Z/28, will it have a forged rotating assembly?

[sask-man]

I've looked everywhere and have not found ONE single fact that the Z-28 is in line to head to R&D for GM. MotorTrend writes a bunch of stuff as fact and as someone already has pointed out, they all write smack quoting there highly placed sources only to back away from the statements several months later with all sorts of excuses.

There has not been ONE GM person that would have any decision making to actualy step the Z-28 program into development stage make any reference or comment I am aware of stating the Z-28 program is still on the books. If there has been, can someone post it please.

As I said, I would love nothing more and would wait till it come to life to buy one. I think we are all excited that the 2010's have made such a strong debut for sales and are making GM quite a nice profit - thus jumping to conclusions that the Z-28 surely must be in line.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by sask-man

I've looked everywhere and have not found ONE single fact that the Z-28 is in line to head to R&D for GM. MotorTrend writes a bunch of stuff as fact and as someone already has pointed out, they all write smack quoting there highly placed sources only to back away from the statements several months later with all sorts of excuses.

There has not been ONE GM person that would have any decision making to actualy step the Z-28 program into development stage make any reference or comment I am aware of stating the Z-28 program is still on the books. If there has been, can someone post it please.

As I said, I would love nothing more and would wait till it come to life to buy one. I think we are all excited that the 2010's have made such a strong debut for sales and are making GM quite a nice profit - thus jumping to conclusions that the Z-28 surely must be in line.

You doubt...I can sense it through the force...very dangerous.
...Doubt leads to the darkside.

there's this:
http://www.camaro5.com/?p=2440
and this:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43600
and this:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56132

and the fact that the nonexistance of such a vehicle if ever there was one the Z28 is not a default inso assuming that such a car would have trouble existing in a performance market like the one at hand.

"Keep the faith".

While there's nothing "official" confirming the car, there's nothing "official" discrediting it either. And besides all that, what is the forum here for if not to speculate on nonexistant vehicles/models/features? It's all in good fun.

In other words...."Don't piss on our parade!!"

[radz28]

Originally Posted by sask-man

I have not seen anything anywhere from GM that indicated the Z-28 is on the books to be produced. After the crash and the bailout the "idea" that they would produce the Camaro, then the ragtop, then the Z-28 was put on permanet hiatus. The Ragtop was already in early stages and was pushed ahead...but I have NEVER read or heard anything from GM that the Z-28 idea is still alive.

Trust me I would LOVE it to be so...but until GM releases word, it's all wishful thinking!

"Keep the Faith"

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

you probably haven't looked hard enough or read between the lines enough. there's been no official statement but enough people in the company have stated several different things about the possibility of the Z28. plus two motortrend says it's in the works. . .from their official source. . .

:tweetz::emoticon7::i diot::notheadlights:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

You doubt...I can sense it through the force...very dangerous.
...Doubt leads to the darkside.

there's this:
http://www.camaro5.com/?p=2440
and this:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43600
and this:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56132

and the fact that the nonexistance of such a vehicle if ever there was one the Z28 is not a default inso assuming that such a car would have trouble existing in a performance market like the one at hand.

"Keep the faith".

While there's nothing "official" confirming the car, there's nothing "official" discrediting it either. And besides all that, what is the forum here for if not to speculate on nonexistant vehicles/models/features? It's all in good fun.

In other words...."Don't piss on our parade!!"

Are these in a Sticky for quick referrence?... And plus-two on the pee'ing-thing

[KarFan]

GM is in the business of building production cars for profit. They obviously felt that the LSA will meet and exceed the necessary durability standards with the parts that it has. Building a race engine isn't in their business plans. Regardless of what the blue oval crew is doing in Dearborn.
The LS series of V8's has given us a great starting platform for performance but it's just a starting point like all of the SBC's that came before it.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by KarFan

GM is in the business of building production cars for profit. They obviously felt that the LSA will meet and exceed the necessary durability standards with the parts that it has. Building a race engine isn't in their business plans. Regardless of what the blue oval crew is doing in Dearborn.
The LS series of V8's has given us a great starting platform for performance but it's just a starting point like all of the SBC's that came before it.

