CAMARO ZL1 test mule spotted during track testing!!

[Katech]

Originally Posted by Vega

The LS9 comes supercharged, without the supercharger its basically just an LS3, same with the LSA its just a supercharged LS3 (although for argument's sake both engines are modified to be supercharged but still, they're all LS3 motors with different superchargers) which is why i like the LS7, its a different motor altogether and is the only N/A of the bunch. But all that aside i totally agree with you, i think you should be able to order a variety of V8s in your Camaro just like you could in the good ole days. The Camaro should have a vaaast variety of customization options from engine and drivetrain to gearing (pleeaase give us 3:73 gears!) to interior and exterior cosmetic options, etc., the heritage grill is already a great step in the right direction, now i wanna see the ducktail spoiler from the Dale Jr. Camaro, throw in a few other goodies like extra colors (without lame catches like "oh its gotta be non-SS and non-RS, basically nothing cool, but you get an awsome color") haha, but yeah customization is key, ohhh and give us some hood options, im salivating over those Nickey Stinger hoods

More internet myth. The LS9 has different block, heads, valves, crank, rods, and pistons than the LS3, so it's not "basically just and LS3."

[Vega]

Originally Posted by Sheitskees

Yeah I sure hope that's what they do. But who knows, I doubt that's what going to happen but it would totally be awesome. I agree with the color options as well, because I heard the synergy green color is going to be released but not for the SS? If that's true it's pretty stupid. I don't personally want it in that color for now, it was cool looking at first but I don't think I want such an attention grabbing car. They car already grabs enough attention as is, but in lime green would probably make it a little worse! Personally I don't really care much for hood options, I'll be replacing the hood with CF anyways. Also with the rims, I hope with the Z28 they'll let you put the more standard rims on for cheaper if you don't want the rims they're offering seeing as I plan on replacing that anyways.

Sheitskees.

Yeah, im pretty sure the Z/28 will have a lot of Carbon Fiber in it as it is, just like they did with the ZR1, one of their big focuses is said to be on weight savings and Carbon Fiber is a great weight saver. Me on the other hand, i dont really care, i just want a powerful, aggressive, V8 Camaro >=} haha, and yeah the synergy green will only be available on non-SS and non-RS cars, they have to be plain sport coupes, which is retarted, i also hope they add LeMans Blue as a color since thats almost been the Camaro's trademark color since the beginning, really almost every generation cept 4th has been big on LeMans blue so i hope they get that goin again. I really hope the Z/28 gets a unique interior face-lift, like maybe changing the gauges slightly, more performance-oriented seats, stuff like that

[Krozzbow]

It’s bad enough with our Camaro’s shoulders being wide. How wide can it get cause I’ve seen some widen shoulders and they don’t look good as a weekend cruiser unless your in a track.

[Number 3]

The following should not be interpretted in any way as to the origin of the car in the original post by Tran. You may all continue to speculate away.

But for those of you that believe that GM can offer any engine that you want let me just go through the items that likely would have to be re-designed. re-validated or both for any new model, Z28 or something between the SS and LT for that matter.

Engine mounts
Transmission mounts
Rear axle (if the HP is higher)
Fuel System
Radiator and Cooling (if the HP is higher)
New tachometer (if the engine redline is different)
New speedometer (if the top speed is different)
ALL Uniquely styled components and subsystems even if simply badging

Add to that the full list of FMVSS testing
Add to that the full list of EPA testing

Then you have to tune the suspension for ride and handling.

Then you have to tune the car for Noise, Vibration and Harshness (NVH)

And then you have all of the unique manufacturing equipment in Oshawa for each and every single one of the unique parts in any new model. Sorry using a dealer doesn't work. Good idea, but not practicle. Other vendors (SLP from past Camaro history) might work.

Now you haven't even touched on the thousands and thousands of hours devoted to calibration of the engine, transmission, safety equipment, etc.

You are talking BIG, BIG, BIG dollars for any variation on any model.

It takes a ton of work, and ton of equipment and a ton of testing.

And plant complexity? Every nut, bolt, badge or color difference just piles on to the cost of manufacturing.

In 1967, it was not too hard. Today? Yikes!!!!!!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by The Black Stig

it's not all ready hard to park? LMAO

Um...No? I've never had a problem parking it. Once forwards, and once backing up into a spot. Admittedly, I don't own it...but it's not hard.

Originally Posted by Number 3

The following should not be interpretted in any way as to the origin of the car in the original post by Tran. You may all continue to speculate away.

But for those of you that believe that GM can offer any engine that you want let me just go through the items that likely would have to be re-designed. re-validated or both for any new model, Z28 or something between the SS and LT for that matter.

Engine mounts
Transmission mounts
Rear axle (if the HP is higher)
Fuel System
Radiator and Cooling (if the HP is higher)
New tachometer (if the engine redline is different)
New speedometer (if the top speed is different)
ALL Uniquely styled components and subsystems even if simply badging

Add to that the full list of FMVSS testing
Add to that the full list of EPA testing

Then you have to tune the suspension for ride and handling.

Then you have to tune the car for Noise, Vibration and Harshness (NVH)

And then you have all of the unique manufacturing equipment in Oshawa for each and every single one of the unique parts in any new model. Sorry using a dealer doesn't work. Good idea, but not practicle. Other vendors (SLP from past Camaro history) might work.

Now you haven't even touched on the thousands and thousands of hours devoted to calibration of the engine, transmission, safety equipment, etc.

You are talking BIG, BIG, BIG dollars for any variation on any model.

It takes a ton of work, and ton of equipment and a ton of testing.

And plant complexity? Every nut, bolt, badge or color difference just piles on to the cost of manufacturing.

In 1967, it was not too hard. Today? Yikes!!!!!!

