One Thing the Camaro has over the gt500

[ffrcobra_65]

I guess this pointless back and forth will keep going until Ford releases the GT500 #s. Wait, it will still keep going even after that, until C & D, Motor Trend, etal, do a head to head comparo and crown the king of pony cars...oh wait, who am I kidding, pointless topics don't die.

[BigDan]

Originally Posted by The IOM Ninja

Have you ever even seen the 4th gen Camaro?

[RedRooster]

Nevermind. Delete.

[oldlugs]

Originally Posted by ParisTNDude

I've had 5 Mustangs and tons of Chevys...my last Mustang was an 08 Bullitt and it was an absolute dog, but great looking. I like the idea of 550 or even better 650 HP as on the not yet produced GT500..

I've still got my '08 Bullitt, and use it to take the kids to school. I wouldn't call it a "dog", but it certainly lacks the KR's low-end grunt. The Bullitt is a great looker though, and mine, being lowered, even more so.. I think I get more stares in it, than the much more rare, KR.

[Tob]

Lugs, where were you when you took those shots?

[oldlugs]

Originally Posted by Tob

Lugs, where were you when you took those shots?

On county highway N2, near the Old Ridge Route.
Shots were right from here:



It's a pretty scenic old road, about an hour North of LA.
I keep hoping the Old Ridge Route will reopen... It's been closed off for years, but you can still drive short sections of it.

Some Ridge Route info., in case you're curious:
http://ridgeroute.com/

[oldlugs]

Originally Posted by ss12go

smack like this?

http://jalopnik.com/5859549/the-2013...bitch:popcorn:

I think that garbage ^ was written by a fifteen year-old.

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by ss12go

smack like this?

http://jalopnik.com/5859549/the-2013...bitch:popcorn:

You don't actually take Jalopnik seriously as a automotive news site do you? Just because they might have revealed the next generation Corvette doesn't automatically make them a good site lol.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by The IOM Ninja

Now 200 MPH, yes it is more of a bragging right but at the same time, what is it that is preventing the ZL1 from reaching that top speed? It can't be aerodynamics since, as according to what you said earlier, the ZL1 (which isn't out yet) is more aerodynamic than the 2013 GT500 (which also isn't out yet), is it the horsepower difference? Very possibly. Is it the weight difference? Also a possibility. Surely if the ZL1 were capable of 200 MPH the ring time would be a few seconds faster perhaps bringing it into the 7:30-7:40 range, doesn't seem like it would be all that different.

The ZL1 does not reach a higher top speed primarily to aerodynamics. I did not say it was more aerodynamic in the sense that everyone has come to understand it. I referenced the fact that engineers fine-tuned tuned the body to actually generate downforce, which not even the Corvette ZR1 can do. They chose to sacrifice top-end speed, in order to use that energy for cornering at speed.

The rest of the issue would be power and gearing, as sixth is still focused on fuel-economy, almost exclusively.

Despite this, please note that the ZL1 reached a higher speed (if only by a few mph) than the 2012 Z06 which reportedly top speed of 19x.

Originally Posted by The IOM Ninja

As for the optional stuff, subtract the Glass Roof and Navigation from the GT500 and get the SVTTP on the GT500 and you're looking at about the same price as a base ZL1. Now that is assuming the price, like the 4.6 to the 5.0, doesn't change all that much. It's still not standard but you can get the car for around the same price. This is all speculation though so to be fair it's obviously not necessarily true.

With all that power, I would never in a million years imagine buying a GT500 without the supporting performance upgrades. Not arguing this point...just clarifying my position on price vs price. Base prices may be similar, but I think it's next to impossible that this new Mustang will be less expensive when they are similarly equipped at the end of the day.

Originally Posted by The IOM Ninja

I'm completely floored at the fact that they are, as per what has been discussed and dealer allocations, limiting 2012 ZL1 production. This of course is assuming they don't decide to just open the flood gates on it. That to me is absolutely insane. People buy generally on a whim based on specs a lot of the time. What would sound more impressive to you if you were a buyer? A 650 Horsepower ZL1 or a 580 hp GT500.

