Al O. believes ZL1 still faster

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

Valid point. Its a good comparison, and the results weren't too surprising either. I thought the boss would make it a closer race than it did but I guess that's to be expected from the gt500's lil brother. The quarter mile results surprised me a bit. The n/a boss kept up in both trap speed and e.t. the zl1 still trapped higher than I thought it would, I was expecting 116-117mph.

A dream was to have a stock Muscle Car run;
0 - 60 = 3.9
1/4 = 11.9
Trap = 120
60 - 0 = 110'
Skid = 1.0g

We're very very close!

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by Blitz

I wouldn't put too much stock into anything Al O. says. Here's another quote from the top of the house man himself:

“For many buyers, a Camaro Convertible can be a collector car, something they might keep for generations. So we made sure the tops would retain their quality for a long, long time,” said Oppenheiser. “There is great value in a convertible with the original top.” Oppenheiser knows the needs for car collectors well. He personally restored a 1969 Camaro Convertible several years ago.

...yeah, tell me how that is working out.

Fine example indeed. So many people are taken by his bully-is-not-here-so-I'll-keep-talking-smack sales tactic. If I didn't have the goal of buying the most awesome Camaro as my 7th Camaro, I wouldn't buy one just because of his trash talking and the imminent blow-up-in-my-face that he has coming.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Blitz

I wouldn't put too much stock into anything Al O. says. Here's another quote from the top of the house man himself:

“For many buyers, a Camaro Convertible can be a collector car, something they might keep for generations. So we made sure the tops would retain their quality for a long, long time,” said Oppenheiser. “There is great value in a convertible with the original top.” Oppenheiser knows the needs for car collectors well. He personally restored a 1969 Camaro Convertible several years ago.

...yeah, tell me how that is working out.

For most? Just fine.

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

Fine example indeed. So many people are taken by his bully-is-not-here-so-I'll-keep-talking-smack sales tactic. If I didn't have the goal of buying the most awesome Camaro as my 7th Camaro, I wouldn't buy one just because of his trash talking and the imminent blow-up-in-my-face that he has coming.

Actually...it's a I-know-I'm-right-so-here's-the-facts sales tactic. If you don't like it....it could be you're on the wrong end of the facts...

I'll say it one more time...slowly...because I'm getting a little flustered by what appear to be personal attacks on someone I'd consider a friend.

He. Is. Not. A. Trash. Talker.

. . .

[ffrcobra_65]

How can it be a fact when it hasn't been tested against a Gt500 yet much less vs the upcoming Gt500? All it is, simply put, smack talk. Heck, just because one is a personal friend, doesn't mean one is correct and comes across to everyone else as one does to another. It seems, he has already taken a step back from his earlier talk about the ZL1 besting the gt500 in general..now he seems to concede the 1/4 race to the snake. He has painted himself to a corner and for his credibility's sake, the ZL1 better just totally dominate the road course and 0-60 vs the new gt500. Personal attack or not, I'm not buying the ZL1 because of what he has ever to say about it.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

How can it be a fact when it hasn't been tested against a Gt500 yet much less vs the upcoming Gt500? All it is, simply put, smack talk. Heck, just because one is a personal friend, doesn't mean one is correct and comes across to everyone else as one does to another. It seems, he has already taken a step back from his earlier talk about the ZL1 besting the gt500 in general..now he seems to concede the 1/4 race to the snake. He has painted himself to a corner and for his credibility's sake, the ZL1 better just totally dominate the road course and 0-60 vs the new gt500. Personal attack or not, I'm not buying the ZL1 because of what he has ever to say about it.

dang. i wouldnt base my car purchase on what some guy in a suit says or how he acts, even if he come across as a bit of a talker. In the end, all this talk is just over factory stock cars,its fun but really how many GT500 owners keep the stock tires on their cars?? do all the zl1 owners plan on keeping their cars st0ck?

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

For most? Just fine.



Actually...it's a I-know-I'm-right-so-here's-the-facts sales tactic. If you don't like it....it could be you're on the wrong end of the facts...

I'll say it one more time...slowly...because I'm getting a little flustered by what appear to be personal attacks on someone I'd consider a friend.

He. Is. Not. A. Trash. Talker.

. . .

How does he know the facts about a car that hasn't been released yet? What if Ford hasn't released a 'ring time because they haven't pounded out the production suspension settings for the '13 gt500? How long did it take Chevy to release all the details after the ZL1 announcement? I remember on this forum when the 5.0 came out, it was an accepted fact that the Camaro's IRS would make it the clear winner on a road course.

[2010SLVRBULIT]

..working for GM, you think? unless proven otherwise, uhuh...

