Hydroplaning issues

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by Russtl

We recently rolled our 2014 2/SS after hydroplaning. The traction control took over and made it very difficult to control the car and my wife rolled the car. I just thought it was a freak accident until I recently met 2 others that wrecked their 2014 SS due to hydroplaning and the traction control took over.

Has anyone ever encountered this? If so I think there may be a glitch or a flaw with the traction control in hydroplaning situations.

I'd be more inclined to blame the stock P-Zeros than the traction control. Speed, water and the tire are the initial causes of hydroplaning. As others have said, the P-Zero is a "summer" tire, meaning warm, dry weather.

Which makes me question the intelligence behind making it standard equipment on an automobile that is driven in all kinds of weather. My own experience with those tires is that they really, really suck in anything except 60+ degree, sunny days. Around here, that's about 1 day out of 8.

So, you build a car. You install air bags, you install seat belts, you make it as crash resistant as possible. You even add anti-lock brakes, traction control and stabiltrak. ... then you equip it with "summer tires"???

When there are several all season tires that are better options?

Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds like the bean counters won that round.

[cb66]

You can blame traction control, tires whatever makes you happy but you did not mention what the speed was when the crash occurred most if not all hydroplaning accidents could be avoided if drivers would slow down to a speed suitable for conditions.

[Chevy_cowboy]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

I'd be more inclined to blame the stock P-Zeros than the traction control. Speed, water and the tire are the initial causes of hydroplaning. As others have said, the P-Zero is a "summer" tire, meaning warm, dry weather.

Which makes me question the intelligence behind making it standard equipment on an automobile that is driven in all kinds of weather. My own experience with those tires is that they really, really suck in anything except 60+ degree, sunny days. Around here, that's about 1 day out of 8.

So, you build a car. You install air bags, you install seat belts, you make it as crash resistant as possible. You even add anti-lock brakes, traction control and stabiltrak. ... then you equip it with "summer tires"???

When there are several all season tires that are better options?

Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds like the bean counters won that round.

I see your point but on the other hand if they'd put a typical all season tire on it that did better on wet or snowy roads, the car would be more dangerous on dry pavement. Tires are always a tradeoff, there's no perfect tire for every condition.

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

I'd be more inclined to blame the stock P-Zeros than the traction control. Speed, water and the tire are the initial causes of hydroplaning. As others have said, the P-Zero is a "summer" tire, meaning warm, dry weather.

Which makes me question the intelligence behind making it standard equipment on an automobile that is driven in all kinds of weather. My own experience with those tires is that they really, really suck in anything except 60+ degree, sunny days. Around here, that's about 1 day out of 8.

So, you build a car. You install air bags, you install seat belts, you make it as crash resistant as possible. You even add anti-lock brakes, traction control and stabiltrak. ... then you equip it with "summer tires"???

When there are several all season tires that are better options?

Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds like the bean counters won that round.

It's a performance car. That is its primary purpose. The goal isn't for GM to protect its customers from themselves, although they do try in many ways. This isn't one of them.

Consider also that using an all-season tire or a snow tire when trying to get the most performance out of the car could be equally dangerous.

All the good All-Season tire options are at places like Tire Rack, and some can be had cheaper than stock Pirelli's. Places like Tire Rack even carry snow tires. --so I doubt it's a "bean counter" issue seeing how the P-Zero is an expensive, and very good, tire when used for its intended purpose.

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

It's a performance car. That is its primary purpose. The goal isn't for GM to protect its customers from themselves, although they do try in many ways. This isn't one of them.

Consider also that using an all-season tire or a snow tire when trying to get the most performance out of the car could be equally dangerous.

All the good All-Season tire options are at places like Tire Rack, and some can be had cheaper than stock Pirelli's. Places like Tire Rack even carry snow tires. --so I doubt it's a "bean counter" issue seeing how the P-Zero is an expensive, and very good, tire when used for its intended purpose.

Is it really a performance car? and what does that mean? Does that mean it is meant for the track? Does that mean you should never drive it in the rain or snow? Maybe it is to us guys on the forum, but think about the average buyer. Most people who buy a Camaro will never take it to a track. The majority are V6 cars that are daily drivers. So, with that in mind, is a "summer" tire appropriate? is it safe? does it even make any sense?

To explain my point.. I bought my Camaro in Kentucky, in December. It was 34 degrees on the night I drove it home. It was 40 during the test drive. The salesman never said a word about the tires. We drove all around on them. Sure, I learned about them from reading the owners manual... but that was later on.

Imagine the typical buyer. They live in Cleveland, or Chicago. Or somewhere where it isn't "summer" at least 70% of the time. The car is really a sporty daily driver to them. Especially females. Does it make sense to equip this car with "summer" tires and expect 90% of the buyers to run out and buy new tires... or would it make more sense to equip it with a safe tire and let the 10% who want performance to go buy a "summer" tire?

I am actually surprised that no manufacturers have been sued over it yet. I was a fan of the P-Zero until I put Toyo Proxes on my car. What a difference!! I had no idea of how well this car could handle.

[Chevy_cowboy]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

It's a performance car. That is its primary purpose. The goal isn't for GM to protect its customers from themselves, although they do try in many ways. This isn't one of them.

Consider also that using an all-season tire or a snow tire when trying to get the most performance out of the car could be equally dangerous.

All the good All-Season tire options are at places like Tire Rack, and some can be had cheaper than stock Pirelli's. Places like Tire Rack even carry snow tires. --so I doubt it's a "bean counter" issue seeing how the P-Zero is an expensive, and very good, tire when used for its intended purpose.

