z28 question?

[clark17357]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Having said that...weight is 90% perception, imo.

Dragon,

Weight is a reality when you are navigating a road course. In May, we were at Willow Springs and had all kinds of cars out there, including four old, but seriously well built, Cameros. There was also a Hemi powered Charger. The Charger could not make the same speed in the turns because of one thing, too much weight and, worse still, too much weight on the front wheels.

I agree with you that weight does not matter all that much for boulevard cruising. I remember the first Porsche that kicked my butt in the twisties and, when we got back to the pits, he said, "Heck, anybody can go fast in a straight line. The test is in the turns."

Like most things, it depends on what you are looking to do with the car. Plenty of options for everyone, for sure.

Jim

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Vega

This is actually a VERY big topic right now, i think the Camaro's biggest obstacle is the same as the Challenger's except GM has overcome it better, that would be having a 2-door car on a 4-door platform, you're just wasting weight in that scenario. As far as the engine goes expect an extra 150-200 pounds if its supercharged, another reason im not a big fan of supercharging the Z/28, id rather see a cammed LS7 putting near 600hp with less weight and a meaner roar If people want a good comparison of what the Z/28 would be like supercharged then look at the GT vs the GT500, the GT is like 3500lbs while the GT500 is around 3850lbs? Hopefully GM will see this as a problem and take measures to overcome it, im hoping for lots of parts swapped for lighter parts, lots of emphasis on weight savings in the new Z, otherwise you might as well just supercharge your SS right?

I've stated earlier I believe the LS7 is pretty much maxed out. GM will not sacrifice reilability or durability to get 600 hp and I believe emssions would be a HUGE hurdle on top of that.

That being said, an LS7 powered Camaro would be quite nice IMO.

And to get mass out you are either paying for premium materials, i.e. aluminum and Carbon Fiber or you are taking parts off the car.

Ball park, to save 200 pounds you be paying probably $5,000 dollars or more.

And I know this debate will go on over time, but for me a Z would need to include everything from the SS. I don't want a radio/ac/rear seat delete. But there are those out there that want that.

My perpsective on the Camaro is it is a unique animal to the Corvette. What some are asking for here is a Camaro that is as fast and handles as well as a Z06...............NOT...................Gonna..... ................Happen. If and when a Z28 appears it will be verrrrrrry special. But if you want Z06 performance, you will still have to buy a Z06.

[2SSRS@Gen5diy]

Or we can drop a LSX454 with 620+hp.

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

With the right suspension, and adequate power, you can overcome the weight imposed by safety standards, and structural rigidity.

We are already seeing what a good suspension setup can do...

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by clark17357

Dragon,

Weight is a reality when you are navigating a road course. In May, we were at Willow Springs and had all kinds of cars out there, including four old, but seriously well built, Cameros. There was also a Hemi powered Charger. The Charger could not make the same speed in the turns because of one thing, too much weight and, worse still, too much weight on the front wheels.Jim

Were all those cars stock?

Originally Posted by Number 3

And I know this debate will go on over time, but for me a Z would need to include everything from the SS. I don't want a radio/ac/rear seat delete. But there are those out there that want that.

My perpsective on the Camaro is it is a unique animal to the Corvette. What some are asking for here is a Camaro that is as fast and handles as well as a Z06...............NOT...................Gonna..... ................Happen. If and when a Z28 appears it will be verrrrrrry special. But if you want Z06 performance, you will still have to buy a Z06.

Originally Posted by shnomac77

We are already seeing what a good suspension setup can do...

[clark17357]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Were all those cars stock?

I think the Charger was. I know the Cameros were not. There were some stock GT500s out there as well and they behaved a lot like the Charger. Most folks have done at least a little work on their cars before bringing them to Willow Springs. Most have at least replaced the control arms to stiffen things up a bit.

Jim

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by clark17357

I think the Charger was. I know the Cameros were not. There were some stock GT500s out there as well and they behaved a lot like the Charger. Most folks have done at least a little work on their cars before bringing them to Willow Springs. Most have at least replaced the control arms to stiffen things up a bit.

Jim

I only asked because the Charger is....well, "less than impressive" comes to mind. I know the Pedders people are kicking a$$ with their suspension systems on so-called "fat" cars, like the G8. And that was what I was referring to originally -- weight is never good...But you can beat it without removing it.

[clark17357]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

weight is never good...But you can beat it without removing it.

To a point but, in the end, all other things being equal, the lower weight car will prevail. Of course, all other things are never equal, are they?

Jim

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

-- weight is never good...But you can beat it without removing it.

I cant wait to see what the Pedder's guys do in October They feel they have the best handling Camaro out there!


But when in doubt

"There's no replacement for displacement"
Mark Donohue

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by clark17357

To a point but, in the end, all other things being equal, the lower weight car will prevail. Of course, all other things are never equal, are they?

Jim

I think we've found some common ground.

[Vega]

I dont think we're really looking for a car that matches the Z06, like i said once before the Z/28 wont cut into the Z06 as much as people think cause people looking for Corvettes will still buy Vettes and people looking for Camaros will still buy Camaros, we're just looking for a Camaro that can excel as a track/road car, have lots of get-up but incredibly handling prowess, more of a touring car really, and we all just want to see the best for the Z/28...the Z06 will still most likely outperform the Z/28, although we've seen the Vette beat out by GM pony cars before, but still i think the track will still stay in favor of the Z06...i just really think both cars will be a completely different driving experience, ironicly its best to compare this situation to the same situation in 1969, the Z/28 was a MONSTER race car but the Corvette appealed to different aspects and outshined the Camaro in those aspects

I think people need to remember that these are two VERY different cars with very different fundamentals that appeal to very different groups of people...its like BMW, they have 2-seat cars and coupes and sedans and they're all big on performance but they dont really cut into each other because they're all looking to accomplish different goals in the long run and people still buy whatever suits them the best and whatever accomplishes the goals their looking for

Long story short, stop sweatin' the Vette, LOL, have faith young grasshoppas ^_^

[Camaro_Corvette]

I am hoping for lighter, but will probably not get it.