2013 Ford Mustang Shelby GT 500 650 HP! How will it stack up against the ZL1?

[8cd03gro]

I have no idea how well the gt500 will handle, but I find it stunning how many of the same people that said the gt (then boss) wouldn't be able to handle as well as the camaro using a solid rear are making the assumption that fancier tech automatically = better, again with the new gt500. How many forget what the z06 did to it's much more technological ferrari, porsche, and lamborghini counterparts with a leaf spring suspension, an n/a pushrod v8 and a good ol' 6 speed. Just like the zl1 should not be underestimated based on power, neither should the gt500 based on suspension. There's plenty of room for them to make that car handle and stick much, much better than the last gen.

[07-SRT]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

Of course et wins. But how can you expect people to properly launch a 550hp car with stock tires? Obviously you will keep up with it in this case. Trap and ET will be heavily affected with the GT500 in this case more so than the 392.

(in regards to camaro vs 392) I Was just comparing fastest time to fastest times. Looking at this and trap speed the cars have about a 3 tenth and 3 mph difference. Not all 392's run 12.2 either.

You are missing the point (or don't want to accept it) with the GT500. The fastest stock Gt500 with a tire is 11.1 at over 120mph. If you want to keep stock tires on the cars like I said the 392 will keep up. If both have slicks it is very ugly. Like I said the power to weight ratio isnt even close...the GT500 DESTROYS the 392.

How can you tell yourself a car that is 4200lbs with 470 hp can not be far behind a car with 550hp and 3800 lbs? That isn't even common since. Same for the camaro vs 392. 38xx lbs 426 hp vs 42xx lbs 470 hp...much closer race. Not rocket science here.

hmm... its not all about weight/ peak hp.... you have to take into account gear ratios, suspension... and so on... and lets not forget the dyno curve.. The 392 has short and long intake runners so as to not have a drop off in power.... as an example notice the tq dip around 3200 rpm on the ss...point being= many more factors than weight/peak hp....


About the SRT8's cross-town rival, the Camaro. It happens that we dynoed our long-term 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS on this very dyno last year. Here's how the new Hemi compares:


That's pretty much an a$$-kicking, particularly in the midrange where the 392 wallops the Camaro's LS3 V8 by some 100 lb-ft. The Chevy's ability to rev slightly higher isn't nearly enough to make up for the huge disparity in weapons-grade grunt.

[GTAHVIT]

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[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

I have no idea how well the gt500 will handle, but I find it stunning how many of the same people that said the gt (then boss) wouldn't be able to handle as well as the camaro using a solid rear are making the assumption that fancier tech automatically = better, again with the new gt500. How many forget what the z06 did to it's much more technological ferrari, porsche, and lamborghini counterparts with a leaf spring suspension, an n/a pushrod v8 and a good ol' 6 speed. Just like the zl1 should not be underestimated based on power, neither should the gt500 based on suspension. There's plenty of room for them to make that car handle and stick much, much better than the last gen.

I had to feed the fire, but Ford didn't use plenty of room to upgrade the chassis according to the Ford Press release. The wheels and tires appear to be the same size. Performance / City button for the dampers would have to fall into the category of 'proven' technology. It is still a three link rear and asking a three link rear to handle 650 from the crank is asking a lot. From what I can gather the front brakes will be 6 pots, but the rears will still be floating calipers

GM took advantage of the Global Rear Wheel Drive Platform to build the Camaro. Ford had access to similar chassis. The Ford Falcon is the best rear wheel drive chassis Ford has built with the exception of the original GT-40 and the modern GT. A Mustang on the Falcon chassis with a 650 HP motor would have been the best Mustang ever built. Not by a few extra ponies, but overall excellence. Maybe in the years to come Ford will bring similar technology to the Mustang.

We will all find out exactly what the new GT500 and ZL1 will do soon enough.

[thePill]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

I had to feed the fire, but Ford didn't use plenty of room to upgrade the chassis according to the Ford Press release. The wheels and tires appear to be the same size. Performance / City button for the dampers would have to fall into the category of 'proven' technology. It is still a three link rear and asking a three link rear to handle 650 from the crank is asking a lot. From what I can gather the front brakes will be 6 pots, but the rears will still be floating calipers

GM took advantage of the Global Rear Wheel Drive Platform to build the Camaro. Ford had access to similar chassis. The Ford Falcon is the best rear wheel drive chassis Ford has built with the exception of the original GT-40 and the modern GT. A Mustang on the Falcon chassis with a 650 HP motor would have been the best Mustang ever built. Not by a few extra ponies, but overall excellence. Maybe in the years to come Ford will bring similar technology to the Mustang.

We will all find out exactly what the new GT500 and ZL1 will do soon enough.

I have to admit, there is nothing Ford can really do to a chassis that is 10 years old to make it better. Suspension and drivetrain is pretty much all that can be done right now... When the 5th Gen is 10 years old (and I doubt the 5th Gen will make it to 5) the chassis will be dated. It seems Road and Track and Car and Driver have pretty much decided the outcome of the ZL1 vs. GT500... Motor Trend will likely follow. The media attention alone is powerful...