Exactly, and if they started making concessions on things like tires, where do they stop? Before long you'd have an econobox with the Camaro nameplate.

[Chevy_cowboy]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

Is it really a performance car? and what does that mean? Does that mean it is meant for the track? Does that mean you should never drive it in the rain or snow? Maybe it is to us guys on the forum, but think about the average buyer. Most people who buy a Camaro will never take it to a track. The majority are V6 cars that are daily drivers. So, with that in mind, is a "summer" tire appropriate? is it safe? does it even make any sense?

To explain my point.. I bought my Camaro in Kentucky, in December. It was 34 degrees on the night I drove it home. It was 40 during the test drive. The salesman never said a word about the tires. We drove all around on them. Sure, I learned about them from reading the owners manual... but that was later on.

Imagine the typical buyer. They live in Cleveland, or Chicago. Or somewhere where it isn't "summer" at least 70% of the time. The car is really a sporty daily driver to them. Especially females. Does it make sense to equip this car with "summer" tires and expect 90% of the buyers to run out and buy new tires... or would it make more sense to equip it with a safe tire and let the 10% who want performance to go buy a "summer" tire?

I am actually surprised that no manufacturers have been sued over it yet. I was a fan of the P-Zero until I put Toyo Proxes on my car. What a difference!! I had no idea of how well this car could handle.

Most of the V6's do have all season tires, its only the RS equipped cars that have Pzeros.

Your salesman's neglect to properly inform you about the car you're buying is the dealership's fault, not GM's. He works for the dealership.

[GAFreddy]

Wow, I think it says something for Chevy that this roll was in a convert and nobody became convertible. I've owned three verts and not one, including my 02' SS, do I think I would survive a roll.

Glad everyone is okay.

[Mels RS]

My '67 Camaro hydroplaned once. It came equipped with "Uniroyal Larados". They were branded as "The Rain Tire". What that meant was, if it rained in an adjoining county, you could count on them loosing traction.
Fortunately it happened on a slight curve at 4am with no surrounding traffic. I went around 1 1/2 times ending up facing the wrong direction.
Made it to USAF Reserve meeting on time.
Installed Michelins the following Monday.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

So, you build a car. You install air bags, you install seat belts, you make it as crash resistant as possible. You even add anti-lock brakes, traction control and stabiltrak. ... then you equip it with "summer tires"???

When there are several all season tires that are better options?

Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds like the bean counters won that round.

Only as far as their choice of summer performance tires is concerned. There are summer performance tires that are better in the wet than the ones Chevy chose. Way better if my experience with Michelin PSS tires running hot laps on a road course in the pouring rain is any indication at all.

Otherwise, it's at least a small win for enthusiasts. All-seasons may not be horrible at any reasonable driving condition short of ice and deep snow/slush, but they're not at the top of the heap for any driving condition either, and not the greatest fit for a car whose mfr wants it to be seen as one of their 'sporty' models.


Norm

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by Chevy_cowboy

Exactly, and if they started making concessions on things like tires, where do they stop? Before long you'd have an econobox with the Camaro nameplate.

This thread is about someone who hydroplaned and wrecked their car. If Chevy had used a different tire, it is not a "concession"... it's an improvement! There are far better tires, all season tires, for both summer and winter.. than the P-Zeros.

Originally Posted by Chevy_cowboy

Most of the V6's do have all season tires, its only the RS equipped cars that have Pzeros.

Your salesman's neglect to properly inform you about the car you're buying is the dealership's fault, not GM's. He works for the dealership.

Maybe so, but no matter what the salesman did or did not say, thousands of people drive new Camaros home in less than summer conditions. I've never heard anyone say "well, the dealer wouldn't let me buy a Camaro.. it's winter"...

All I am saying is that the P-Zero creates uncalled for risk. Risk that makes no sense. There are much better tires, all season tires, that handle the summer even better than the Pirellis. Why not use them OEM?

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Russtl

The tires are a major factor. Does anyone have any recommendations for tires that handle well in the rain?

Finally read down to here . . . Michelin Pilot Super Sports. If you're interested, I have a youtube in-car video of a track day session with speeds ranging from about 40 to 115 and including streams of water crossing the track at an angle.


Norm

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Only as far as their choice of summer performance tires is concerned. There are summer performance tires that are better in the wet than the ones Chevy chose. Way better if my experience with Michelin PSS tires running hot laps on a road course in the pouring rain is any indication at all.

Otherwise, it's at least a small win for enthusiasts. All-seasons may not be horrible at any reasonable driving condition short of ice and deep snow/slush, but they're not at the top of the heap for any driving condition either, and not the greatest fit for a car whose mfr wants it to be seen as one of their 'sporty' models.


Norm

Thank you!! .. That's what I'm talking about. Michelen PSS would be a 100% improvement over what we got with the P-Zeros. And had we got them, this thread might not exist. Toyo Proxes are described by the manufacturer as " all season", yet I would say they are far better at summer than the P-Zeros. Do we want to brag that we got "summer" tires, or tires that actually perform?

[Chevy_cowboy]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

This thread is about someone who hydroplaned and wrecked their car. If Chevy had used a different tire, it is not a "concession"... it's an improvement! There are far better tires, all season tires, for both summer and winter.. than the P-Zeros.

Perhaps an improvement for that one person, (although you don't really know that, all seasons hydroplane too) but definitely a concession for the rest of us.

As I said, all seasons might do better in standing water or snow, but would be dramatically less traction on warm dry pavement where the Pzero really shines. If there was a perfect tire that gave amazing traction in all temperatures and all weathers, that would be the only tire in production, but to my knowledge that tire doesn't exist. Every tire choice is a concession in some way.