I'm going to go so far as to say the Gen IIIs and IVs picked up where the SBC left off, and then some. It should, being 50 years newer, but that's saying a lot about the original SBC. They're still a definate contender today

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by radz282003

I'm going to go so far as to say the Gen IIIs and IVs picked up where the SBC left off, and then some. It should, being 50 years newer, but that's saying a lot about the original SBC. They're still a definate contender today

what about the LT1 and LT4s? you know.... the Gen II motors.....

[radz28]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

what about the LT1 and LT4s? you know.... the Gen II motors.....

Rubbish...

J/K - I loved my M6 LT1 too Gettin' a little chirp on the 2-3 was always fun. That thing was a trooper. I could never drive it good enough to get a good time though.

You got me there though - my bad :bangdesk::slice::ba nned::fi ghting0056:

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Rubbish...

J/K - I loved my M6 LT1 too Gettin' a little chirp on the 2-3 was always fun. That thing was a trooper. I could never drive it good enough to get a good time though.

You got me there though - my bad

LT1 POWA!!!!


optispark.... 60% of the time, it works every time.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

LT1 POWA!!!!


optispark.... 60% of the time, it works every time.

Opticrap... I had good luck with mine, right up to just under 100K miles. Not the water pump though... I was just going to go with the Petronics conversion if that POS ever took a dump. I almost went in head-first with those LT4 conversions you used to be able to find at Summit, but I figured I'd rather have a car with close to the same power with a warranty than a shortblock and powertrain with 100K miles. The syncros' were hurting, brakes were shot, and she just needed a major maintainence overhaul; nothing I couldn't do, but if it was the amount of a good down payment on almost a brand new car... Ugh - I've been without a Camaro since May; I haven't been without a Camaro since November of 1997 :(

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Opticrap... I had good luck with mine, right up to just under 100K miles. Not the water pump though... I was just going to go with the Petronics conversion if that POS ever took a dump. I almost went in head-first with those LT4 conversions you used to be able to find at Summit, but I figured I'd rather have a car with close to the same power with a warranty than a shortblock and powertrain with 100K miles. The syncros' were hurting, brakes were shot, and she just needed a major maintainence overhaul; nothing I couldn't do, but if it was the amount of a good down payment on almost a brand new car... Ugh - I've been without a Camaro since May; I haven't been without a Camaro since November of 1997 :(

my opti is still running good, I did the LTCC conversion a little over a year ago which removes the high voltage spark running thru the opti and basically converts it into a cam pos sensor. I'm glad you didnt do the LT4 conversion, for the power you get vs the money you spend, you could easily get a lot more from an LE or AI head/cam package.

I know the feeling of being without a camaro, my trans has been shot for quite some time now and.... dare I say it.... I'm thinking about giving her up for something more... special to me.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by El-Diablo

It's not a moot argument, it's very relevant to someone who wants to make serious power and work with a car that can handle it without a full rebuild being necessary.

I'm going to disagree with the bold statement as well, there is a market for people interested in surpassing the 600 wheel horsepower mark. You probably are under the assumption that their isn't because you don't see many people doing it here. Most likely because their tuner is telling them not to go that far unless they want to build their engine. Jump onto a Cobra forum and you will see a considerable amount of people making wheel horsepower in the 600-750 range, and some 800, 900, even 1000 horsepower in their 03/04 Cobras and GT500's on engines that many of which haven't had the valve cover off. And they're doing it because they can on the factory forged rotating assembly.

I'm not trying to make this into Ford VS Chevy bs argument. But they are comparable cars. We can also discuss GM vs GM. The ZR1 comes with a forged rotating assembly, I'm sure most can guess why.

There is a market for just about everything. However, the smaller the market you target, the lower your sales will be. GM could sell a lot more ~550 hp Z28's for ~$50k than ~640 hp @$60k. So even though some are willing to pay for the stronger engine there are more who won't. How big of a market is there of people who want ... 800 hp yet don't want to go with a purpose built engine?

The LS9 is forged for 2 reasons. First, it is more powerful to start with and needs to meet the same durability standards of the LSA. Second, people are more likely to abuse it than a Caddy. Now, I honestley believe that most of those who want a crazy powerful Camaro will just get an SS and do what they want, up to and including an engine swap with a purpose built engine. Sure, there will be some who do this with a Z28 too but I think there will be a smaller percentage of Z28 buyers willing to go to those power levels. Most will buy it because of its stock capabilities, not modding potential.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Are these in a Sticky for quick referrence?... And plus-two on the pee'ing-thing

Nope. That was advanced searching at its finest.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

There is a market for just about everything. However, the smaller the market you target, the lower your sales will be. GM could sell a lot more ~550 hp Z28's for ~$50k than ~640 hp @$60k. So even though some are willing to pay for the stronger engine there are more who won't. How big of a market is there of people who want ... 800 hp yet don't want to go with a purpose built engine?

The LS9 is forged for 2 reasons. First, it is more powerful to start with and needs to meet the same durability standards of the LSA. Second, people are more likely to abuse it than a Caddy. Now, I honestley believe that most of those who want a crazy powerful Camaro will just get an SS and do what they want, up to and including an engine swap with a purpose built engine. Sure, there will be some who do this with a Z28 too but I think there will be a smaller percentage of Z28 buyers willing to go to those power levels. Most will buy it because of its stock capabilities, not modding potential.

Exactly! I'd do $50K for a 550 HP Z28 because I feel that's a good value. If they were to go the LSA route, there's no reason one couldn't turn the boost up and make the intake and exhaust a little more efficient and at least meet LS9 power levels for a few grand. That's a lot less than the $60K I, too, think a LS9 Z28 would fetch.

I agree, too, that many people looking for those extreme power levels will purpose-build their engines and probably end up spending a little less (I don't think it would meet the same durability standards as LS9, in some ways, but that's besides the point). For me, LSA makes perfect sense in so many ways, including cost and easy of mod'ability. If it were to come with LSA, a simple pulley swap, CAI, and CB (I'm still on the fence about shorties...) with maybe an intercooler upgrade and a optimized tune would easily (IMO) get me to a power level that I'd be completely happy with and drivability and reliability that I'd have no worries about; not to mention, it's not like the local law enforcement or smog referees wouldn't have anything to ding me on. It's just easier, this way, for me; that's not to say a NA Z28 on a small diet wouldn't do it for me but unless that engine will spin past LS3's 6500 RPM redline, I don't think it'll have forged parts. Maybe a forged crank, but I don't think they'd forge the pistons (they didn't in LS7, but they did add Ti rods).

We just don't know and won't know until GM spills the beans

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Exactly! I'd do $50K for a 550 HP Z28 because I feel that's a good value. If they were to go the LSA route, there's no reason one couldn't turn the boost up and make the intake and exhaust a little more efficient and at least meet LS9 power levels for a few grand. That's a lot less than the $60K I, too, think a LS9 Z28 would fetch.

I agree, too, that many people looking for those extreme power levels will purpose-build their engines and probably end up spending a little less (I don't think it would meet the same durability standards as LS9, in some ways, but that's besides the point). For me, LSA makes perfect sense in so many ways, including cost and easy of mod'ability. If it were to come with LSA, a simple pulley swap, CAI, and CB (I'm still on the fence about shorties...) with maybe an intercooler upgrade and a optimized tune would easily (IMO) get me to a power level that I'd be completely happy with and drivability and reliability that I'd have no worries about; not to mention, it's not like the local law enforcement or smog referees wouldn't have anything to ding me on. It's just easier, this way, for me; that's not to say a NA Z28 on a small diet wouldn't do it for me but unless that engine will spin past LS3's 6500 RPM redline, I don't think it'll have forged parts. Maybe a forged crank, but I don't think they'd forge the pistons (they didn't in LS7, but they did add Ti rods).

We just don't know and won't know until GM spills the beans

I'm just going to leave this here....