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Old 08-12-2016, 11:49 AM   #1
Billy10mm

 
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Drives: 2014 Camaro 2SS 1LE NPP
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JPSS Tuned 1LE

Wild past few days.

I've got 3-day mountain/back-road driving trip lined up with a friend of mine who still instructs with the BMW CCA and lives out in Omaha. He'll be flying in for this trip and we're going to do it in the 1LE of course, it comes up in a few weeks.

I wanted to dial the understeer out of this car prior to his visit so I contacted Justice Pete at JPSS and set up an appointment. Problem was, I needed Chevy to replace my front struts (front-end bang noise) before making the trip down to Pete. Got the front right strut replaced last week and they didn't do an alignment after the work. Spent the weekend with my car pulling hard to the left.

Dropped the car off with them Monday to get the left front strut replaced and informed them that they need to align the car afterwards. Got the car back after work on Wednesday at 5PM which was just in time for me to go home, pack a quick bag, then head off on a 540 mile trip to Martinsville, VA to JPSS.

Left the house at 8PM or so. Reclined the seat for a 1.5-hour nap around 2AM. Got to JPSS 10 minutes before Pete showed up. I was aimlessly walking around in the street brushing my teeth at the time. Met the crew, saw the bevy of cool cars in the shop, treated Pete to a gourmet breakfast, got a tour of Martinsville, and got treated to a late gourmet lunch.

Finished up the car, started heading home around 5PM. Pulled over around 8PM and took a three hour nap which my wife woke me up from when she called to check in on me. Got back on the road and then got off again for a 4 hour nap from 2AM to 6AM. After that it was a straight shot home (another 4 hours or so).

Work Done:

Interesting Tidbits:

We got the Before alignment numbers, the one my local dealership did the previous day, the one I never got a spec sheet for.

Front camber (L/R): +0.21/+0.33 [yes, that's completely out of min/max spec]
Front toe (L/R): +0.26/+0.15 [yes, that's completely out of min/max spec]
Rear camber (L/R): -0.78/-1.20 [in spec, but half a degree off left-to-right]
Rear toe (L/R): +0.03/+0.05 [about the only decent job they did]

Clearly, my local Chevy dealer does not provide a dead on balls accurate alignment. If you don't know what that means, don't worry, it's an industry term. http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...&defid=5953920

On the trip down to Martinsville, I had a single uninterrupted tank of gas that produced the following (I have photo proof) according to the DIC:

69mph Average Speed
24.4 Miles Per Gallon
406.2 Miles Covered

It took 17.069 gallons of gas to refill that tank which means the DIC is optimistic with it's fuel calculations and we really only got 23.79 MPG assuming the distance is accurate.

In the interest of self-preservation, I consumed 2 coffees, 4 20-oz bottles of Coke, 2 64-oz bottles of Snapple, a 16-oz can of Monster Energy (red), a 12-oz can of Barq's Root Beer, and a few bottles of water (one of which I used for teeth brushing duties). Following the submission of this post, I'm going to find myself an endocrinologist to treat the Diabetes I contracted on this trip.

I would love to give everyone a driving impression of the car. But I can't. The 540 mile ride home was all interstate, and the only hard lateral events I was able to muster were tempered by a primal fear of Virginia police officers and a desire to approach the new traction limits gently, so-as not to find myself heading in a direction I did not previously intend. While I fully appreciate a neutral car and desire some liveliness out of the rear-end; Chris Harris or Tanner Foust I am not. Please also consider that I had slept for only one and a half of the previous 36 hours, and that I was having a tough time remembering which of the three pedals did what, much less the handling nuances of the car prior to the work.

What I can confidently say is that the car turns in much more readily now, with the rear-end feeling as though it's rotating a bit to help the car turn. And there's less bump steer, a lot less. I wasn't expecting this and didn't really get to feel this until I hit a few bad sections of interstate, but the wheel is much more stable now when something tries to upset it.

