Toyota Obstructed Justice

[Mr. Wyndham]

Geebus....

They're going to be the biggest name run through our legal system since Enron....maybe.

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Party at my house when it happens.

I'll bring the booze.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Cowboy from Hell

How is Toyota's reputation undeserved??

They have for the most part produced reliable safe vehicles.... remember the media loves the bad news, they're not so keen on the good!!

Its the degree that is undeserved more than anything. Sure, they had higher quality and reliability but generally speaking it wasn't that much better than other brands. And they weren't significantly safer either. Its like getting an A and acting as though an A- is terrible.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Its the degree that is undeserved more than anything. Sure, they had higher quality and reliability but generally speaking it wasn't that much better than other brands. And they weren't significantly safer either. Its like getting an A and acting as though an A- is terrible.

Yup, I agree. Undeserved is too strong a word. Overplayed, "hyped", overrepresented would be more appropriate. Their general marketing department is brilliant...but some of its viewers; not so much.

[Cowboy from Hell]

I just think it's unfair to judge a company until all the facts have come out!!

Yes they have enjoyed a good reputation, and my personal experience (having owned 2 Toyotas) and the experience of many people that i know that have owned Toyotas, it has been well earned.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Cowboy from Hell

I just think it's unfair to judge a company until all the facts have come out!!

As unfair as it is to give a company good reviews without even looking at the cars? The costs of labor/business disparity in the 70s and 80s? The manipulation of the Yen? The intentional withholding of safety concerns from the US market? Or maybe as unfair as the media/societal bias was for the better part of a decade, at least...adding to that 'earned' reputation? When it comes to toyota....the topic of fairness really isn't a solid argument.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Cowboy from Hell

I just think it's unfair to judge a company until all the facts have come out!!

Yes they have enjoyed a good reputation, and my personal experience (having owned 2 Toyotas) and the experience of many people that i know that have owned Toyotas, it has been well earned.

Nobody has said they are garbage, but they're not the miraculous vehicles that many people believe them to be either.

[FenwickHockey65]

Meh. I say they're garbage. The '09 Corolla I was in a few weeks ago was atrocious. Cheap, flimsy materials, hard plastic everywhere, passenger side dash panel wasn't even installed correctly.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

As unfair as it is to give a company good reviews without even looking at the cars? The costs of labor/business disparity in the 70s and 80s? The manipulation of the Yen? The intentional withholding of safety concerns from the US market? Or maybe as unfair as the media/societal bias was for the better part of a decade, at least...adding to that 'earned' reputation? When it comes to toyota....the topic of fairness really isn't a solid argument.

And Japan is paying for that as we speak.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Nobody has said they are garbage, but they're not the miraculous vehicles that many people believe them to be either.

Pretty much. The quality gap has been nearly non-existent for at least 5 years now.

[8cd03gro]

Well it is looking very bearish. . . Hmm. Make money off of Toyota's demise? Don't mind if I do!

[HeHasReturned]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Yup, I agree. Undeserved is too strong a word. Overplayed, "hyped", overrepresented would be more appropriate. Their general marketing department is brilliant...but some of its viewers; not so much.

The people who buy Toyota are no less intelligent than the people who buy GM, who buy Nissan, who buy Ford, who buy Honda, etc. I hope that's not what you were implying...

[Cowboy from Hell]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

As unfair as it is to give a company good reviews without even looking at the cars? The costs of labor/business disparity in the 70s and 80s? The manipulation of the Yen? The intentional withholding of safety concerns from the US market? Or maybe as unfair as the media/societal bias was for the better part of a decade, at least...adding to that 'earned' reputation? When it comes to Toyota....the topic of fairness really isn't a solid argument.

Well i think if the reviewer in question is giving a car a good review without looking at the car in question, he's not a very good reviewer.

As for the Labour/Business disparity in 70's and 80's.. you'll have to explain that to me.. not being from the USA I'm not sure what your referring to.
I can tell you what happened in the UK when they started importing Japanese vehicles and why they took hold so well.

As for Manipulating a currency... that is to do with the Japanese Government.

The intentional withholding of safety concerns etc.. is yet to be proven. After all this is what this is all about.

Toyota and Lexus have reacted to resolve issues with their vehicles... as any Car Manufacturer should!!


I'm trying to keep a neutral stance, keeping an open mind and waiting to see what comes of all of this. That is what i mean by "unfair", some people have already made up their minds and i believe that even if Toyota are absolved of all these accusations it won't change them.


I wonder if Chevrolet were under the spotlight whether they would be getting the same reaction!!

[justa25thTA]

Originally Posted by Cowboy from Hell

Well i think if the reviewer in question is giving a car a good review without looking at the car in question, he's not a very good reviewer.

As for the Labour/Business disparity in 70's and 80's.. you'll have to explain that to me.. not being from the USA I'm not sure what your referring to.
I can tell you what happened in the UK when they started importing Japanese vehicles and why they took hold so well.

As for Manipulating a currency... that is to do with the Japanese Government.

The intentional withholding of safety concerns etc.. is yet to be proven. After all this is what this is all about.

Toyota and Lexus have reacted to resolve issues with their vehicles... as any Car Manufacturer should!!


I'm trying to keep a neutral stance, keeping an open mind and waiting to see what comes of all of this.


I wonder if Chevrolet were under the spotlight whether they would be getting the same reaction!!

Toyota has a long history of not doing any voluntary recalls, unlike domestic manufacturers. They only do those mandated by the government. The last thing they ever want to do is admit a "mistake".

[Cowboy from Hell]

Originally Posted by justa25thTA

Toyota has a long history of not doing any voluntary recalls, unlike domestic manufacturers. They only do those mandated by the government. The last thing they ever want to do is admit a "mistake".

Ok... do you have any examples????