A post I was hoping to not have to make (GM blocks L3 engine warranty repair)

[BMR Sales]

Originally Posted by LuckyZL-1

Yes this made it to the Corvette Forum and this is crazy!!!!!
I traded in my ZL-1 with a CATCH CAN and all supporting mods listed in this siggy when I went and bought my Zo6. The only thing they were concerned about was that it had no cats. I split the cost of the cats with the dealership put the 93octane tune in the car and gave them the keys. The service dept then went through car and test drove the heck out of it. We made the deal and I drove off in my new Zo6.
I then returned 3 days later with extra set of keys for the ZL-1 and noticed it was for sale with certified pre owned sign giving it 1yr warranty!!!!!!!
They actually are warrantying a car with a catch can and all these mods!!! Albeit it may be warrantied by the dealership and not GM but if one dealership thinks its ok (get my point?)!!!!!!
I would have had that dealership tear engine down and find the true cause of failure (oil pump) and then worried about who's gonna pay the bill after they found the problem. Under no circumstance would I have taken possession of the car again until its running again or settled!!!!!!

a CPO Warranty is not a Dealer Program - a car has to meet minimum standards to on it.

"Certified Pre-Owned (CPO) is a manufacturer-sponsored used vehicle refurbishment and warranty program that may also include special incentives and financing."

[bobby35ny]

Hope this don't get deleted....

What about a protest at the next Fest, or disinvite the GM bigshots?

I'm sure the bigshots show up and their asses kissed, how about ignoring them this time?

-Bobby

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by PaVaSteeler

DODGE CHALLENGER OWNER HERE - and I come in peace.

I applaud the OP for his even-toned comments, even with the original post, given the circumstances. However, I feel in all honesty he is doing both himself and all other car enthusiasts around the country a great dis-service by publicly supporting GM's stand on this issue.

We, the readers, do not know all that went on behind the scenes, and thus can only go by what was originally posted as being all the facts.

On the basis of that, I believe the OP is surrendering far too easily; many of the comments recently posted before mine spell out low cost measures by which the OP can get his car back up and running while not surrendering the moral, ethical and legal high ground his case (as stated) indicates he has.

What bothers me the most, and seems to be lost in all the kerfluffle, is the fact that the dealership drove the car a mile despite it suffering from a lack of oil pressure. If the engine is truly jackpotted, suffering far more damage than simply a failed oil pump discovered upon attempts to start the car, then it is to the dealership that I think legal eyes should turn.

What is causing the "strange sound" they claim the engine is making? How exactly did the dealership rack up even 1/10th of a mile on the odometer without risking further damage to the engine, knowing that it was being brought in with a CEL indicating a failure of oil pressure?

And GM: the OP repeatedly states his support of what GM has written in its manual, that any modifications made to the car voids the warranty....but OP, it is exactly this kind of stance from a manufacturer that brought about the Mag/Moss act in the first place.....such a stance is unsupportable, and merely a dodge (pardon the pun) for the manufacturer to disavow any real culpability for defective parts they install.

I wish the OP good luck, but further wish he would reconsider his meek acceptance of GM's position. For what GM can successfully get away with, Dodge surely will try to mimic.

In the end, it is groups like SEMA that need to step in more aggressively to protect the car parts aftermarket. This, the foundation of what us enthusiasts rely upon in pursuing our passion for fast cars, is under attack on many fronts; for example, the automakers' position under the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) that we don't own our cars, that we're merely leasing the software.

At play here also is the Law of Unintended Consequences: The OP's capitulation to GM's position merely strengthens and embolden's the manufacturers to work in cahoots with the EPA, who may next start enforcing their interpretation of regulations, so they too will go after Catch Can owners, for "altering the emissions" of the cars....

...where does it stop?

When it comes to issues like this, Challenger owners and Camaro owners need to put aside their differences and speak as one voice. That's why I gladly signed the petition that was started, and then spread it around all the social media I'm on to garner support.

For in the end, if they come for GM owners, and I sit silent, one day they'll come for me.

love Challengers too by the way. Good read here folks!!!

[Superman09]

The fight is not over. I know I said that in my last post, but that post was written at a time when I felt very much defeated. I was really hoping that once I reached some higher-ups things would get resolved and I would get my car fixed. When that didn't happen I really did not want to do anything but get my car back on the road. After some phone calls, and conversations with people who are far more versed in this type of situation than I, I have decided on a route to take. I don't really want to say yet what that route is. The gofundme is still closed, and will remain closed until I feel that I need assistance. I don't want to take people's hard earned money and then end up with a resolution that doesn't cost me anything. If I take people's money I want to make sure that I can show where the money is going and that I am not just using it as a fund to build my car. I appreciate people's generosity and willingness to help me with this, and if it gets to that I will let y'all know. For now keep the faith and be patient this may take awhile to get solved.

[theragtopguy]

Originally Posted by Superman09

The fight is not over. I know I said that in my last post, but that post was written at a time when I felt very much defeated. I was really hoping that once I reached some higher-ups things would get resolved and I would get my car fixed. When that didn't happen I really did not want to do anything but get my car back on the road. After some phone calls, and conversations with people who are far more versed in this type of situation than I, I have decided on a route to take. I don't really want to say yet what that route is. The gofundme is still closed, and will remain closed until I feel that I need assistance. I don't want to take people's hard earned money and then end up with a resolution that doesn't cost me anything. If I take people's money I want to make sure that I can show where the money is going and that I am not just using it as a fund to build my car. I appreciate people's generosity and willingness to help me with this, and if it gets to that I will let y'all know. For now keep the faith and be patient this may take awhile to get solved.

Good for you!!! Glad to hear that you have a different outlook on this now!

Go get 'em!!!

