Turbos vs Superchargers

[Wm Holden]

ok....but I'm not done....

[Mindz]

photofunia is nice, yes?

And for the jolie pic, she's cold.

[andyrew]

Originally Posted by camaro_corvette

How reliable are thes 600-800 HP cars though, Cause i can see them getting worked on all the freakin time.. I'm looking more for reliability than any thing else. Don't get me wrong, i want HP, but not at the expense of my time. I'm still gonna be driving my car everyday.\

EDIT: Understand that I don't know jack about this subject.

To be honest, they are pretty darn reliable. With the technology out there that monitors and adjust all the vital components these days, its pretty darn amazing.

Also, did you realize that I was talking about a 600-800hp 1.8L 4 cylinder?

Before this thread was merged I was referencing using turbo's in the 3.6L V6 engine vs a supercharger. So lets double that 1.8L engine's displacement. Rules say we should double the HP... and... well,

Nah, lets not bother with this debate. In reality, it comes down to opinion.


I will turbocharge the v6 rather than supercharge it. Enough said.

[SS4EVER]

I've seen way too many people on other forums ask this question and end up seeing WWIII happen...

I've learned that it comes down to personal preference. My little Supercharged Cobalt SS utilizes an Eaton M62 roots type supercharger. I love the instant torque that a supercharger makes, and the whine sound that it makes... But at least for smaller displaced engines like 4cyl for the most part turbos will make better power.

GM also dropped the LSJ for the LNF in the 08+ Cobalt SS, and it's making way better power stock vs the supercharged Cobalt SS.

Although as already stated the new TVS superchargers are making similar performance gains/mpg's as turbos traditionally have made. Not sure if any of you know this but Audi just recently signed a contract with Eaton and they'll be using TVS superchargers in their next RS6 and possibly RS4....

For smaller displaced engines such as 4cyls, and 6cyls, in my experience I've seen turbos make more power.

For V8's, roots type supercharger is your best bet.

If I had a V8 Camaro I'd go roots type S/C
If I had a V6 Camaro I'd go turbo............

They both have their pros and cons people. It's really just a matter of personal preference...

[Crowley]

Having owned both on different applications:

04 cobra - Roots style Eaton on a 32v V8 - Way easy to turn up the boost and very cost effective. However it isn't as efficient as a turbo(s). It was VERY reliable and was able to get 509rwhp/520fttq .. If I were to go twin screw that would be well over 600rwhp and still very streetable. Loved it.

06 Mazdaspeed 6 - Turbo 4cly. Small turbo so it had a lot of boost down low (like the roots almost). I liked it quite a lot, but would be much more expensive to get higher boost. One other downside was the direct injection for the engine ... fuel delivery was a limitation for those that wanted to push the envelope.

08 135i Bi turbo 6cyl - Small turbos again to spool up fast and give low end torque. Almost feels like a V8. Still not fully tested but people are getting arounf 400rwhp (in a pretty light car) .. however this engine is Direct Injection again and I feel that it may get expensive if you want to push the envelope and get the fuel to the engine.

All in all, I think if you want to go to insane HP , turbos are the way to go as they are more efficient. The downside I think is reliability and cost.

For me .. I want to go Twin Screw if it can be done correctly (ie inter cooler / heat exchanger setup). ON a 6.2L engine with built internals, I think we will see some pretty good 93 octane numbers (predicting 800+ hp range) and still be a daily driver.

Crowley

[gunslinger]

All I can say is the low-end torque of a S/C is INCREDIBLE, but the sound of a large turbo at WOT sounds like a turbine under the hood.

I would love to have the torque of a roots style S/C and the sound of a jet engine!

[zebra]

why not twin charge? ridiculous amounts of time, parts, & labor involved, but it's been done... many times.

[Shadowsong]

For the record, I prefer turbos, and plan on putting twins under the hood of my camaro.

I just made the original post because superchargers were more likely to fall into the price range that I quoted.

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by SS4EVER

I've seen way too many people on other forums ask this question and end up seeing WWIII happen...

I've learned that it comes down to personal preference. My little Supercharged Cobalt SS utilizes an Eaton M62 roots type supercharger. I love the instant torque that a supercharger makes, and the whine sound that it makes... But at least for smaller displaced engines like 4cyl for the most part turbos will make better power.

