European Taxman loves it - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

leifhain · 02-13-2008, 03:53 AM

The new Camaro is the first American car to impress me by its beauty and technology. Only, I am afraid - even at the most unimaginable profitable EUR/USD rate - there will be no market for it in Europe since cubic inches and horses are heavily taxed as will be "fuel squandering" by 2010. Even my beloved Lancia's (2.0 turbo 210 HP engines) are targeted by the new tax regulations to come. In Belgium for instance, a 6.0 liter 400 HP version would be taxed an extra 4659 EUR on top of the usual 21 % VAT when purchased, plus 2537 EUR road tax to be payed each year. By 2009 taxes will depend on an Ecoscore which classifies the average 2007 Corvette at around 45, hereby probably hitting the highest tax rates. Keeping average fuel consumption below 10 liter/100 km is really an issue over here, guys!
Grtz, L.

Rock36 · 02-14-2008, 02:33 PM

For those unaware....10L/100KM is roughly equal to 23.5 mpg.

I live in Germany, but luckily I am sheltered from such taxes. I disagree with a tax based solely on displacement; since larger displacement engines could, in theory, be more fuel efficient than a smaller.

For instance, I am driving a old 92 BMW 740iL as a beater car and I get roughly 22-23 mpg out of the 4.0L V8 it has....before that I had a old 1990 325ix with a 2.5L I6 which also got 22-23 mpg in the same driving conditions.

I'm sure the emissions were similar as well, so why get taxed on the extra 1.5L of displacement I have now?

Come to think of it...my Mustang with a 4.6L V8 is getting 22.6 mpg, similar to the other cars, but again with more displacement than the others. So again, I don't understand the concept.

*GTAHVIT* · 02-14-2008, 02:41 PM

21% VAT!!!

BRUTAL

leifhain · 02-15-2008, 04:19 PM

Consequently a tax concept based on emissions could be advantageous for big displacement engined cars (there is hope for the 'nothing compares to cubic inches' aficionados). By the way, Rock36: my 4 cylinder 2.0L Delta indeed drinks a lot more than your 4,6L V8 Mustang. ;-)

Emher · 02-15-2008, 05:47 PM

I'm holding my worries until we know the official details about it. There's a chance it might be E84 compatible so that would class it as an enviromentally friendly car here and thus there would be lots of tax breaks....

willisit · 02-18-2008, 02:38 AM

Come over to the UK... it's worse. :(

roy · 05-18-2008, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtahvit

21% VAT!!!

BRUTAL

Plus 19% import.

Cyberstyx · 05-18-2008, 03:10 PM

Are you sure it 's 21% VAT + 10% import costs?

I was under the impression that the customs thing we pay is the VAT (19%) and we don't pay anything more.

In Greece road tax paid per year is also based on CCs, but gladly the 2500cc+ are all in the same category costing 483 EUR per year.

Still, a possible 43000 US (for the top dog) + 19% + 21% = 62000 US or 39000 EUR, which makes it an expensive car but in the league of well geared AUDIs for example, making it the best buy for that category.

(But I 'm hoping it 's only a 19% additional cost and not a +21% on top of that).

roy · 05-19-2008, 12:01 AM

CYberstax you are correct. That is what Iget when drinking and typing.

Silencer · 05-26-2008, 08:59 AM

Price in USA

+ Shipping and Insurance to Germany

+ Harborfees

+ 10 % Importtax

+ 19 % VAT

+ Various modifikations (Lights, safety tests, emittion checks etc.
and yet new the ecpertise about electromagneticel emissions)
If you'd like to import the car by yourself you've to pay these expertises from the importers - very expensive !!!

+ Approvalfees to get on the road

Complete costs for a new Camaro:

The new Camaro will be offically imported by GM dealers. If you'll buy it there, it would be less hard, but hardly cheaper.

That means that we here in Germany have to calculate the price in Europe in € in at least the price in the US in $. And that at a exchange rate 1.50 $ to 1 €.

In Austria the goverment is adding another 10-15 % "Normverbrauchsabgabe" (I can't translate this word, because it's unknown in the rest of the world. In word to word translation it would mean "normal consumer tax". The inhabitants woul'd have to pay it either

)

BTW, interested in todays price for gas here in Germany ?

Its 2,28 $ .... not for a gallon but for 1 liter !!!!!