I would think my opinions in this thread would have inferred that I'm the sort of buyers who's not at all impressed by single factoids. I need to see the big picture.

And as a point of interest, they're not "limiting" production. As has been discussed around the ZL1 section often, it is an effect of the high price and half the model-year being over that they are hard to come by.

Originally Posted by The IOM Ninja

For the record I love the ZL1, SS, 5.0 and GT500 as well as the 392. They all have their upsides and downsides but it is a great time to be a fan of American Muscle Car's.

You REALLY rubbed me the wrong way when you pulled the fanboy card out. I apologize for the explosion of a post I made in reply.

The bottom line is what you said above.

I spend several hours over the course of the last week watching auto shows and browsing websites looking at EVERY car that could possibly rub noses in this segment. And truly, the GT500 and Camaro two are the only ones that stand out as the best bang-for-your-buck. IMO, they are distinctly different in their approaches...as are all Ford and Chevy comparisons lately...but nobody from Europe or Asia can really hold a candle to these two.

Given that this debate is eternal...I'm happy being one of two cars in the world that can offer this sort of sheer performance at such a value. And I'm ecstatic knowing they're both American.

[Deki]

^ It only generates 65lbs of down force at 150mph. That is not that much. Also, I'm sure the ZR1's front end generates down force, as it's used on the GT2 C6R Vettes.

[mikeSS]

Originally Posted by mpate16

The Gt500 will NEVER look as good as a Camaro ZL1!. Sure it may be faster, no one knows yet, but nobody cares when a mustang goes by. It's the camaro that everybody is drawn too! Go Chevy!

yo dude you driving a 2012 LSX 2lt ? hehe

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by mikeSS

yo dude you driving a 2012 LSX 2lt ? hehe

I did find it kind of funny that the OP owns a V6 and is bashing the GT500.

[tooslow]

Found this over on Mustangdaily.com:

http://mustangsdaily.com/blog/2011/1...he-camaro-zl1/

The announcement of the 2013 Shelby GT500 at the L.A. Auto Show caused various reactions throughout the automotive community. Mustang fans, of course, were ecstatic to see a production Mustang with 650 horsepower capable of 200 mph. Others, like Al Oppenheiser, the chief engineer of the Chevrolet Camaro ZL1, had a different perspective. After the Shelby’s debut, Oppenheiser wrote a letter to the Camaro Nation claiming that the “2013 GT500 will still not match the technology and sophistication of the 2012 Camaro ZL1.” He took it another step further, saying “for Mustang fans, you’re welcome. Clearly the Camaro has encouraged Ford to throw everything they can at us.”

That’s not the case, according to Jamal Hameedi, the SVT chief nameplate engineer. At the L.A. Auto Show Hameedi informed us that the increased performance of the 2013 GT500 was not inspired by the Camaro ZL1 but rather to stay a step ahead of the Mustang Boss 302. When we asked whether the Camaro ZL1 influenced the development of the 2013 GT500, he quickly responded by saying “surprisingly not because when we launched this program it was in the darkest days of the automotive industry. Everyone had said the ZL1 program was canceled. So actually when we kicked this program off the ZL1 was canceled at the time.” Rather, Hameedi informed us that SVT realized that additional performance was required of the GT500 during Ford’s development and testing of the Boss 302. “We wanted to make a big step in performance,” he told us. “We didn’t just want to just make a marginal step.”

This isn’t too surprising, considering the Boss 302′s straight line performance is fairly close to that of the 2012 Shelby GT500. Motor Trend achieved a 0-60 mph time of 4.0 seconds flat in a Boss 302, a nearly identical time to what a GT500 is capable of producing, and a stock Boss 302 has produced 1/4 mile times well into the 11s with just a set of drag radials.

[tooslow]

Originally Posted by ParisTNDude

The Mustang was the best V8 bang for the buck before the 2010 Camaro and it was the best looking American performance car after the Vette. Now, the Camaro just blows the Mustang away....Mustang= America's iconic secretary car.

Yep, as much as the Corvette is America's iconic mid-life crisis car.

Can't we just appreciate the Camaro for what it is without running down the competition? As many have said in other threads, looks are subjective.