Aftermarket Heat Exchanger & Pumps - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

BaylorCamaro · 01-10-2014, 11:03 AM

In combination of wanting to increase my power, road race the car and living in Houston (HORRIBLE summers!) I've decided I'm going to address the cooling sooner rather than later. I've done some research here on C5 and on different forums.

I haven't really decided on a heat exchanger but I've narrowed it down to three. ADM, TORQ or D3PE.

I thought that was going to be the harder decision and that picking a pump would be easy. However upon further research it looks like there's a lot to consider with the intercooler pump. Initially I was just going to go with TORQ's pump but I stumbled across Lingenfelter's pump flow tests that were conducted a little less than a year ago .

It appears that the "common aftermarket 55 GPM pump" that Lingenfelter tested is the same 55 GPM Pump that TORQ offers. I can't be certain, but judging by the photo's it sure appears that way.

TORQ 55 GPM Pump

"common aftermarket 55 GPM pump" tested by Lingenfelter (top right)

Here are some graphs posted by Lingenfelter based off of their testing:

Here is the pump that Lingenfelter suggests

I'm open to suggestions from other ZL1 owners that have addressed their heat excahnger and/or intercooler pump. However working for an engineering firm, everything we do is backed with tons of research and hard data that can be analyzed. So for someone to tell me that X product works really well, I'd like to see some sort of data that backs that statement. It's amazing the tricks the mind can play on you when you buy a new product and expect a specific result

Drew P · 01-10-2014, 12:31 PM

I had the bosch pump initially with a prototype HX setup. It definitely flowed less - you could visually see the amount of fluid flowing into the reservoir I have on the car and also feel the pressure. I dont have numbers, but it would appear to correspond with what lingenfelter's graph shows. Im using the stock pump still.

SamHouseIII · 01-10-2014, 10:12 PM

I went with the D3PE goodies but kept the stock pump because I read that the CTS-V guys were switching over to the ZL1 pump and the stock ZL1 pump was actually pretty damn good one?

BaylorCamaro · 01-10-2014, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamHouseIII

I went with the D3PE goodies but kept the stock pump because I read that the CTS-V guys were switching over to the ZL1 pump and the stock ZL1 pump was actually pretty damn good one?

Well looking at Lingenfelter's graphs I posted above, the ZL1 pump has 25% better flow than the CTS-V Bosch pump. BUT the Lingenfelter has 60% better flow than the ZL1 pump.

AMMUSCLE · 01-10-2014, 10:38 PM

What is the electrical draw on their reworked pump though.
Will there have to be changes made to compensate for this.
How is the longevity of this pump that is reprogramed to run at faster then normal speed also.
Has anyone installed on that has been in service for a while so we could get some feedback

BaylorCamaro · 01-10-2014, 10:51 PM

ZL1 Camaro OEM pump = 4 amps
CTSV OEM/Bosch PCA pump = 3 amps
Varimax pump = 6 amps
ZR1 Corvette OEM pump = 8 amps
20GPM billet pump = 6 amps
55GPM billet pump = 6.5 amps
Stewart-EMP (base controller calibration) = 9 amps
Stewart-EMP (reprogrammed) = 19 amps
"Make sure you account for the current draw of these different pumps in your wiring size and fuse sizing."

However, according to THIS it says it draws 12 amps. This can probably be attributed to the fact that the suggested hose size is 1" however they used the OEM hose size of 3/4"

Apparently this is the standard pump Lingenfelter uses on their high horse power vehicles.

I too would like to hear feedback from someone that is using this pump.

jessrayo · 01-13-2014, 08:41 PM

Wow, that is a lot of good research. I have the Stewart EMP pump recommended by Lingenfelter. It is one bad boy. Here are pictures of the pump install done by ADM performance. The pump is mounted in the spare tire well in front of the battery. Behind the battery is a 4 gal stainless reservoir. The water is routed under the car in mainly hard metal lines for durability.

Stephen12ZL1 · 01-14-2014, 08:24 AM

Somebody stole yer battery!...lol! Seriously, did you put the battery in the stock location?

jessrayo · 01-14-2014, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen12ZL1

Somebody stole yer battery!...lol! Seriously, did you put the battery in the stock location?

I still have the stock battery in the stock position but I'm trying to find something lighter that is still reliable. Most of the ultra light racing batteries need to be left connected to a tender whenever you park the car and I'm not sure I want to go this light.

BaylorCamaro · 01-14-2014, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jessrayo

Wow, that is a lot of good research. I have the Stewart EMP pump recommended by Lingenfelter. It is one bad boy. Here are pictures of the pump install done by ADM performance. The pump is mounted in the spare tire well in front of the battery. Behind the battery is a 4 gal stainless reservoir. The water is routed under the car in mainly hard metal lines for durability.

Very nice set up!

If/when I switch pumps (which might be soon) I'm definitely considering going toe Stewart EMP route. Any idea if this is a plug and play or did ADM have to do something special to get it to work properly?

Question about your mounting location, is there no room for the Stewart pump where the OEM pump is? Or did you just want to mount it in the back by your battery?