On your six ... DHG 2700

Silencer

Nickdago · 07-09-2008, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leifhain

The new Camaro is the first American car to impress me by its beauty and technology. Only, I am afraid - even at the most unimaginable profitable EUR/USD rate - there will be no market for it in Europe since cubic inches and horses are heavily taxed as will be "fuel squandering" by 2010. Even my beloved Lancia's (2.0 turbo 210 HP engines) are targeted by the new tax regulations to come. In Belgium for instance, a 6.0 liter 400 HP version would be taxed an extra 4659 EUR on top of the usual 21 % VAT when purchased, plus 2537 EUR road tax to be payed each year. By 2009 taxes will depend on an Ecoscore which classifies the average 2007 Corvette at around 45, hereby probably hitting the highest tax rates. Keeping average fuel consumption below 10 liter/100 km is really an issue over here, guys!
Grtz, L.

What a drag. You guys need to have a tax revolt, dump some tea in the bay somewhere. We would be happy to show you how

Myka · 07-09-2008, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nickdago

What a drag. You guys need to have a tax revolt, dump some tea in the bay somewhere. We would be happy to show you how

ROFL.

Sorry some of you are going through this. But I am confident that GM has kept you in mind. This car has shown through spy shots that it is euro ready and I'm sure that includes keeping inmind the insane taxes you must pay. (hoping for E85)

Mr.Rabbit · 10-20-2008, 12:35 PM

Well if i already saw 3 challangers here i can bet GM is bringing the Camaro also...so i'll wait...but can't relax though

. In my opinion the consumption is not an issue since you are thinking of buying a V8...so if one liter costs 2 euros or 3...it wouldn't make a difference since u go for that and not a 1.5 DCI renault. The only thing that concerns me is that the car will cost like 60k euros over here (referring to the v8 2ss top dog) with those "european adjustments" like yellow blinkers and side blinkers and whatever they need. I wonder if we can buy one from the States and just buy those needed pieces separately and do the adjustment on our own and register it afterwards....it will still be alot cheaper...with 10% import tax, 19% vat, transport and other reg taxes. My calculation brings it to ~40k Euros....which for that car is a damn good price to pay!

Hylton · 10-20-2008, 12:52 PM

Well all those taxes have to be applied to whatever you buy so you'll get nailed driving a 4 cylinder BMW. How do you think the 3.6 litre V6 will do in Europe?

02-13-2008, 03:53 AM	#1
leifhain Drives: lancia delta integrale Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: belgium Posts: 6	European Taxman loves it The new Camaro is the first American car to impress me by its beauty and technology. Only, I am afraid - even at the most unimaginable profitable EUR/USD rate - there will be no market for it in Europe since cubic inches and horses are heavily taxed as will be "fuel squandering" by 2010. Even my beloved Lancia's (2.0 turbo 210 HP engines) are targeted by the new tax regulations to come. In Belgium for instance, a 6.0 liter 400 HP version would be taxed an extra 4659 EUR on top of the usual 21 % VAT when purchased, plus 2537 EUR road tax to be payed each year. By 2009 taxes will depend on an Ecoscore which classifies the average 2007 Corvette at around 45, hereby probably hitting the highest tax rates. Keeping average fuel consumption below 10 liter/100 km is really an issue over here, guys! Grtz, L.

02-14-2008, 02:33 PM	#2
Rock36 I just like V8s Drives: 2007 Corvette Z06 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 919	For those unaware....10L/100KM is roughly equal to 23.5 mpg. I live in Germany, but luckily I am sheltered from such taxes. I disagree with a tax based solely on displacement; since larger displacement engines could, in theory, be more fuel efficient than a smaller. For instance, I am driving a old 92 BMW 740iL as a beater car and I get roughly 22-23 mpg out of the 4.0L V8 it has....before that I had a old 1990 325ix with a 2.5L I6 which also got 22-23 mpg in the same driving conditions. I'm sure the emissions were similar as well, so why get taxed on the extra 1.5L of displacement I have now? Come to think of it...my Mustang with a 4.6L V8 is getting 22.6 mpg, similar to the other cars, but again with more displacement than the others. So again, I don't understand the concept. __________________ "Anyone know who sells the driver mods?" 2007 Corvette Z06: Le Mans blue, 2LZ

02-14-2008, 02:41 PM	#3
GTAHVIT Blessed Drives: 2013 Sonic RS MT Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saint Augustine FL Posts: 28,444 View My Garage	21% VAT!!! BRUTAL __________________ Click image to see build thread. PQ - "the love of cars. It's a boys first step toward manhood and a mans last hold on boyhood." Fbodfather - "We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name." The_Blur - "Let's not confuse competitors with equals."