The Falcon Chassis would have been great, but I am not sure how many S197 guys want a 4000lbs pony car. For being a 10 year old chassis, Ford just won the SCCA GTS championship and almost beat the M3 in Grand Am. They did have more 1st, 2nd finishes last year. Old chassis yes, still winning championships? yes... after 9 years... No M3 next year and the Camaro sure as hell can't pull its weight even with Grand Am's help...

Don't let a 10 year old chassis on a solid rear axle beat you for the same price... there are very little issues horsepower cannot solve, especially packaged in a 3800lbs body. Traction was an issue, and as far as I know, so is the same with the ZR1 with 335s... However, since 60mph is reached in first.. second gear loses little tire. I will say this for the last time, the 2011 GT500 never had any major issues with traction on a road course...

Compare the 2007 GT500 with the 2011, that will likely be the difference between the 2011 and 2013....

[serpent]

Originally Posted by SRT8Tech

You know something funny. Ive been keeping this to myself but its gotten way out of hand. I DIDNT EVEN HAVE THE CATCH CAN ON WHEN I DID THAT 12.25 RUN!!!!!! Even if I did have it on there it doesn make a damn bit of differance in ET or MPH with it on. OK, now can we move on. Jesus jumpin christ!! And WTF??? Royal purple is a "MOD" now??? I dont have it in the car but damn. LOL

Anything that is done to a car as far as performance goes is considered a mod and not bone stock anymore.

Either way SRT8tech your 1/4 time is impressive, is it the fastest SRT8 392 so far?

[SRT8Tech]

Originally Posted by serpent

Anything that is done to a car as far as performance goes is considered a mod and not bone stock anymore.

Either way SRT8tech your 1/4 time is impressive, is it the fastest SRT8 392 so far?

So far its the fastest known stock time. There is one that ran a 12.28 @ 114 stock too. He is right on my heels and wants to beat me bad. LOL. There is A drag radial/converter car that ran a 12.08 @ 114 still spinning a bit. He needs new D/R's and wants an 11.8 next time out. What the kick ass thing is.............we are talking about 3 cars that are extremely heavy (in my opinion), running low 12's-11's from the factory!!! 10 years ago I never would of though that would be happening. Let the HP wars continue!!!! I thought my 77 Nova that weighed 3400 pounds was heavy back in the day......

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by Black5thgen

The reign of the ZL1 is over before one was ever built.

I said this a long time ago, nobody would listen. Better off putting some mods on an SS, and walking the ZL1 and the GT500 for the next 5yrs. LOL

[SRT8Tech]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I said this a long time ago, nobody would listen. Better off putting some mods on an SS, and walking the ZL1 and the GT500 for the next 5yrs. LOL

That did just remind me that the rumors of ford putting out a 600+ hp GT500 have been out for at least 6 months now if not longer.

[07-SRT]

Originally Posted by serpent

Anything that is done to a car as far as performance goes is considered a mod and not bone stock anymore.

Either way SRT8tech your 1/4 time is impressive, is it the fastest SRT8 392 so far?

11.642@118.23 1.750 60' 392 A5 nitrous

This is the fastest one I know of..... of course I would never do a shot of nitrous on a new $45,000 car and no tune.....

[serpent]

on 245's to thats insane.
Get some nice rear tires and put spares in the front when you get to the strip.
Thats the formula for GTO's nice wider/stickier rear tires and 2 spares in the front

[JusticePete]

Mr. Pill makes strong case, but class racing is not always reflective of production car performance. The ZL1 is forced to run with less power on track than the street version. You know better than most I do have hard data on this. The Mustang out accelerates and out brakes the Camaro, but the Camaro is faster in the turns.

You also know I am the proud owner of a reasonably competent Mustang. The Camaro has clear edge in brakes stock to stock. The Mustang has a clear edge in weight. I can tit for tat both vehicles longer than I care to type. If I ran GM, the Camaro would be lighter. If I ran Ford the money spent on the new engine would have gone into brakes, braces and suspension. My guess is a bone stock ZL1 will out run a bone stock 2013 GT 500 over a20 lap session. One lap would be a drivers race.

You know why I say this so I'll put you on the spot and ask you to explain why ;-)
.

[SRT8Tech]

Originally Posted by 07-SRT

11.642@118.23 1.750 60' 392 A5 nitrous

This is the fastest one I know of..... of course I would never do a shot of nitrous on a new $45,000 car and no tune.....

Yep, it was a 100 shot but it was on drag radials and race gas too. Of course the race gas didnt really help anything but to make sure it didnt detonate.

[HufferSS]

Originally Posted by Runin11z

I sure hope so because as it stands (especially for the Mopar guys) Ford is leading the race in the muscle car wars in performance. Minus the Gt500 vs. ZL1, but we all can sort of envision what's going to happen there at least on paper.

This is simply not true....everyone forgets the Corvette. I am very confident a ZR1 would have little trouble with this Cobra.....it might even be able to take a 392 Challenger but we'd have to ask Stew first.