History of the ZL1

[Mr Twisty]

For those that don't know where the name came from.... Nice choice, GM

http://musclecars.howstuffworks.com/...camaro-zl1.htm

[LOWDOWN]

Dick Harrell, through Fred Gibb Chevrolet, was the "main man" getting the COPO 9560 program rolling. Piggins was "in", as long as Gibb ordered 50. "Don't worry 'bout the price, I'll handle that", was Piggins' comforting word. 'Cept the beancounters couldn't be handled...and the $4,000 + upcharge was a LOT more than anyone previously involved expected... Some were returned. 19 were ordered by other dealers. Some dealers were given "unobtainium" allocations as armtwisters to take the returned units. At least one of those languished into the early '70's and was eventually sold with a smallblock transplant. ALL were incredible cars, back in the day...

[Mr. Wyndham]

Important point is that ZL-1 was the name of the ENGINE...not the car.

So "ZL1" is a new name for Camaro!

[detltu]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Important point is that ZL-1 was the name of the ENGINE...not the car.

So "ZL1" is a new name for Camaro!

This is true but its not like they didn't think about it back then. They actually built 2 ZL1 protypes with ZL 1 badging and everything. They were black cars with gold stripes (I know one had the gold stripes but I am not 100% sure that the other one did).



These prototypes were even brought out in the 1970 press release and driven by the press.

Then Bill Mitchel built this car:


Which also had ZL1 badging
It eventually turned into this car:


Then of course there were the GMMG cars in 2002:


and now the 2011 SLP ZL-1:

[Mr. Wyndham]

Thanks for taking the time to dig into all of that!!
It all contributes to the legacy and myth behind the nameplate, but...

This is the first real ZL1 Camaro.

[detltu]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Thanks for taking the time to dig into all of that!!
It all contributes to the legacy and myth behind the nameplate, but...

This is the first real ZL1 Camaro.

I've been on a ZL1 kick lately even before this announcement. I definately think they chose the proper name for this car.

[sspaul]

i think it would have been really cool to put the ls7 in it instead of the supercharged lsa.

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by sspaul

i think it would have been really cool to put the ls7 in it instead of the supercharged lsa.

+1

I think the LS7 would have been the perfect engine for it given the history. That, or the LS9 since it is the best Chevy has right now. Being that theZL1 is the "ultimate" type camaaro, kinda weird they went with ZL1 now that I think about it more since they didn't pack it with either their largest or most powerful engine. hmm

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

+1

I think the LS7 would have been the perfect engine for it given the history. That, or the LS9 since it is the best Chevy has right now. Being that theZL1 is the "ultimate" type camaaro, kinda weird they went with ZL1 now that I think about it more since they didn't pack it with either their largest or most powerful engine. hmm

One. Big. Reason...

Cost. Both the LS7 and LS9 are more expensive engines than the LSA. And the former doesn't put out enough power to compete with the GT500.

The name was chosen...not literally...but in the spirit of the original COPO car with the ZL-1 Engine.

[mikeSS]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

One. Big. Reason...

Cost. Both the LS7 and LS9 are more expensive engines than the LSA. And the former doesn't put out enough power to compete with the GT500.

The name was chosen...not literally...but in the spirit of the original COPO car with the ZL-1 Engine.

the Zl1 was name for the engine right. but this not a new engine. i think if they had a brand new engine for this car then the name would fit more

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

One. Big. Reason...

Cost. Both the LS7 and LS9 are more expensive engines than the LSA. And the former doesn't put out enough power to compete with the GT500.

The name was chosen...not literally...but in the spirit of the original COPO car with the ZL-1 Engine.

I guess everything has a price, even heritage.

[Mr Twisty]

If they were trying to keep with the heritage, they would have stuffed the LS9 in the car and made it look like the V6 LS. Of course the price would double as well... Like the original car.

In the SPIRIT of the name, they did build the baddest factory Camaro... ever.

[LOWDOWN]

As with all things regarding "history", there is always a chance of some "blurry-ness" setting in.

There already has been an "official" GM ZL1 ...and it wasn't a Camaro. The '69 ZL1 engine was, in fact, readied for production for CORVETTE. The ZL1 "package" was listed in the '69 Corvette V.O.G. Essentially, it substituted the ZL1 engine for the cast iron-blocked L88 (meaning NO Power Steering/Heater/Radio could be ordered, but J56 HD Brakes and K66 IgnitionMUST be ordered), and was to include fender flares (to be installed post-delivery).

The St. Louis Corvette Plant Manager ordered one as a "demo"...and that car, fully restored, resides at Roger's Corvettes in Maitland FL., the only original Corvette ZL1 mated to its original engine. T-shaped front end/hood stripe.

Zora Arkus Duntov had a proving-ground "mule", a red roadster with a Turbo 400...fitted with open headers and 9" drag slicks! Tested/reported by Car Life Magazine, the car ran high 10s in spring-'69!! Duntov also had a road-racy version at Milford, to show the car's track prowess. Both Milford cars are believed to have been "engineering exercises" and NOT production-built.

Which leaves the "John Maher" Red Turbo 400 Roadster as likely the only other production-built ZL1... "Blurry" history, indeed!

With orders stalled, and Tonawanda having the parts 'n pieces for many more engines for the program, Dick Harrell/Fred Gibb were "timely" in their "cooperation" with Vince Piggins...

The '69 Camaro "ZL1" was in fact known "officially" as COPO 9560 and, contrary to urban legend, the COPO (both 9560, and the L72-engined 9561) was available with any non-conflicting RPO...including RS Package, Power Windows, Deluxe Interior/Exterior Packages, Console etc. Not all of them were "strippers"...

Nowhere on the car is there a ZL1 identifier/emblem...but there IS on the Corvette...

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by mikeSS

the Zl1 was name for the engine right. but this not a new engine. i think if they had a brand new engine for this car then the name would fit more

The name represents more than just the engine. It's the sheer power behind it, and the technological advancements the '69 engine included. Back then, the engine literally cost the same as a V8-equipped CAR. It nearly doubled the price of the vehicle. So...to do that again would result in a $60k+ Camaro with nothing behind the SS trim but a powerful engine...

This car features most of GM's more advanced technologies, and it chaulk full of high-performance, Corvette-rivaling features...personally, I think that captures the spirit of "ZL1" as best possible today....that's my .02, anyways. I know you're not thrilled with the name, and I don't want to sound like I'm berating you about it -- I'm not.

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

I guess everything has a price, even heritage.

Definitely

Originally Posted by MisterCamaro69

If they were trying to keep with the heritage, they would have stuffed the LS9 in the car and made it look like the V6 LS. Of course the price would double as well... Like the original car.

In the SPIRIT of the name, they did build the baddest factory Camaro... ever.