So what do I have to do to beat a 5.0

[nighttowl]

I used to have a mustang also. nice cars, but i like tha camaro better. the new 5 liter was completely re-designed, and makes quite a bit of power. a while back bbk put a new mustang and camaro together with the same parts for comparision on the dyno. the mustang stock put down more power at baseline (which did not make sense to me), and basically all the way up untill the exhaust was swapped out on both cars with full length headers, and catback (with high flow cats). intake brought up both cars about 15 hp, a throttle body bought 2hp for the stang, and about 10 for the camaro. at the end, the camaro came out at 404 rwhp, and the mustang was at 406, with much less torque (no tunes oneither car).

my thoughts are the camaros are pretty much nuetered at the factory, and that ford pulled out all the stops, and got it right this time. if a good tune was used i think the camaro surely would have spanked the mustang, ON THE DYNO. real world though, the camaro weighs several hundred pounds more, and it takes hp and torque to get these cars moving. i remember when i was younger, a rule of thumb was "for every 100 lbs removed, you gain about a tenth of a second". if you have cars with similar power, and one weighs a substantial amount more, the heavier car will be at a disadvantage.

btw...

i love my camaro, wouldnt think of trading it for a 5.0

[cbass]

a while back bbk put a new mustang and camaro together with the same parts for comparision on the dyno. the mustang stock put down more power at baseline (which did not make sense to me), and basically all the way up untill the exhaust was swapped out on both cars with full length headers, and catback (with high flow cats). intake brought up both cars about 15 hp, a throttle body bought 2hp for the stang, and about 10 for the camaro. at the end, the camaro came out at 404 rwhp, and the mustang was at 406, with much less torque (no tunes oneither car).

Here is a video of what you are referring to:

[nighttowl]

Thats it.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by nighttowl

I used to have a mustang also. nice cars, but i like tha camaro better. the new 5 liter was completely re-designed, and makes quite a bit of power. a while back bbk put a new mustang and camaro together with the same parts for comparision on the dyno. the mustang stock put down more power at baseline (which did not make sense to me), and basically all the way up untill the exhaust was swapped out on both cars with full length headers, and catback (with high flow cats). intake brought up both cars about 15 hp, a throttle body bought 2hp for the stang, and about 10 for the camaro. at the end, the camaro came out at 404 rwhp, and the mustang was at 406, with much less torque (no tunes oneither car).

my thoughts are the camaros are pretty much nuetered at the factory, and that ford pulled out all the stops, and got it right this time. if a good tune was used i think the camaro surely would have spanked the mustang, ON THE DYNO. real world though, the camaro weighs several hundred pounds more, and it takes hp and torque to get these cars moving. i remember when i was younger, a rule of thumb was "for every 100 lbs removed, you gain about a tenth of a second". if you have cars with similar power, and one weighs a substantial amount more, the heavier car will be at a disadvantage.

btw...

i love my camaro, wouldnt think of trading it for a 5.0

the mustang has shown to produce over 450rwhp with a tune and full bolt ons

[cbass]

the mustang has shown to produce over 450rwhp with a tune and full bolt ons

Now that sounds a tad bit optimistic unless a few "bolt ons" means you bolted on a supercharger. I would love to see evidence of what bolt on people have put on there.

[Deki]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

the mustang has shown to produce over 450rwhp with a tune and full bolt ons

lol come on man....

[goodtime]

Originally Posted by cbass

Now that sounds a tad bit optimistic unless a few "bolt ons" means you bolted on a supercharger. I would love to see evidence of what bolt on people have put on there.

That is a tad bit optimistic. Comparison dyno runs on my 2011 5.0 with bolt-on's on different dyno's:





Bottom line here is on the Dynojet with the Boss intake vs. the Dynocom with the same mods there is quite a difference. Racing dyno's is pointless. The real measuring stick is the track.

[SGOS252382]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

the mustang has shown to produce over 450rwhp with a tune and full bolt ons

Search and you will find.

I've seen some bolt ons only LS3 M6s come out around 450 rwhp. But these are not representative of most LS3 M6s.
These are cars running on dynos that are a little generous.

Just as I've seen a few bolt ons only L99 A6s top the 400 rwhp mark. This is also not representative of most L99 A6s.

You also need to take into account (SAE, STD, or Uncorrected). Also there are numerous tricks a dyno operator can use to jump the numbers up.

[cbass]

Comparison dyno runs on my 2011 5.0 with bolt-on's on different dyno's:

So what exactly did you "bolt-on"?

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by cbass

Now that sounds a tad bit optimistic unless a few "bolt ons" means you bolted on a supercharger. I would love to see evidence of what bolt on people have put on there.

i will look for the dyno sheets. Ive seen them in the 44x-45xrwhp range with full boltons. Most people that are only putting down 43xrwhp only have LT/CAI/Tune/cat back.

also you must be kidding about 450rwhp with a supercharger, those things are making well over 600rwhp with centrifigul ones and trapping over 130mph.

ohioborn80 at LS1 tech.com even put down over 450rwhp with bolt ons and so did MM & FF. its documented. I bet if i go to the mustang forums theyll have quite a few really close to that as well.

[nighttowl]

apples to apples, edelbrocks street legal kits show 559 hp 503 tq mustang, 599 hp 547 tq camaro, which once again proves theres no replacement for displacement.

i was considering this, and still am, but im concerned with longetivity with these engines running around with 550-600hp at the crank.

[cbass]

i will look for the dyno sheets. Ive seen them in the 44x-45xrwhp range with full boltons. Most people that are only putting down 43xrwhp only have LT/CAI/Tune/cat back.

also you must be kidding about 450rwhp with a supercharger, those things are making well over 600rwhp with centrifigul ones and trapping over 130mph.

At one point I had a link somwhere with a couple of dyno sheets with modded coyote's. I can't find it now. If you could find it, then that would be great. I am curious what you need to run at those power levels and what exactly are considered bolt-ons.

If you look at the LS3 sticky, then you see around 420 with what I guess you would call bolt-on's?

But then where do you consider a cam? With a cam it seems 470-480 rwhp from the dynos.

Yes. I was kidding about the supercharger.

[goodtime]

Originally Posted by cbass

So what exactly did you "bolt-on"?

Power mods:
Full exhaust
CAI
Boss manifold
Tune

Car was a 3.73 so that will impact the numbers more vs. a 3.31 car.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by cbass

At one point I had a link somwhere with a couple of dyno sheets with modded coyote's. I can't find it now. If you could find it, then that would be great. I am curious what you need to run at those power levels and what exactly are considered bolt-ons.

If you look at the LS3 sticky, then you see around 420 with what I guess you would call bolt-on's?

But then where do you consider a cam? With a cam it seems 470-480 rwhp from the dynos.

Yes. I was kidding about the supercharger.

I dont consider cams boltons at all. I think with cams the final 5.0 numbers are closer to 475rwhp but not enough time has been spent on their cam development since people today so readily go to forced induction instead. I bet 500rwhp will be attainable with it down the road on the stock heads, especially the 2012 and up ones without the oil squirters hindering it and causing hp losses at high rpms.