[Chevy Fanatic]

Originally Posted by Superman09

The fight is not over. I know I said that in my last post, but that post was written at a time when I felt very much defeated. I was really hoping that once I reached some higher-ups things would get resolved and I would get my car fixed. When that didn't happen I really did not want to do anything but get my car back on the road. After some phone calls, and conversations with people who are far more versed in this type of situation than I, I have decided on a route to take. I don't really want to say yet what that route is. The gofundme is still closed, and will remain closed until I feel that I need assistance. I don't want to take people's hard earned money and then end up with a resolution that doesn't cost me anything. If I take people's money I want to make sure that I can show where the money is going and that I am not just using it as a fund to build my car. I appreciate people's generosity and willingness to help me with this, and if it gets to that I will let y'all know. For now keep the faith and be patient this may take awhile to get solved.

Glad to see you have come to your senses. If all else fails you can sue GM in small claims court to attempt recovery of any money you spend to right this wrong. You only need to tip the scale slightly in your favor, which would be very easy to do, if GM did not settle after being served.

GM has a TSB (or a PI) out on the oil pump sticking relief valve, a well known problem. Tear down with photos, mechanic statement as to problem found, use the TSB against them, subpoena GM records (if you have to) of oil pump replacements of vehicles to support it occurs / happens to cars without catch cans.... easy case to build and present.

[Tenring]

Originally Posted by Superman09

The fight is not over. I know I said that in my last post, but that post was written at a time when I felt very much defeated. I was really hoping that once I reached some higher-ups things would get resolved and I would get my car fixed. When that didn't happen I really did not want to do anything but get my car back on the road. After some phone calls, and conversations with people who are far more versed in this type of situation than I, I have decided on a route to take. I don't really want to say yet what that route is. The gofundme is still closed, and will remain closed until I feel that I need assistance. I don't want to take people's hard earned money and then end up with a resolution that doesn't cost me anything. If I take people's money I want to make sure that I can show where the money is going and that I am not just using it as a fund to build my car. I appreciate people's generosity and willingness to help me with this, and if it gets to that I will let y'all know. For now keep the faith and be patient this may take awhile to get solved.

Outstanding!

If people do not stand up for their rights, they will not have any.

[Mr. Stacy]

I have got traction with BBB in the past, good luck! Keep us informed.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by bobby35ny

Hope this don't get deleted....

What about a protest at the next Fest, or disinvite the GM bigshots?

I'm sure the bigshots show up and their asses kissed, how about ignoring them this time?

-Bobby

Not gonna delete anything...because I'd like to reply:

There are lines that need not be crossed, nor bridges burned over this...folks would do well to keep calm, as this situation progresses and provide help and constructive input to Superman where they can.

[68rssscamaro]

Originally Posted by Superman09

The fight is not over. I know I said that in my last post, but that post was written at a time when I felt very much defeated. I was really hoping that once I reached some higher-ups things would get resolved and I would get my car fixed. When that didn't happen I really did not want to do anything but get my car back on the road. After some phone calls, and conversations with people who are far more versed in this type of situation than I, I have decided on a route to take. I don't really want to say yet what that route is. The gofundme is still closed, and will remain closed until I feel that I need assistance. I don't want to take people's hard earned money and then end up with a resolution that doesn't cost me anything. If I take people's money I want to make sure that I can show where the money is going and that I am not just using it as a fund to build my car. I appreciate people's generosity and willingness to help me with this, and if it gets to that I will let y'all know. For now keep the faith and be patient this may take awhile to get solved.

I been waiting for this post-Good to hear, and good luck!

[Superman09]

Originally Posted by bobby35ny

Hope this don't get deleted....

What about a protest at the next Fest, or disinvite the GM bigshots?

I'm sure the bigshots show up and their asses kissed, how about ignoring them this time?

-Bobby

This is exactly what I DON'T want to happen. I don't want my minor (in the grand scheme) problem to derail things with this forum and especially any future fests. I have been to two fests and they are great, and I have loved being there. The last one I had my car at I had the Camaro team sign my car, and I want that to be an option for any other new Camaro owner at future fests. No matter how this turns out I will be attending future fests with my car, and I hope to collect the few signatures I am missing. Lets all keep calm and keep the faith.

[Tenring]

Superman vs GM sounds like a great movie title! haha

Superman, please also consider the ripple effect this has had on the car enthusiast here who like to take car of, fix up, mod their car. Just look at some of the threads going on in the bolt on section. Discussions are how to mod and un-mod the car before taking it in for warranty or service.

This terrible position by GM has made some think they are being forced to commit some type of warranty fraud. IMO this deceit is wrong on both side of the fence. For me if I mod my car and it breaks that's on me and if it breaks and my mods have not not caused it, that's on them. I mean where does it end!

[Superman09]

Originally Posted by Tenring

Superman vs GM sounds like a great movie title! haha

Superman, please also consider the ripple effect this has had on the car enthusiast here who like to take car of, fix up, mod their car. Just look at some of the threads going on in the bolt on section. Discussions are how to mod and un-mod the car before taking it in for warranty or service.

This terrible position by GM has made some think they are being forced to commit some type of warranty fraud. IMO this deceit is wrong on both side of the fence. For me if I mod my car and it breaks that's on me and if it breaks and my mods have not not caused it, that's on them. I mean where does it end!

And this is one of the reasons I have decided to keep fighting this. But please also understand that your dealer plays a HUGE part in whether or not you car gets fixed. Your dealer is not GM, so what your dealer does may be different that what GM does. I have talked to a few different dealers who have said that had I taken my car to them that I would be back on the road already and this mess never would have happened.

[witenite]

Superman09, good to hear you haven't gave up hope. Good luck!!!