LSA376 · 01-14-2014, 12:05 PM

That is far the most bad ass setup I've seen. Well done, very cool.

AMMUSCLE · 01-14-2014, 01:25 PM

Nice work.
That is a really nice setup.
Love the way it looks like factory.
Are you going to have a manual switch for in line staging.
Love the ice box and location.

Drew P · 01-14-2014, 02:55 PM

+1 on the wiring question for the Stewart EMP. Curious if the increased draw of this pump causes any charging issues. I had to make some electrical changes after installing the KB BAP, so curious what that pump does to the stock electrical system.

BaylorCamaro · 01-14-2014, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew P

+1 on the wiring question for the Stewart EMP. Curious if the increased draw of this pump causes any charging issues. I had to make some electrical changes after installing the KB BAP, so curious what that pump does to the stock electrical system.

Good point, that's one area of concern I have.

*EDIT*

I posted on Lingenfelter's thread (on their forum) about this, asking if it's plug and play and if the power draw would cause issues. Here's response I got:

"This with our harness would be a plug and play install. The ECU wouldn't need any mods and the stock alternator should be fine. We wouldn't suggest it with a Under drive alternator pulley."

Here's there thread with their response.

01-10-2014, 11:03 AM	#1
BaylorCamaro Track > 1/4 Mile Drives: 2016 C7 Z51 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: League City, TX Posts: 6,072 View My Garage	Aftermarket Heat Exchanger & Pumps In combination of wanting to increase my power, road race the car and living in Houston (HORRIBLE summers!) I've decided I'm going to address the cooling sooner rather than later. I've done some research here on C5 and on different forums. I haven't really decided on a heat exchanger but I've narrowed it down to three. ADM, TORQ or D3PE. I thought that was going to be the harder decision and that picking a pump would be easy. However upon further research it looks like there's a lot to consider with the intercooler pump. Initially I was just going to go with TORQ's pump but I stumbled across Lingenfelter's pump flow tests that were conducted a little less than a year ago . It appears that the "common aftermarket 55 GPM pump" that Lingenfelter tested is the same 55 GPM Pump that TORQ offers. I can't be certain, but judging by the photo's it sure appears that way. TORQ 55 GPM Pump "common aftermarket 55 GPM pump" tested by Lingenfelter (top right) Here are some graphs posted by Lingenfelter based off of their testing: Here is the pump that Lingenfelter suggests I'm open to suggestions from other ZL1 owners that have addressed their heat excahnger and/or intercooler pump. However working for an engineering firm, everything we do is backed with tons of research and hard data that can be analyzed. So for someone to tell me that X product works really well, I'd like to see some sort of data that backs that statement. It's amazing the tricks the mind can play on you when you buy a new product and expect a specific result __________________ Automotive YouTube Channel / Texas World Speedway / MSR Houston Last edited by BaylorCamaro; 01-10-2014 at 11:26 AM.

01-10-2014, 12:31 PM	#2
Drew P Drives: Camaro ZL1 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Houston Posts: 233	I had the bosch pump initially with a prototype HX setup. It definitely flowed less - you could visually see the amount of fluid flowing into the reservoir I have on the car and also feel the pressure. I dont have numbers, but it would appear to correspond with what lingenfelter's graph shows. Im using the stock pump still. __________________ 2012 A6 Coupe 630RWHP 10.93@125 Mods: ID850 Injectors; D3PE HX, Reservoir & Atmospheric Catch-Can; LPE 2.55 Upper & 9.1 Lower Pulleys w/ ATI Damper; LPE Idler Pulley Relocation Bracket; "Green" Serp. Belt; Cat delete;ADM Exhaust Override; Magnaflow X-Pipe Muffler (in addition to stock mufflers); Cold Air Inductions CAI; 160 thermostat; LS9 Isolator; Port/polish snout and intake runners; LPE GT9 camshaft with dual springs and titanium retainers; Kenne Bell BAP, Install and Engine Tune by Serious Hp; Fab work by D3 Performance Engineering; Trans Tune by Keith; Coming Soon: Flex Fuel Conversion.

01-10-2014, 10:12 PM	#3
SamHouseIII I Carry! Drives: 2013 CRT ZL1 Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Fletcher, Ok Posts: 2,722	I went with the D3PE goodies but kept the stock pump because I read that the CTS-V guys were switching over to the ZL1 pump and the stock ZL1 pump was actually pretty damn good one? __________________ I am a Modaholic!! Please Help!! Do Not feed my addicition....See build... http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=261540 From Oklahoma, Join us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/okcamaros/

01-10-2014, 10:38 PM	#5
AMMUSCLE Drives: 2013 ZL1 VERT M6 Join Date: May 2013 Location: Portland, Maine Posts: 346	What is the electrical draw on their reworked pump though. Will there have to be changes made to compensate for this. How is the longevity of this pump that is reprogramed to run at faster then normal speed also. Has anyone installed on that has been in service for a while so we could get some feedback __________________ JANNETTY RACING 750 ROUGH IDLE CAM PACKAGE (681 RWHP & 643 RWTQ) = 783 CRANK HP & 740 CRANK TQ Last edited by AMMUSCLE; 01-10-2014 at 10:45 PM. Reason: adding info

