CAMARO ZL1 test mule spotted during track testing!!

[The Black Stig]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Jolly good show



Hmm... I'm more concerned with that big@$$, heavy fuel tank under my car. Lighting my grille can be dangerous enough, let along drive around on one of those, lol. All kidding aside, I know Roush makes retrofit kits for F150s or something. That looks promising, but it just seems, logisically, the infrastructure is not there at all for something like this. The time it would take to find a filling station and all that is just too much for me, at least. If that would change, I'd probably get on board.

I don't see this on Z28, nor would I want to. I'm sure we're not going to find technology on Z28 that isn't, nor has been, presented on or by Corvette. The foundations for the powertrain already exist for Z28 andI don't really see this as a possilibility, nor am I interested.

If your really knew how tuff those tanks were you wouldn't be worried at all.
And remember propane is compress so you could carry more fuel with the same size tank you have now.

IMHO the infrastructure is here, **uck theres a refill sataion at my local walgreens now....

Will it be not the z28... of course not, but a possbilty in the near future? Maybe.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by The Black Stig

If your really knew how tuff those tanks were you wouldn't be worried at all.
And remember propane is compress so you could carry more fuel with the same size tank you have now.

IMHO the infrastructure is here, **uck theres a refill sataion at my local walgreens now....

Will it be not the z28... of course not, but a possbilty in the near future? Maybe.

I'm sure you're right Call me a worry wart

Please, and this goes for everyone, keep a watch for the profanity. I'm editing this one, this once, but these can be infractions

Thanks

[frankss]

well look at the Formula 1 cars... they are like what.... 4-5 L V8's and they make like 700hp?? that is the technology we need....

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by frankss

well look at the Formula 1 cars... they are like what.... 4-5 L V8's and they make like 700hp?? that is the technology we need....

They're half that size, but they do make in the area of 700-750 hp. But that blatently ignores the fact that nobody would be able to drive a real car with such an engine because they have practically no torque (a V6 Camaro likely makes more) and require insane rev's to make any power (up to 19k). This is fine if your car weighs less than 1400 lbs but a Z28 could weigh 3 times as much. Not to mention the fact that these engines need to be rebuilt after running for 2 hours. By comparison, the LSA has been run for something like 270 consecutive hours at wide open throttle, with no problems.

Even using derivative technology, what would be the point? Bragging rights about hp/L? Drop a small displacement, high revving engine and a larger slow turning engine of equal power into the same car and 2 things will happen. First, the smaller engined car will accelerate slower (less torque), and consume more gas in doing so. I could write a page or two on the subject, but the short story version is that there isnt much to gain from a performance stand point by using engines with a high specific output.

[The Roc]

Originally Posted by rays1417

I don't think we should get too excited!!! I won't GET on board until GM gives the word! I JUST DON'T LIKE THE LET DOWN!

TRUE STORY!

[ZYA_LTR]

The aftermarket is already there for propane, i don't have the specifics, but i can tell you this, that there are kits out there being mass produced, and the foks that stand to see the greatest gain from propane are forced induction engines. The diesel guys have been using the stuff for awhile, as it a much safer alternative to nitrous oxide for the diesel crowd. Google it, and the information out there is boggling. Some guys at work have played with the stuff, and have done alot of research on the process.

[wildpaws]

Originally Posted by ZYA_LTR

The aftermarket is already there for propane, i don't have the specifics, but i can tell you this, that there are kits out there being mass produced, and the foks that stand to see the greatest gain from propane are forced induction engines. The diesel guys have been using the stuff for awhile, as it a much safer alternative to nitrous oxide for the diesel crowd. Google it, and the information out there is boggling. Some guys at work have played with the stuff, and have done alot of research on the process.

One of the shows on Speed Channel recently did a conversion of a old muscle car (SS 396 Chevelle if I remember correctly) to run on propane, pretty interesting and you couldn't tell anything had been done from the outside or when hearing it run.
Clyde

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

They're half that size, but they do make in the area of 700-750 hp. But that blatently ignores the fact that nobody would be able to drive a real car with such an engine because they have practically no torque (a V6 Camaro likely makes more) and require insane rev's to make any power (up to 19k). This is fine if your car weighs less than 1400 lbs but a Z28 could weigh 3 times as much. Not to mention the fact that these engines need to be rebuilt after running for 2 hours. By comparison, the LSA has been run for something like 270 consecutive hours at wide open throttle, with no problems.