GM also dropped the LSJ for the LNF in the 08+ Cobalt SS, and it's making way better power stock vs the supercharged Cobalt SS.

Although as already stated the new TVS superchargers are making similar performance gains/mpg's as turbos traditionally have made. Not sure if any of you know this but Audi just recently signed a contract with Eaton and they'll be using TVS superchargers in their next RS6 and possibly RS4....

For smaller displaced engines such as 4cyls, and 6cyls, in my experience I've seen turbos make more power.

For V8's, roots type supercharger is your best bet.

If I had a V8 Camaro I'd go roots type S/C
If I had a V6 Camaro I'd go turbo............

They both have their pros and cons people. It's really just a matter of personal preference...

[radz28]

Originally Posted by SS4EVER

I've seen way too many people on other forums ask this question and end up seeing WWIII happen...

I've learned that it comes down to personal preference. My little Supercharged Cobalt SS utilizes an Eaton M62 roots type supercharger. I love the instant torque that a supercharger makes, and the whine sound that it makes... But at least for smaller displaced engines like 4cyl for the most part turbos will make better power.

GM also dropped the LSJ for the LNF in the 08+ Cobalt SS, and it's making way better power stock vs the supercharged Cobalt SS.

Although as already stated the new TVS superchargers are making similar performance gains/mpg's as turbos traditionally have made. Not sure if any of you know this but Audi just recently signed a contract with Eaton and they'll be using TVS superchargers in their next RS6 and possibly RS4....

For smaller displaced engines such as 4cyls, and 6cyls, in my experience I've seen turbos make more power.

For V8's, roots type supercharger is your best bet.

If I had a V8 Camaro I'd go roots type S/C
If I had a V6 Camaro I'd go turbo............

They both have their pros and cons people. It's really just a matter of personal preference...

Originally Posted by gtahvit

WOW! I hadn't heard that yet. I'll be looking into more TVS systems for sure!

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by andyrew

I beg to differ. A GT40R could push 600hp through the 3.6L EASY or running twin GT28R's could do it as well.

Guys running really big turbo's on the Audi 1.8L engine's are making 800+hp, many guys are in the 400-600hp range, and just about everyone is in the 300-400 range (including me). Tell me a supercharger could do that.

800hp... thats cool.... seriously it is... but what rpm are they making it at? what kind of torque are they making? how much useable power do they have under the curve

Originally Posted by camaro_corvette

How reliable are thes 600-800 HP cars though, Cause i can see them getting worked on all the freakin time.. I'm looking more for reliability than any thing else. Don't get me wrong, i want HP, but not at the expense of my time. I'm still gonna be driving my car everyday.\

EDIT: Understand that I don't know jack about this subject.

fast
cheap
reliable

pick 2.

Originally Posted by andyrew

I will turbocharge the v6 rather than supercharge it. Enough said.

with DI, you could swap to ethanol, turbo the piss out of it and crank the boost on this little motor.

Originally Posted by gunslinger

All I can say is the low-end torque of a S/C is INCREDIBLE, but the sound of a large turbo at WOT sounds like a turbine under the hood.

I would love to have the torque of a roots style S/C and the sound of a jet engine!

have you ever heard a centrifugal s/c? its basically just half of a turbo that is belt driven.

and low end torque isnt always that great with centrifugals. roots and twin screw are monsters thruout the powerband, but you do get a slight lag with centrifugals.

[BowtieGuy]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

800hp... thats cool.... seriously it is... but what rpm are they making it at? what kind of torque are they making? how much useable power do they have under the curve.

Yea 800hp is bad ass. I do wonder how fast that motor has to be spinning though. On a 1.8L motor, they probably don't make any power until 4-5k RPM or more. Doesn't make much sense to me to have god awful power but hardly ever use it.

That's what I love about superchargers. Spins at the same speed as the motor. Makes maximum power exactly when the engine would normally, you have full access to it at any time.

[Moose]

Jumpin' in a little late here, but for me, give me displacement.

I never liked turbo's, and after driving my sister's boyfriends Cobra (supercharged), I didn't like that either.

[GTAHVIT]

With a name like Moose, I can't say I'm surprised you are a displacement guy....




err uum. Just kidding. Really.