On the other hand, I'll sell you my stock BA head for $100.

[crashprime]

Originally Posted by darkrider01

Whoa whoa whoa! There is a significant difference between the BA and non-BA head units. The non-BA head unit has a nasty EQ applied to its output. The BA head unit has a flat output with the EQ applied at the amp. PLEASE read this thread (LINK HERE and more specifically, this post) to get a better understanding of the difference in the head units.

If you want to keep the stock non-BA head unit, AND you want a clean, flat base to start with, you're going to need a clean-sweep or an IMPRINT or some other integration processor to help with the EQ.

On the other hand, I'll sell you my stock BA head for $100.

I have a non-BA system I am upgrading and if I can get flat EQ response over the full volume range, out of a $100 swap-a-roo, something like the AudioStream LC7i or LCQ-1 sounds a whole lot less appealing. My amplifiers do crazy amounts of custom EQ setting, but when the signal attenuates, it shifts the volume knob over to the amps instead of using the headunit which isn't ideal. I was considering the AudioStream stuff ... but like I said, I'd love some proof of the BA systems flat EQ claims. I'm sure you'd make your $100 off me if it turned out to be tested and proven.

PS: Your links do prove the EQ settings are not flat coming out of a non-BA system, but in the post you linked there is this:

"Both units also have a "LOUD" circuit that bumps up low end with rise in volume control."

And there is no mention of attenuation, just the generic EQ curve.

edit: I am not sure you ever made the claim about attenuation. It's a problem I've been trying to overcome, and I might have injected my own thoughts into your post. So I guess the question is, does the BA vs Non-BA actually do different things when changing the volume? An EQ curve can be fixed, but a dynamic EQ curve seems like a nightmare.

[darkrider01]

Originally Posted by crashprime

I have a non-BA system I am upgrading and if I can get flat EQ response over the full volume range, out of a $100 swap-a-roo, something like the AudioStream LC7i or LCQ-1 sounds a whole lot less appealing. My amplifiers do crazy amounts of custom EQ setting, but when the signal attenuates, it shifts the volume knob over to the amps instead of using the headunit which isn't ideal. I was considering the AudioStream stuff ... but like I said, I'd love some proof of the BA systems flat EQ claims. I'm sure you'd make your $100 off me if it turned out to be tested and proven.

PS: Your links do prove the EQ settings are not flat coming out of a non-BA system, but in the post you linked there is this:

"Both units also have a "LOUD" circuit that bumps up low end with rise in volume control."

And there is no mention of attenuation, just the generic EQ curve.

edit: I am not sure you ever made the claim about attenuation. It's a problem I've been trying to overcome, and I might have injected my own thoughts into your post. So I guess the question is, does the BA vs Non-BA actually do different things when changing the volume? An EQ curve can be fixed, but a dynamic EQ curve seems like a nightmare.

I'm pretty sure the attenuation your are referring to is how the "LOUDNESS" circuit works on this head unit. It works in the classic sense at low volume and then rolls off at the upper levels.

The EQ curve is not the only issue with the stock radios and amps. Two other very important settings/functions were addressed in the post I referenced. Those 2 were the "remote turn-on mod" and the "turn down "chime" output" changes. The warning chime is generated by the head unit in these cars. The frequency is somewhere between 750 and 1000Hz. If you add an aftermarket EQ or turn the front amp gains over minimum, you're going to get a chime loud enough to have your neighbors checking for their keys. The remote turn-on mod is most probably a fix for the turn-off pop/click/thump that is referenced in my signature.

I was able to deal with the chime volume, but the turn-off pop I had through all the amps I tried was enough to have me gladly pay $800+ for my Pioneer head unit swap.

On a side note, I had no issues with the sound quality of the stock head unit. I thought the actual sound I had with my stock Boston head unit with an old Alpine 3527S pushing the stock Boston speakers was pretty fantastic (lacking bass, but that's what subs are for).

[crashprime]

So how do you go about turning down the chime?

[darkrider01]

Originally Posted by crashprime

So how do you go about turning down the chime?

You either send it off or you leave your gains way down low.

[crashprime]

So did send your unit off to have your chimes tuned out on your head unit? How would one go about doing so? Its a Pioneer made radio, so I suppose the first step would be trying to contact them?

[TheDalton]

Originally Posted by darkrider01

You either send it off or you leave your gains way down low.

Thanks for the link to the frequency response. I feel like I'm learning a lot from these responses at least. So it looks like the lows and highs are boosted while the mids are lowered from the non ba hu.
So if I ad an amp, I'll be boosting an already boosted signal.
Am I reading that right?

[darkrider01]

Originally Posted by crashprime

So did send your unit off to have your chimes tuned out on your head unit? How would one go about doing so? Its a Pioneer made radio, so I suppose the first step would be trying to contact them?

No no no. The chimes are generated by the factory head unit. When you replace the head unit, the dash kit creates the chimes (one of the reasons the dash kits are so expensive). The Scosche kit has a tiny speaker on the back side that plays the chime, so it's not amplified.

[darkrider01]

Originally Posted by TheDalton

Thanks for the link to the frequency response. I feel like I'm learning a lot from these responses at least. So it looks like the lows and highs are boosted while the mids are lowered from the non ba hu.
So if I ad an amp, I'll be boosting an already boosted signal.
Am I reading that right?

Well, you'll be boosting an already manipulated signal.

This link will explain that EQ curve and why it gets applied to so many radios.