Can you S/C an active fuel mgt engine? - Page 2 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

The_Stache · 10-18-2008, 06:18 PM

Something else to consider is that there where rumors that the new system will "refresh" the charge in the shutdown cylinders so that it doesnt detonate on its own and that its less harsh on restart of the deactivated cylinders..

matt55 · 10-18-2008, 09:01 PM

Yall have no idea how BOV work ...
It opens when the throttle closes to release pressure after the turbo/blower before the throttle blade so the air doesnt back up and slow down the compresser wheel . Some recirculate back in to the intake(before turbo) others dump it to the atmosphere and they are more comonly called BOV .

With turbos we use waste gates and boost controlers to control boost .
Superchargers use pully size to regulate boost.

Some superchargers have by pass valves that open at low loads to make them soak up very little HP while driving .

The guys on G8board have some supercharged systems running .
Do some reading over there and see what they come up with there AFM .

*CamaroSpike23* · 10-18-2008, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt55

Yall have NO idea how BOV work ...

The guys on G8board have some supercharged systems running .
Do some reading over there and see what they come up with there AFM .

i do have to admit this. i was referring to a dump valve/wastegate instead of BOV.

camaro5 · 10-18-2008, 10:19 PM

You can disable AFM with a tune. I doubt anyone has a puffer with AFM enabled, but I don't know for sure.

LSxJunkie · 10-18-2008, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt55

Yall have no idea how BOV work ...
It opens when the throttle closes to release pressure after the turbo/blower before the throttle blade so the air doesnt back up and slow down the compresser wheel . Some recirculate back in to the intake(before turbo) others dump it to the atmosphere and they are more comonly called BOV .

With turbos we use waste gates and boost controlers to control boost .
Superchargers use pully size to regulate boost.

Some superchargers have by pass valves that open at low loads to make them soak up very little HP while driving .

The guys on G8board have some supercharged systems running .
Do some reading over there and see what they come up with there AFM .

I know a couple people running centrifugals on LS1s and LS3s that run blow off valves to protect the throttle body and everything upstream.

*Mr. Wyndham* · 10-18-2008, 10:54 PM

Magnacharger has a kit ready (not sure if it's for sale, yet) on the G8, and Procharger does to. Afaik, AFM is still active in both applications.

JusticePete, the Pedders guy around here, has a Procharged G8 -- he'll know for sure.

Dan · 10-19-2008, 01:39 AM

There is no way you could have boost with AFM on at the same time anyway. At the throttle opening you would need to have to start building boost the AFM would have already been shut off by the computer.

headpunter · 10-19-2008, 01:49 AM

the new magnachargers have a bypass valve built in so they relieve the pressure when the AFM kicks in

JusticePete · 10-20-2008, 04:47 PM

Yes you can use F/I with the AFM system. Mine has been working flawlessly for months. Including dyno testing, auto-crosses, road courses, drag strips, highway and city driving my L76 G8 is delivering 19.1 MPG and now is at 480 RWHP.

*CamaroSpike23* · 10-21-2008, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Yes you can use F/I with the AFM system. Mine has been working flawlessly for months. Including dyno testing, auto-crosses, road courses, drag strips, highway and city driving my L76 G8 is delivering 19.1 MPG and now is at 480 RWHP.

480RWHP>19.1MPG

MrKrisSullivan · 10-22-2008, 01:31 AM

I've seen the same thing for the Hemi's your talking about... In all my research you have to get the system deleted... It costs like 150$ for the Hemi...

PatrickfromMD · 10-22-2008, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Yes you can use F/I with the AFM system. Mine has been working flawlessly for months. Including dyno testing, auto-crosses, road courses, drag strips, highway and city driving my L76 G8 is delivering 19.1 MPG and now is at 480 RWHP.

Pete, tell us more about your G8 L76 with AFM
I have been contemplating a Magnuson for my SS with L99. I want the best mileage possible and the advantage of a force fed engine.
Are you aware of any differences between the AFM system on the L76 as opposed to the upcoming L99?
On your car, does the AFM only engage on the highway at cruise?
Do you feel the AFM kick out long before you get positive boost?
In your car, if you are on the highway, say cruising at 60 and then bumped the trans down 2 gears while stomping on it, how well does the motor handle the transition from 4 cyl economy cruise to 480 RWHP and everything pressed up against the rear window glass?