Even using derivative technology, what would be the point? Bragging rights about hp/L? Drop a small displacement, high revving engine and a larger slow turning engine of equal power into the same car and 2 things will happen. First, the smaller engined car will accelerate slower (less torque), and consume more gas in doing so. I could write a page or two on the subject, but the short story version is that there isnt much to gain from a performance stand point by using engines with a high specific output.

that's not entirely true. there are other variables that can/would even out the discrepency of the lack of torque (gear ratios). And as for fuel mileage, again, there are too many variables.


In general, an engine under higher load will run more efficiently. I do agree that there is a balance to be struck.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by ZYA_LTR

The aftermarket is already there for propane, i don't have the specifics, but i can tell you this, that there are kits out there being mass produced, and the foks that stand to see the greatest gain from propane are forced induction engines. The diesel guys have been using the stuff for awhile, as it a much safer alternative to nitrous oxide for the diesel crowd. Google it, and the information out there is boggling. Some guys at work have played with the stuff, and have done alot of research on the process.

Originally Posted by wildpaws

One of the shows on Speed Channel recently did a conversion of a old muscle car (SS 396 Chevelle if I remember correctly) to run on propane, pretty interesting and you couldn't tell anything had been done from the outside or when hearing it run.
Clyde

Yeah - I've seen a few builds on TV where propane injection was used; mostly in extreme 4X4 builds or service usage, but still cool.

I think it's a stretch for Z28, let alone Camaro, at least at this time, though. Regardless of that, when I think about if I would buy Z28 with propane injection, I don't think I would. I'm not calling BS on anyone, just that I really don't see it being any less than a hassle to fill up; if ZR1 and CTS-V are any measure of fuel consumption, it'd be a lot, lol. I don't doubt the potential either, but that'd be too much for me. Though, if there were a system to switch from petrol' to propane, that'd be something to really consider; that'd also be a lot more weight...

Let's just see a few more shots - especially under the hood

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

that's not entirely true. there are other variables that can/would even out the discrepency of the lack of torque (gear ratios). And as for fuel mileage, again, there are too many variables.


In general, an engine under higher load will run more efficiently. I do agree that there is a balance to be struck.

Sure, you can go with more aggressive gearing, but high sustained revs eventually kill engines, or at the very least wear them out prematurely. And gearing also has a negative impact on fuel economy. Practically all performance cars that make peak power at high rpm get poor fuel economy. Some of this is internal engine friction, some of it is gearing, some of it is simply not caring. But when a 2.2L I4 in a sub 3000 lb car gets nearly about the same fuel economy of a 6.2L Corvette, there is something seriously wrong.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Sure, you can go with more aggressive gearing, but high sustained revs eventually kill engines, or at the very least wear them out prematurely. And gearing also has a negative impact on fuel economy. Practically all performance cars that make peak power at high rpm get poor fuel economy. Some of this is internal engine friction, some of it is gearing, some of it is simply not caring. But when a 2.2L I4 in a sub 3000 lb car gets nearly about the same fuel economy of a 6.2L Corvette, there is something seriously wrong.

To be fair...the Corvette is the slipperiest car they build short of the Volt, and it's geared REAL low thanks to the available torque in such a light car. 2.73, iirc...

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

To be fair...the Corvette is the slipperiest car they build short of the Volt, and it's geared REAL low thanks to the available torque in such a light car. 2.73, iirc...

It does have less drag, but the engine torque and gearing is precisely what I'm talking about. The engine has enough torque that it can have that gearing. Put those ratio's into an S2000 and it becomes a slug.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

It does have less drag, but the engine torque and gearing is precisely what I'm talking about. The engine has enough torque that it can have that gearing. Put those ratio's into an S2000 and it becomes a slug.

Absolutely. American (and Canadian) Engineering ftw!!

[jackfanta82]

:thum bup:: thumbup::thumb up::t humbup::thumbu p::th umbup::coolpic s: