GMPP headers, exhaust, CAI add no POWER

[UsedTaHaveA68]

Originally Posted by 1camaro70

the attached component is warrented by that manufacturer, headers, exhaust, CAI, whether GM or ARH, ALL added components STRESS the engine and transmission and rear end, Parts that have NOT BEEN MODIFIED, so GM headers add stress and GM warrents the internal engine components that are stressed. You add ARH headers and GM does not warrent the engine components that are stressed whether more or less stressed? You add headers and your transmission has a failure, so only if it was GM headers you get warrenty?

seems easy to understand. NOT.

You're missing the point. Your warranty is not based on how much horsepower your engine produces. That's why Ford Racing sells a supercharger kit for the Mustangs that adds 100 hp, but it's still covered under the warranty.

The warranty is based on what GM tests, validates, and approves for the engine. If you take your engine out, completely rebuild it with forged internals, stroker crank, hot cam, and CNC'd heads, why WOULD they warranty that? They didn't make it, they didn't test it, they didn't install it.

The GMPP parts are tested and validated by GM. They have proven that adding these parts will not harm your engine or transmission. Since they can't do that to every aftermarket piece of equipment out there, they say "if you add things not approved by us, we can void your warranty." Why? Because they don't want to buy you a new engine because you forgot to torque a rod cap correctly and sent a piston through your engine block.

Again, warranty is not based on horsepower. It is based on what GM has tested and approved. Not sure why you're stuck on this horsepower thing. This gives GM a way out of buying people new engines because they bought aftermarket components and installed them. If you built someone an engine from scratch, and you gave it a 12 month/12,000 mile warranty... and then they took it home, decided they wanted a bigger engine, so they took it apart, added a stroker crank, bored it out and added new pistons, then blew it to hell and brought it back to you..... Are you going to give them a brand new engine for free? Didn't think so.

[HaveBlue]

It seems there is some misunderstanding about aftermarket parts & new car warranty, the Magnuson-Moss Act etc.

They MMA only applies to parts that are certified replacement parts for your car or exact replacement. Example a Wix filter instead of a Delco is fine. It's an exact replacement part.
A part that alters the factory part (header vs exhaust manifold) has to go thru certification that it does not alter emmissions output. This is an Executive Order exemption or an E.O number. Only these parts fall under the "dealer has to prove it cased the problem" argument.
A part that is sold as an "off road only/sanctioned racing only" is not a replacement part. In fact strict interpetation of the "off road only" waiver would be that you have turned your street car onto a non-street car.
No more warranty.
Under the Federal Clean Air Act it is illegal (a felony) to remove or alter the emmisions of a vehicle. It was only by SEMA and some key factories and people working with the CA Air Resources Board (CARB) that the O.E. proccess got put together.

I'm not trying to be Mister Doom & Gloom. I have worked in the aftermarket for 25+ years and live with these issues all the time.

I just want you guys to have the facts when you are making these decisions to modify your car.
The TV analogy is good. Once you modify it, it's no longer as GM shipped it. Only they can modify it (delaer installed GMPP).

I know this isn't what you wanted to hear but I hope it helps.

[1camaro70]

HORSEPOWER AND TORQUE ARE STRESS, add all GMPP parts and warrenty OK, with internal components being stress, whether engine, transmission or rear end. Add something that adds 5 hp of stress, K&N filter (just to show stupitity) and rear end breaks (stupid example) GM says that stressed rear end and not covered by warrenty?

[GTAwheelman]

Originally Posted by 1camaro70

HORSEPOWER AND TORQUE ARE STRESS, add all GMPP parts and warrenty OK, with internal components being stress, whether engine, transmission or rear end. Add something that adds 5 hp of stress, K&N filter (just to show stupitity) and rear end breaks (stupid example) GM says that stressed rear end and not covered by warrenty?

Why are you making this so difficult? HP and torque do not effect your warranty. you are not going to spin a rod, or break the transmission or rear end from any hp gains from stupid little bolt ons like CAI, headers, or a muffler. or an damn oil filter.