If the weather permits, I will enjoy the car a bit the weekend and have a lucid report to follow.
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Old 08-12-2016, 11:54 AM   #2
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Billy10mm, it was a pleasure meeting you.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:51 PM   #3
Stormcloak
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I like hearing this, as I'm going to JPSS on the 22nd for quite a bit of the same work . Looking forward to hearing a report after your weekend driving!
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Old 08-12-2016, 01:03 PM   #4
Freddy G
 
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Good to hear all your problem solved. I might take a trip there from Canada LOL.
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Old 08-12-2016, 06:24 PM   #5
Billy10mm

 
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Okay. So just got back from an hour's worth of play time with the car on roads that I know and a large, empty parking lot.

The short answer:

In the right hands, this thing will be seconds faster per lap, regardless of track, than a standard 1LE.

The long answer:

You can drive around most of the 1LE's factory understeer. Trail-brake towards your apex, or abruptly lift-off the throttle, and you are rewarded with a car that neatly tucks the front-end and nicely rotates to point you towards your apex. You can then use that aluminum mill under the hood to keep the car in that attitude through the corner. Notice though, that both of these methods are deceleratory in nature. They work, but aren't remotely ideal.

With these improvements, the car now rotates at will, and there's no need back off the gas to get the front to tuck. You can enter the corner faster, put as much power down as the OEM configuration, and drive out of the corner with more speed. You can turn in much more quickly now. In my favorite local corner, a nice 100 degree on-camber right-hander you can see all the way around, I almost drove the car into the inside curbing as I got too aggressive with the wheel and was rewarded with a car that listened more intently to my command than I expected.

I spent a few minutes in the parking lot seeing how ham-fisted I could get before it would spin. You have to do some pretty stupid things to get it to spin, but the OEM configuration tolerates that level of stupidity and would likely keep you in line. If the tires are howling and you abruptly lift without unwinding some of the steering, you'll be looking at where you just came from in short order.

The car REALLY wants to turn under braking now. You can just feel it. The slightest movement of the wheel during heavy braking results in the front end begging to go that direction like a dog panting heavily with its tongue hanging out. Get too aggressive with the wheel while braking though, and you can find yourself looking straight ahead at what was previously behind you.

To put it in a single word, the car is "lively" now. It dances with the wheel. It changes direction more like a mid-engined car than any front-engined vehicle has a right doing. The rear end gets into the action now, which is completely missing from the OEM setup without prodigious use of the go-fast pedal.

It's not scary though. As mentioned in a previous post, I'm no Rhys Millen, and it's very controllable to me. There's not even a hint of snap-oversteer. It's just a nice, controlled rotation of the rear. Stay throttle neutral and the car just points and goes. Get hard on the gas and the rear just sticks and propels you forward. You just have be careful when you've got the front-end loaded, and keep the hands loose.

On a track, where the completion of a corner can take a long time and a driver can drive around the factory understeer to a degree, this setup is much faster. On an autocross, where there isn't as much time or room to drive around the factory push, this car will dominate all other stock-suspended 1LEs. It would be like cheating.

I had a very specific goal when I reached out to JPSS. As a daily driver, I wanted to retain this car's current ride quality and ride height, but dial as much of the factory understeer out as possible.

This was a resounding success.
__________________
My thoughts on some things:
  • Driving Nannies: If I'm that far out of shape on the street, something has gone terribly wrong and by all means Mr. Computer man, come and get me.
  • G2s: Rock throwing is like like a tramp stamp; although problematic, it's a sign of good things to come.
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Old 08-12-2016, 06:27 PM   #6
JusticePete
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy10mm View Post
Okay. So just got back from an hour's worth of play time with the car on roads that I know and a large, empty parking lot.

The short answer:

In the right hands, this thing will be seconds faster per lap, regardless of track, than a standard 1LE.

The long answer:

You can drive around most of the 1LE's factory understeer. Trail-brake towards your apex, or abruptly lift-off the throttle, and you are rewarded with a car that neatly tucks the front-end and nicely rotates to point you towards your apex. You can then use that aluminum mill under the hood to keep the car in that attitude through the corner. Notice though, that both of these methods are deceleratory in nature. They work, but aren't remotely ideal.