Every option we want to see added or "offered" will require a hundred specific changes to the line in all and more of the areas mentioned above. :(

[The Black Stig]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Um...No? I've never had a problem parking it. Once forwards, and once backing up into a spot. Admittedly, I don't own it...but it's not hard.


Every option we want to see added or "offered" will require a hundred specific changes to the line in all and more of the areas mentioned above. :(

5th Gen + limo tint + Night+ plus backing up = stig go

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by The Black Stig

5th Gen + limo tint + Night+ plus backing up = stig go

Well that changes things now doesn't it?

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Tran

Historically that's true, but this generation Z28 should receive a noticeably beefed up body -- wider front and rear fenders, beefier and more aggressive looking front fascia and rear end, etc.

And that's gonna make guys like me snap at the last minute and trade for one. Instead of make my own.

But as for now, I'm sticking to my plans. lol

[Vega]

Originally Posted by Number 3

The following should not be interpretted in any way as to the origin of the car in the original post by Tran. You may all continue to speculate away.

But for those of you that believe that GM can offer any engine that you want let me just go through the items that likely would have to be re-designed. re-validated or both for any new model, Z28 or something between the SS and LT for that matter.

Engine mounts
Transmission mounts
Rear axle (if the HP is higher)
Fuel System
Radiator and Cooling (if the HP is higher)
New tachometer (if the engine redline is different)
New speedometer (if the top speed is different)
ALL Uniquely styled components and subsystems even if simply badging

Add to that the full list of FMVSS testing
Add to that the full list of EPA testing

Then you have to tune the suspension for ride and handling.

Then you have to tune the car for Noise, Vibration and Harshness (NVH)

And then you have all of the unique manufacturing equipment in Oshawa for each and every single one of the unique parts in any new model. Sorry using a dealer doesn't work. Good idea, but not practicle. Other vendors (SLP from past Camaro history) might work.

Now you haven't even touched on the thousands and thousands of hours devoted to calibration of the engine, transmission, safety equipment, etc.

You are talking BIG, BIG, BIG dollars for any variation on any model.

It takes a ton of work, and ton of equipment and a ton of testing.

And plant complexity? Every nut, bolt, badge or color difference just piles on to the cost of manufacturing.

In 1967, it was not too hard. Today? Yikes!!!!!!

Err, for creating a whole new trim level like the Z/28 yes i can agree with you, if that is what you mean. But if you're talking about the engine swap thing i very much beg to differ. Every LS engine is made specificly with the same motor mounts, same bolt pattern in all areas including transmission, same basic scaling, everything on those engines is made the same for the simple reason of making them all interchangeable, also most of the electronics work on all the engines too. Really all you gotta do to swap an LS engine out for a different LS engine is pop one out, slide the other in, change the chip to match the engine you've swapped in, tune it, and thats pretty much all there is too it. GM builds those engines specificly to work like that. Also the Camaro's transmission will handle the power of any LS engine save for maybe the LS9 and will definatly bolt up to any of them. After that the rest is unecessary to change, suspension doesnt matter to what engine is in the car as neither does the safety equipment etc.

I mean yeah engines today are a lot more technologicly advanced but they're really not as complex as most people think, especially when it comes to engine swaps. In fact GM boasted somewhere in an article about the LS7 Camaro that any average Joe could order an LS7 and have it in his Camaro in just about a weekend's time, and if any average Joe with average garage tools can do it that quick im sure a dealer can.

[Camaro_Corvette]

LIES! ALL LIES!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Vega

GM builds those engines specificly to work like that.

He IS GM.

The Camaro's Transmission is not built to the same spec as, say, the Z06's. Similar to how all GMs auto transmissions are nearly identical, they come in varying strengths for different power outputs. The same holds true for Tremec.

Besides, the minute you change a single thing...a bolt, even...policy dictates that part gets tested to make sure it meets internal standards.

[MontyCarlo]

Ah, we're making progress: this time Number 3 admitted that the pictures show some kind of car!

[Vega]

No, im not GM, but i do happen to know a bit about the Tremec T56 and the LS engine line, enough to know they do work together. The LS7 is offered in the Z06, yes, but that doesnt mean only a Z06 transmission will work with it, besides it was proven the LS7 would work with the T56 in the LS7 Camaro Concept shown with the Dale Jr.Camaro and Black Camaro. The T56 can handle any LS engine up to the LS9 which the Magnum T56 can handle. I really dont think it would be that hard to do, i mean yeah there may be some hang ups here or there so it may take a while to get fully online but it cant be [I]that[I] epic of a feat to accomplish.

...But as an afterthought i really dont wanna argue about it. Being on this site ive noticed crap like this happens a lot, one guy voices an oppinion an gets gang-raped for it. Besides this stuff is off topic anyways haha, we need to be talking about the Z/28, not SS engine swaps right? haha, so for the sake of the thread i just wanna swallow my pride and let it drop lol

[MontyCarlo]

Originally Posted by Vega

No, im not GM, but i do happen to know a bit about the Tremec T56 and the LS engine line, enough to know they do work together. The LS7 is offered in the Z06, yes, but that doesnt mean only a Z06 transmission will work with it, besides it was proven the LS7 would work with the T56 in the LS7 Camaro Concept shown with the Dale Jr.Camaro and Black Camaro. The T56 can handle any LS engine up to the LS9 which the Magnum T56 can handle. I really dont think it would be that hard to do, i mean yeah there may be some hang ups here or there so it may take a while to get fully online but it cant be [I]that[I] epic of a feat to accomplish.

Bottom line bro, any time Number 3 actually says something definitive about GM, you might as well take it as the gospel truth. If he says the required testing and assembly line changes would add significant costs to every Camaro, they would.