[JDBeck23]

I would love to hear some testimony from a GM representative giving us the GUARANTEE that the warranties are good so long as you use GMPP parts. Something tells me that when push comes to shove, if the part cause the problem and it didnt come from the factory with it, GM wont cover it.

And if they do cover it, it's soley so that they can justify the relatively huge price tag compared to the aftermarket alternatives.

IF they cover it truly, I can definitely see the added peace of mind in purchasing only GMPP, but that doesnt mean you should avoid all other aftermarket company's products. The part still has to directly cause the failure and they have to prove it in order to void your warranty.

Guys have been bolting on stuff for years, GM wants us to enjoy these cars... Hence the creation of Launch Control! I think that once you wade through the dealer's BS, GM will stand by their product and the warranty they've promised.

[1camaro70]

let me use simple terms...
GM builds a car called Camaro, if they put a L99 engine in it they test and warrent all the parts, they know that there are variences in power of their engines, we have seen dyno's of unmodified with 305 to 325 HP, but thats OK its under warrenty. Now they want to make more money so they design GMPP parts like headers, exhaust and CAI to use on the Camaro, they test the parts and they add HP and torque and allowable STRESS on all driveline components, whether its the 305 HP engine or the 325 HP engine.
now my camaro that had 325 HP has 350 HP and warrenty is fine. You add ARH exhaust and doing so you know that you take responsibility for that part now, and since you know it adds HP you are fine with that. And we all know GM designed everything with that tollerence of added HP, because after all if you used the GMPP exhaust GM knows it does not stress the drivetrain beyond what GM has already tested with their own components, so is the basic L99 drivetrain good for 350 HP (my example)? why do we want to modify the car? we want this extre power, and since GM parts add power and are under warrenty, we all want 350 HP. But that ARH exhaust adds HP and Torque, just like the GMPP exhaust, it stresses all the components of the driveline because of the extra HP and Torque, and GM has tested the components and they are happy with the results of added HP and troque to their driveline and warrent it, even if their exhaust adds HP and torque their rear end and transmission and internal engine parts are OK with that stress, caused by that component. Now your ARH exhaust are on your car and you are happy, your rear end has a problem, that's OK you never touched it, but your exhaust added HP and torque that caused the component to fail.......who pays?

if scott or irpq11 do 60 0-60 runs and multiple 1/4 mile runs, thats OK with GM, the components can take it, you add an aftermarket exhaust for the sound and the added troque breaks the rear end and your not covered? unless of course the exhaust was GMPP?

[UsedTaHaveA68]

You're a lost cause. GM doesn't want to pay for the 1000's of people who modify their cars with aftermarket parts. So they design their own. This gives people the option of increasing hp while keeping the warranty. If you build something, someone adds parts to it and it breaks, do you want to buy them a new part? No. Again, hp has nothing to do with it.

[Scott@Bjorn3D]

If anything that is added to the car that is not a disposable part and did not come from GM will void the warranty. So you can get oil, oil filter, air filter, windshield wiper blades, wiper fluid and stuff like that. Anything else the warranty is gone.

Pretty simple after doing research. Anything increasing HP or TRQ that is not GM's will void the entire drive train warranty.

[SGOS252382]

Originally Posted by Scott@Bjorn3D

If anything that is added to the car that is not a disposable part and did not come from GM will void the warranty. So you can get oil, oil filter, air filter, windshield wiper blades, wiper fluid and stuff like that. Anything else the warranty is gone.

Pretty simple after doing research. Anything increasing HP or TRQ that is not GM's will void the entire drive train warranty.

And the GM part needs to be approved for each specific application (approved for use on the 2010 Camaro SS). GM makes a lot of performance parts from exhausts, to transmissions, to crate engines.

As of right now, the only approved performance part for the 2010 Camaro is their axle back exhaust (non off road version).

[Doc]

Originally Posted by 1camaro70

let me use simple terms...
GM builds a car called Camaro, if they put a L99 engine in it they test and warrent all the parts, they know that there are variences in power of their engines, we have seen dyno's of unmodified with 305 to 325 HP, but thats OK its under warrenty. Now they want to make more money so they design GMPP parts like headers, exhaust and CAI to use on the Camaro, they test the parts and they add HP and torque and allowable STRESS on all driveline components, whether its the 305 HP engine or the 325 HP engine.
now my camaro that had 325 HP has 350 HP and warrenty is fine. You add ARH exhaust and doing so you know that you take responsibility for that part now, and since you know it adds HP you are fine with that. And we all know GM designed everything with that tollerence of added HP, because after all if you used the GMPP exhaust GM knows it does not stress the drivetrain beyond what GM has already tested with their own components, so is the basic L99 drivetrain good for 350 HP (my example)? why do we want to modify the car? we want this extre power, and since GM parts add power and are under warrenty, we all want 350 HP. But that ARH exhaust adds HP and Torque, just like the GMPP exhaust, it stresses all the components of the driveline because of the extra HP and Torque, and GM has tested the components and they are happy with the results of added HP and troque to their driveline and warrent it, even if their exhaust adds HP and torque their rear end and transmission and internal engine parts are OK with that stress, caused by that component. Now your ARH exhaust are on your car and you are happy, your rear end has a problem, that's OK you never touched it, but your exhaust added HP and torque that caused the component to fail.......who pays?

if scott or irpq11 do 60 0-60 runs and multiple 1/4 mile runs, thats OK with GM, the components can take it, you add an aftermarket exhaust for the sound and the added troque breaks the rear end and your not covered? unless of course the exhaust was GMPP?

Since you're this spooked about warranty issues, DO NOT modify your car; leave it absolutely stock unless you take it to an AUTHORIZED dealer and pay them to make only GM approved changes. Then you don't have to worry. The rest of us? Well we're just flat taking our changes but hey, it's our money and our cars so we're okay with that.

The whole point is to enjoy your car. Some enjoy modding their car; some to the point where they may actually spend more time modding it than driving it seems but that's what they enjoy and that's cool. Some like to race; some like to enter shows; some like to meet up with other enthusiasts and hang out and talk about their cars. Some just like to drive around and enjoy their car just as it is. It's all cool because that's what freedom of choice is all about.

If you want to mod your car, then UNDERSTAND that you take on the responsibility of your OWN ACTIONS and it's not anybody else's "fault" if something you do breaks something. That's the way it goes; learn from it and do it better so it doesn't break the next time. If you aren't willing to accept that responsibility, then DON'T MESS WITH IT. Pure and simple.

[rodimus prime]

A CAI or headers isnt going to void your powertrain warranty. They may not cover your maf/throttle body issues because of the CAI or the exhaust or o2 sensors because of the headers, but if you break an axle or driveshaft or spin a bearing....clearly thats not related to the installed part.

however if you change gear ratios, your rearend wont be covered. If you instal ARP rodbolts, your engine will be void.

Otherwise you better not put any aftermarket engine covers on that could trap heat and cause your drivetrain to fail. Its pretty common sense.

[1camaro70]

So Scott and his GMPP exhaust is still covered but Tag-ur-it could have voided his warrenty for entire drivetrain?

[rodimus prime]

Your entire drivetrain wont be voided because of exhaust work. Your exhaust will be voided and any components directly related to it...i.e o2 sensors.

[JDBeck23]

Originally Posted by rodimus prime

A CAI or headers isnt going to void your powertrain warranty. They may not cover your maf/throttle body issues because of the CAI or the exhaust or o2 sensors because of the headers, but if you break an axle or driveshaft or spin a bearing....clearly thats not related to the installed part.

however if you change gear ratios, your rearend wont be covered. If you instal ARP rodbolts, your engine will be void.

Otherwise you better not put any aftermarket engine covers on that could trap heat and cause your drivetrain to fail. Its pretty common sense.

I agree completely. There's alot of fear of having your warranty voided on these boards. Not exactly sure why.

I still would like a confirmation from someone from GM that their headers wont void the powertrain warranty any sooner than a set from ARH would. My gut tells me different.