02-15-2008, 05:47 PM	#5
Emher Pillaging Viking Drives: Saab 9-5 '99 (Hey it's a GM!) Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,189	I'm holding my worries until we know the official details about it. There's a chance it might be E84 compatible so that would class it as an enviromentally friendly car here and thus there would be lots of tax breaks.... __________________ "Fifty years from now, when you're looking back at your life, don't you want to be able to say you had the guts to get in the car?"

02-18-2008, 02:38 AM	#6
willisit Drives: Vauxhall Monaro VXR Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Waterlooville, UK Posts: 314	Come over to the UK... it's worse. :( __________________ Dan 2005 Vauxhall Monaro VXR. Sport pac - Road Response Pac - Ripshifter 2005 Vauxhall Astra 1.6 Sport (ug) 2001 Honda CBR 600 F

02-15-2008, 04:19 PM	#4
leifhain Drives: lancia delta integrale Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: belgium Posts: 6	Consequently a tax concept based on emissions could be advantageous for big displacement engined cars (there is hope for the 'nothing compares to cubic inches' aficionados). By the way, Rock36: my 4 cylinder 2.0L Delta indeed drinks a lot more than your 4,6L V8 Mustang. ;-)

05-18-2008, 03:10 PM	#8
Cyberstyx Drives: Seat Leon 1.8 20VT Join Date: May 2008 Location: Corinth, Greece Posts: 72	Are you sure it 's 21% VAT + 10% import costs? I was under the impression that the customs thing we pay is the VAT (19%) and we don't pay anything more. In Greece road tax paid per year is also based on CCs, but gladly the 2500cc+ are all in the same category costing 483 EUR per year. Still, a possible 43000 US (for the top dog) + 19% + 21% = 62000 US or 39000 EUR, which makes it an expensive car but in the league of well geared AUDIs for example, making it the best buy for that category. (But I 'm hoping it 's only a 19% additional cost and not a +21% on top of that).

05-19-2008, 12:01 AM	#9
roy Erlkoenig Drives: 1998 Camaro SS Join Date: May 2008 Location: Kaiserslautern, Germany Posts: 33	CYberstax you are correct. That is what Iget when drinking and typing.

05-26-2008, 08:59 AM	#10
Silencer Drives: '01 Mustang BULLITT GT Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: SW Germany Posts: 5	Costs 4 an Import to Germany Price in USA + Shipping and Insurance to Germany + Harborfees + 10 % Importtax + 19 % VAT + Various modifikations (Lights, safety tests, emittion checks etc. and yet new the ecpertise about electromagneticel emissions) If you'd like to import the car by yourself you've to pay these expertises from the importers - very expensive !!! + Approvalfees to get on the road Complete costs for a new Camaro: The new Camaro will be offically imported by GM dealers. If you'll buy it there, it would be less hard, but hardly cheaper. That means that we here in Germany have to calculate the price in Europe in € in at least the price in the US in $. And that at a exchange rate 1.50 $ to 1 €. In Austria the goverment is adding another 10-15 % "Normverbrauchsabgabe" (I can't translate this word, because it's unknown in the rest of the world. In word to word translation it would mean "normal consumer tax". The inhabitants woul'd have to pay it either ) BTW, interested in todays price for gas here in Germany ? Its 2,28 $ .... not for a gallon but for 1 liter !!!!! On your six ... DHG 2700 Silencer Last edited by Silencer; 05-28-2008 at 03:07 PM.

10-20-2008, 12:35 PM	#13
Mr.Rabbit Drives: Saab 93 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Bucharest, Romania Posts: 10	Well if i already saw 3 challangers here i can bet GM is bringing the Camaro also...so i'll wait...but can't relax though . In my opinion the consumption is not an issue since you are thinking of buying a V8...so if one liter costs 2 euros or 3...it wouldn't make a difference since u go for that and not a 1.5 DCI renault. The only thing that concerns me is that the car will cost like 60k euros over here (referring to the v8 2ss top dog) with those "european adjustments" like yellow blinkers and side blinkers and whatever they need. I wonder if we can buy one from the States and just buy those needed pieces separately and do the adjustment on our own and register it afterwards....it will still be alot cheaper...with 10% import tax, 19% vat, transport and other reg taxes. My calculation brings it to ~40k Euros....which for that car is a damn good price to pay!

10-20-2008, 12:52 PM	#14
Hylton Drives: fanboys and ass kissers crazy. Join Date: May 2008 Location: Ottawa, Ontario Posts: 7,280	Well all those taxes have to be applied to whatever you buy so you'll get nailed driving a 4 cylinder BMW. How do you think the 3.6 litre V6 will do in Europe? __________________ "BBOMG - More than just a car show.... It's an experience!"