01-10-2014, 10:51 PM	#6
BaylorCamaro Track > 1/4 Mile Drives: 2016 C7 Z51 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: League City, TX Posts: 6,072 View My Garage	ZL1 Camaro OEM pump = 4 amps CTSV OEM/Bosch PCA pump = 3 amps Varimax pump = 6 amps ZR1 Corvette OEM pump = 8 amps 20GPM billet pump = 6 amps 55GPM billet pump = 6.5 amps Stewart-EMP (base controller calibration) = 9 amps Stewart-EMP (reprogrammed) = 19 amps "Make sure you account for the current draw of these different pumps in your wiring size and fuse sizing." However, according to THIS it says it draws 12 amps. This can probably be attributed to the fact that the suggested hose size is 1" however they used the OEM hose size of 3/4" Apparently this is the standard pump Lingenfelter uses on their high horse power vehicles. I too would like to hear feedback from someone that is using this pump. __________________ Automotive YouTube Channel / Texas World Speedway / MSR Houston

01-13-2014, 08:41 PM	#7
jessrayo Speed Freak Drives: 2013 ZL1 Camaro, 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Ardmore, OK Posts: 2,637 View My Garage	Wow, that is a lot of good research. I have the Stewart EMP pump recommended by Lingenfelter. It is one bad boy. Here are pictures of the pump install done by ADM performance. The pump is mounted in the spare tire well in front of the battery. Behind the battery is a 4 gal stainless reservoir. The water is routed under the car in mainly hard metal lines for durability. Attached Images __________________ 2016 SS -AGP twin Borg Warner 7163 EFR's, LT4 mechanical pump, LT4 injectors, Walbro 255 low side, Castrol SRF. 734whp/759 tq 2013 ZL1 -ADM - 427 LSX 6 bolt, O-ringed block built by LME. Twin PT6466 turbos. RPM custom manual trans, RPS Quad carbon clutch, 9" Hendrix rear diff & axles. ADM/squash fuel system, Ron Davis radiator, Spal fans, AGP air to air, turbo plumbing. LPE oil cooler, rear bushing upgrade, roll bar...etc. rwhp 1400+... 212.5mph, best Texas mile to date.

01-14-2014, 08:24 AM	#8
Stephen12ZL1 Drives: '21 ZLE A10 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Mechanicsville, VA Posts: 6,824	Somebody stole yer battery!...lol! Seriously, did you put the battery in the stock location? __________________ '21 ZLE A10 Wild Cherry PDR 2:00.78 VIR Full 10.68@131.69 1.68 60' '17 ZL1 A10 Mosaic Black PDR/Nav 2:03.08 VIR Full 11.003@129.2 1.75 (sold) '15 Z/28 #325 Black a/c & stereo. 2:10.1 VIR Full (sold) '12 ZL1 A6 Black 10.52@131 1.55 60' 2:13 VIR Full (sold)

01-14-2014, 12:05 PM	#11
LSA376 Drives: 2013 ZL1 M6 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Placerville, CA Posts: 62	That is far the most bad ass setup I've seen. Well done, very cool. __________________ 417, Callies Magnum Crank, Oliver Rods, JE Pistons, Lingenfelter Heads, Comp Cam, Magnuson Heartbeat, 28% Pulley, E-85, Squash Fuel System, Afco, Rotofab, BMR, Hotchkis, Corsa, Kooks, IDA1300's, Comp Cam, Springs, Push Rods, Trunions, Nitrous Outlet, RPM 6-point cage, garage built

01-14-2014, 01:25 PM	#12
AMMUSCLE Drives: 2013 ZL1 VERT M6 Join Date: May 2013 Location: Portland, Maine Posts: 346	Nice work. That is a really nice setup. Love the way it looks like factory. Are you going to have a manual switch for in line staging. Love the ice box and location. __________________ JANNETTY RACING 750 ROUGH IDLE CAM PACKAGE (681 RWHP & 643 RWTQ) = 783 CRANK HP & 740 CRANK TQ

01-14-2014, 02:55 PM	#13
Drew P Drives: Camaro ZL1 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Houston Posts: 233	+1 on the wiring question for the Stewart EMP. Curious if the increased draw of this pump causes any charging issues. I had to make some electrical changes after installing the KB BAP, so curious what that pump does to the stock electrical system. __________________ 2012 A6 Coupe 630RWHP 10.93@125 Mods: ID850 Injectors; D3PE HX, Reservoir & Atmospheric Catch-Can; LPE 2.55 Upper & 9.1 Lower Pulleys w/ ATI Damper; LPE Idler Pulley Relocation Bracket; "Green" Serp. Belt; Cat delete;ADM Exhaust Override; Magnaflow X-Pipe Muffler (in addition to stock mufflers); Cold Air Inductions CAI; 160 thermostat; LS9 Isolator; Port/polish snout and intake runners; LPE GT9 camshaft with dual springs and titanium retainers; Kenne Bell BAP, Install and Engine Tune by Serious Hp; Fab work by D3 Performance Engineering; Trans Tune by Keith; Coming Soon: Flex Fuel Conversion.