Any thought as to which solution would favor the AFM engine, ProCharger or Magnuson (it’s also an invitation for WM Holden to chime in)

Do either solution include re-programming of the ECU to accommodate FI, or is that’s something hat hase to be done by a 3rd party? I’d really like to have my ECU optimized for FI, have the shifts firmed up just a bit, and maybe even hold the AFM in slightly longer before kicking out (something I was reading on some other forums that allowed further increase in economy). Any thoughts on the Autos ability to handle FI and reprograming for moderately improved upshifts turning slightly larger tires?
Anyone else have any thoughts?

JusticePete · 10-22-2008, 02:11 PM

ProCharger has been a valued marketing partner to Pedders since 2004. I have supplied ProCharger with GTOs and G8s to prototype systems. Our relationship has made for good business and good friendships. I mention this as I may have a built in bias toward ProCharger.

The AFM is seamless in operation regarding trottle or transmission inputs. AFM engages only when the car is at a steady speed -- 20 MPH in a school zone, cruise control up to roughly 84 MPH. Aside from the change in exhaust tone it is almost imperceptable.

Why would anyone keep AFM with a FI system, because I am green at heart

Actually I opted to keep it because I think the technology is cool and I get to post 19.1 MPG with 480 RWHP. The engineers at GM will tell you that AFM is good for just under 1 MPG on your fuel average. It doesn't hurt anything and saves a bit of fuel.

I am NOT a tuning expert. My understanding is that the LS1 and LS2 would both read boost and vacuum from a Cobalt / HHR SS MAP sensor allowing the tuner more flexibility and precision. The L76 does not read the two stage MAP sensor so I am guessing the L99 will not either. The tuner does have access through tables to adjust multiple variables by RPM and throttle position so boosted operation is effective and efficient. Additional releases from HP Tuner and others may allow a two stage MAP on the L76 or L99. With the L99 we'll just have to wait and see.

ProCharger sells two types of systems. One is a bolt it on to the stock engine with no modifications to the engine or exhaust and a ProCharger supplied tune. The other is a tuner kit to let you have at it. Maggie has a similar range of product. My Dealers sell both ProCharger and Maggie with some of my Pedders Dealers selling both. Because of my relationship with ProCharger I may be biased, but I can tell you my technical support is off the charts good. The reliability has been virtually bullet proof. I cringe every time I type that....

The Maggie is very quiet at idle and low speeds. When you get on a Maggie you hear the blower whine in the cabin adding to the sensation of speed. The ProCharger at idle has a noticeable external whistle. Most car guys know exactly what is under the hood by that low speed whistle. When you get on a ProCharger you don't hear it in the cabin. Many will argue that one makes more HP than the other as well as explain the technical differences. My advice to anyone purchasing an FI system is the same as our suspension. Get in a car that has a Maggie and one with a ProCharger. Get some real world experience with them. Pick the one you feel best fits your needs after the test ride / drive. Then factor into the equation who will be the best local Dealer to support you when something goes wrong. Using this decision making formula you cannot go wrong.

Pedderised ProCharged G8

ProCharger Product Development TEAM

Upon Delivery at ProCharger

ProCharger Pedders Strut Tower Bar & Billet Covers

MrKrisSullivan · 10-22-2008, 02:55 PM

That's a weird spot for the air filter... Tight fit huh??

10-18-2008, 06:18 PM	#15
The_Stache SoCal Race Team #13 Drives: 2010 1SS:RS:LS3:SW Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,800 View My Garage	Something else to consider is that there where rumors that the new system will "refresh" the charge in the shutdown cylinders so that it doesnt detonate on its own and that its less harsh on restart of the deactivated cylinders.. __________________ A.K.A - Diarmadhi (old handle) - So much to do.. So little money Owner : Fast-Stache Industries LLC

10-18-2008, 09:01 PM	#16
matt55 Drives: CTS-V Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Raleigh NC Posts: 1,069	Yall have no idea how BOV work ... It opens when the throttle closes to release pressure after the turbo/blower before the throttle blade so the air doesnt back up and slow down the compresser wheel . Some recirculate back in to the intake(before turbo) others dump it to the atmosphere and they are more comonly called BOV . With turbos we use waste gates and boost controlers to control boost . Superchargers use pully size to regulate boost. Some superchargers have by pass valves that open at low loads to make them soak up very little HP while driving . The guys on G8board have some supercharged systems running . Do some reading over there and see what they come up with there AFM . __________________ 10.8@130.8 610 whp, CAI, 2.5, E85, id850 on street tires. Last edited by matt55; 10-18-2008 at 09:31 PM.