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

How does he know the facts about a car that hasn't been released yet? What if Ford hasn't released a 'ring time because they haven't pounded out the production suspension settings for the '13 gt500? How long did it take Chevy to release all the details after the ZL1 announcement? I remember on this forum when the 5.0 came out, it was an accepted fact that the Camaro's IRS would make it the clear winner on a road course.

what if ford releases a "ring time" and quote it as something like 4 seconds faster than the zl1, would anyone here even believe it? would it matter much? would the "different day different driver" argument come up like it has with the numbers showing the Boss is as fast or faster than a z06 around the track? would that argument come up if the zl1 numbers are better?

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

dang. i wouldnt base my car purchase on what some guy in a suit says or how he acts, even if he come across as a bit of a talker. In the end, all this talk is just over factory stock cars,its fun but really how many GT500 owners keep the stock tires on their cars?? do all the zl1 owners plan on keeping their cars st0ck?

same here but I am sure there are a lot of people who do. I have owned nearly 50 cars in 23 years of driving and the Camaro has always been my fav muscle car. I am not a brand loyal car person, I like cars period. I don't work for or know a relative or good friend who works for a car company nor do I get paid to be a blind fan to one. I spend my hard earned money on what I like, I pay for their product to enjoy, that is it. but obviously, I like Camaros more than others. As someone in LS1tech forum stated..."when was the last time you saw a chief engineer bench racing his car against a a car that is not even out yet?" A lot of Chevy fans think Al is simply being defensive because he knows what is coming and it ain't gonna be nice. Also, "Simulations" ..Who claims a win because of Simulations???

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

what if ford releases a "ring time" and quote it as something like 4 seconds faster than the zl1, would anyone here even believe it? would it matter much? would the "different day different driver" argument come up like it has with the numbers showing the Boss is as fast or faster than a z06 around the track? would that argument come up if the zl1 numbers are better?

Don't count on anyone on this site even acknowledging it, they'll claim BS and that there is no way a car with a Live Rear Axle can do that.... My god it will be the GT-R Lap Time all over again......

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

same here but I am sure there are a lot of people who do. I have owned nearly 50 cars in 23 years of driving and the Camaro has always been my fav muscle car. I am not a brand loyal car person, I like cars period. I don't work for or know a relative or good friend who works for a car company nor do I get paid to be a blind fan to one. I spend my hard earned money on what I like, I pay for their product to enjoy, that is it. but obviously, I like Camaros more than others. As someone in LS1tech forum stated..."when was the last time you saw a chief engineer bench racing his car against a a car that is not even out yet?" A lot of Chevy fans think Al is simply being defensive because he knows what is coming and it ain't gonna be nice. Also, "Simulations" ..Who claims a win because of Simulations???

Well put! If Al Oppenheiser wants to put faith in the fact that he thinks, all based off of simulations, the ZL1 is faster then he can go ahead and think so. The fact of the matter is he has no concrete evidence that the ZL1 will go faster it is all based of of simulations. No one knows but Ford how sophisticated the Launch Control on the GT500 will be but I assume it will be better then the ZL1 since Ford seems to be putting lots of faith into the power being put down.

[hairtrigger]

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

same here but I am sure there are a lot of people who do. I have owned nearly 50 cars in 23 years of driving and the Camaro has always been my fav muscle car. I am not a brand loyal car person, I like cars period. I don't work for or know a relative or good friend who works for a car company nor do I get paid to be a blind fan to one. I spend my hard earned money on what I like, I pay for their product to enjoy, that is it. but obviously, I like Camaros more than others. As someone in LS1tech forum stated..."when was the last time you saw a chief engineer bench racing his car against a a car that is not even out yet?" A lot of Chevy fans think Al is simply being defensive because he knows what is coming and it ain't gonna be nice. Also, "Simulations" ..Who claims a win because of Simulations???

Who's to say that GM can't simulate a 2013 GT500 in real life on their proving grounds.
Put 650 HP into a 2012. Add some traction control.

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by hairtrigger

Who's to say that GM can't simulate a 2013 GT500 in real life on their proving grounds.
Put 650 HP into a 2012. Add some traction control.

Who's to say that Ford can't simulate a 2012 ZL1 in real life on their proving grounds?

[spikess581]

Al O. just likes to hear himself talk. There is no action behind it. If there was these vert tops would be fixed by now.

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by hairtrigger

Who's to say that GM can't simulate a 2013 GT500 in real life on their proving grounds.
Put 650 HP into a 2012. Add some traction control.

The new model will have a different engine, transmission, differential, driveshaft, axle, suspension, etc. Almost everything is new other than the chassis.