With these improvements, the car now rotates at will, and there's no need back off the gas to get the front to tuck. You can enter the corner faster, put as much power down as the OEM configuration, and drive out of the corner with more speed. You can turn in much more quickly now. In my favorite local corner, a nice 100 degree on-camber right-hander you can see all the way around, I almost drove the car into the inside curbing as I got too aggressive with the wheel and was rewarded with a car that listened more intently to my command than I expected.

I spent a few minutes in the parking lot seeing how ham-fisted I could get before it would spin. You have to do some pretty stupid things to get it to spin, but the OEM configuration tolerates that level of stupidity and would likely keep you in line. If the tires are howling and you abruptly lift without unwinding some of the steering, you'll be looking at where you just came from in short order.

The car REALLY wants to turn under braking now. You can just feel it. The slightest movement of the wheel during heavy braking results in the front end begging to go that direction like a dog panting heavily with its tongue hanging out. Get too aggressive with the wheel while braking though, and you can find yourself looking straight ahead at what was previously behind you.

To put it in a single word, the car is "lively" now. It dances with the wheel. It changes direction more like a mid-engined car than any front-engined vehicle has a right doing. The rear end gets into the action now, which is completely missing from the OEM setup without prodigious use of the go-fast pedal.

It's not scary though. As mentioned in a previous post, I'm no Rhys Millen, and it's very controllable to me. There's not even a hint of snap-oversteer. It's just a nice, controlled rotation of the rear. Stay throttle neutral and the car just points and goes. Get hard on the gas and the rear just sticks and propels you forward. You just have be careful when you've got the front-end loaded, and keep the hands loose.

On a track, where the completion of a corner can take a long time and a driver can drive around the factory understeer to a degree, this setup is much faster. On an autocross, where there isn't as much time or room to drive around the factory push, this car will dominate all other stock-suspended 1LEs. It would be like cheating.

I had a very specific goal when I reached out to JPSS. As a daily driver, I wanted to retain this car's current ride quality and ride height, but dial as much of the factory understeer out as possible.

This was a resounding success.


May I quote this in your Facebook gallery?
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Old 08-12-2016, 07:01 PM   #7
Billy10mm

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post


May I quote this in your Facebook gallery?
Absolutely.
__________________
My thoughts on some things:
  • Driving Nannies: If I'm that far out of shape on the street, something has gone terribly wrong and by all means Mr. Computer man, come and get me.
  • G2s: Rock throwing is like like a tramp stamp; although problematic, it's a sign of good things to come.
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Old 08-12-2016, 07:31 PM   #8
clarkkent
 
Drives: 2013 2SS (sold)
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Very cool!
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Old 08-12-2016, 08:27 PM   #9
olblue75


 
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I put the radius arm bushings (got from Pete at Bowling Green C5Fest last year) with a set of 1LE shocks and struts and a ZL1 front sway bar in a few weeks ago and the steering seems much more precise compared to the original 2010 SS FE2 stuff, I was completely satisfied with the results especially with the 1LE bar that I put in last fall. My next project would be to do solid rear subframe bushings and 1LE/ZL1 toe rods and trailing arms, I already have the Z/28 RUCA bushings just need to do them. Would there be any tire wear issues with the above front end alignment specs??

Oh yeah and Pete is the MAN!!!!!!!
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Old 08-12-2016, 08:28 PM   #10
JusticePete
 
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I would say tire life is reduced by 10 to 15% max.
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Old 08-12-2016, 10:45 PM   #11
backeddy
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Nice job Pete, have fun Billy!
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Old 08-13-2016, 12:20 AM   #12
nilfinite
 
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Amazing review! Pete is the man. Wish I was close enough to meet him in person. I'd trust Pete at the highest levels to work on my car!
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Old 08-13-2016, 09:11 AM   #13
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So true,
Ordered my rear bar from JPSS
Looking to get that neutral feel and drive off the corners like a boss.
I autocross the car and if my trail braking is off I dump truck into the turn.lol
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Old 08-13-2016, 04:39 PM   #14
Olddudesrule
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Amazing review! Pete is the man. Wish I was close enough to meet him in person. I'd trust Pete at the highest levels to work on my car!
Gotta echo this sentiment! Just doesn't seem to be anyone out west with the same reputation. Hope to find one soon, or I'll be shipping my car off to Pete!
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