10-18-2008, 10:54 PM	#20
Mr. Wyndham I used to be Dragoneye... Drives: 2018 ZL1 1LE Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 31,873 View My Garage	Magnacharger has a kit ready (not sure if it's for sale, yet) on the G8, and Procharger does to. Afaik, AFM is still active in both applications. JusticePete, the Pedders guy around here, has a Procharged G8 -- he'll know for sure. __________________ *"Keep the faith."* - Fbodfather

10-19-2008, 01:49 AM	#22
headpunter Not That sad..considering Drives: Man Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: the part of washington the capital forgot about. Posts: 3,745 View My Garage	the new magnachargers have a bypass valve built in so they relieve the pressure when the AFM kicks in __________________ Stop Whinging

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10-18-2008, 10:19 PM	#18
camaro5 Drives: X-15 Velocipede Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: SW Florida Posts: 4,630	You can disable AFM with a tune. I doubt anyone has a puffer with AFM enabled, but I don't know for sure.

10-19-2008, 01:39 AM	#21
Dan Drives: 2004 GTO Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Montgomery, AL Posts: 448	There is no way you could have boost with AFM on at the same time anyway. At the throttle opening you would need to have to start building boost the AFM would have already been shut off by the computer.

10-20-2008, 04:47 PM	#23
JusticePete Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 20,171	Yes you can use F/I with the AFM system. Mine has been working flawlessly for months. Including dyno testing, auto-crosses, road courses, drag strips, highway and city driving my L76 G8 is delivering 19.1 MPG and now is at 480 RWHP.

10-22-2008, 01:31 AM	#25
MrKrisSullivan New 2 The "DARK-SIDE" Drives: 2003 Ram HEMI 4x4 Slt 20in Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: St. Augustine Florida Posts: 89	I've seen the same thing for the Hemi's your talking about... In all my research you have to get the system deleted... It costs like 150$ for the Hemi...

10-22-2008, 02:11 PM	#27
JusticePete Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 20,171	ProCharger has been a valued marketing partner to Pedders since 2004. I have supplied ProCharger with GTOs and G8s to prototype systems. Our relationship has made for good business and good friendships. I mention this as I may have a built in bias toward ProCharger. The AFM is seamless in operation regarding trottle or transmission inputs. AFM engages only when the car is at a steady speed -- 20 MPH in a school zone, cruise control up to roughly 84 MPH. Aside from the change in exhaust tone it is almost imperceptable. Why would anyone keep AFM with a FI system, because I am green at heart Actually I opted to keep it because I think the technology is cool and I get to post 19.1 MPG with 480 RWHP. The engineers at GM will tell you that AFM is good for just under 1 MPG on your fuel average. It doesn't hurt anything and saves a bit of fuel. I am NOT a tuning expert. My understanding is that the LS1 and LS2 would both read boost and vacuum from a Cobalt / HHR SS MAP sensor allowing the tuner more flexibility and precision. The L76 does not read the two stage MAP sensor so I am guessing the L99 will not either. The tuner does have access through tables to adjust multiple variables by RPM and throttle position so boosted operation is effective and efficient. Additional releases from HP Tuner and others may allow a two stage MAP on the L76 or L99. With the L99 we'll just have to wait and see. ProCharger sells two types of systems. One is a bolt it on to the stock engine with no modifications to the engine or exhaust and a ProCharger supplied tune. The other is a tuner kit to let you have at it. Maggie has a similar range of product. My Dealers sell both ProCharger and Maggie with some of my Pedders Dealers selling both. Because of my relationship with ProCharger I may be biased, but I can tell you my technical support is off the charts good. The reliability has been virtually bullet proof. I cringe every time I type that.... The Maggie is very quiet at idle and low speeds. When you get on a Maggie you hear the blower whine in the cabin adding to the sensation of speed. The ProCharger at idle has a noticeable external whistle. Most car guys know exactly what is under the hood by that low speed whistle. When you get on a ProCharger you don't hear it in the cabin. Many will argue that one makes more HP than the other as well as explain the technical differences. My advice to anyone purchasing an FI system is the same as our suspension. Get in a car that has a Maggie and one with a ProCharger. Get some real world experience with them. Pick the one you feel best fits your needs after the test ride / drive. Then factor into the equation who will be the best local Dealer to support you when something goes wrong. Using this decision making formula you cannot go wrong. Pedderised ProCharged G8 ProCharger Product Development TEAM Upon Delivery at ProCharger ProCharger Pedders Strut Tower Bar & Billet Covers

10-22-2008, 02:55 PM	#28
MrKrisSullivan New 2 The "DARK-SIDE" Drives: 2003 Ram HEMI 4x4 Slt 20in Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: St. Augustine Florida Posts: 89	That's a weird spot for the air filter... Tight fit huh??