MotorTrend Pits the ZL1 vs GT500 on the Street, Dragstrip, and Racetrack

[PQ]

Ok, so I watched the video and read the article.

No, I don't own either. And haven't even driven either.

But it sounds like you put some brakes on the Shelby and it's the superior car for racing all the way around. And kills the Camaro in the 1320. The Camaro being the 'easier' to drive.

Kinda surprising to me but it is what it is. What happened to the VASTLY superior suspension? Negated by the extra weight?

Almost follows the auto vs stick debate. The 'easier' to drive vs the 'funner' to drive. Gotta be a better driver to drive the Shelby.

Until I drive both that's all I can surmise.

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by motorhead

They forgot the most important street test. What's going to happen when a gt500 and zl1 meet on the highway.

That may be the most important test in your opinion. It's not in mine nor in many others'.

Originally Posted by motorhead

Who cares how they ride on the street.

I and many others do.

Originally Posted by motorhead

If I wanted ride, I would buy a big BMW.

Many prefer to buy American made vehicles.

Originally Posted by motorhead

Looks to me from all the test so far that the gt500 is the best everywhere.

Form that statement, it's unclear what tests and reviews you have been reading.

Originally Posted by motorhead

You guys are getting pretty pathetic. Every time the gt500 proves you wrong you have to cling to a new angle. First you were going to win at the track. Well you didn't. Now it's "well we have better brakes".

Please get your history and facts correct and don't over generalize. Many here have stated that the GT500 could run a faster lap on a track depending on the track configuration, especially on those tracks that have some long straights where the GT500's extra horsepower could be utilized.

Originally Posted by motorhead

There are very few owners that will run one lap at a track let alone multiples.

And the point is???

Originally Posted by motorhead

If you ask me ford really out smarted gm here. They took an old design and made it out perform the most advanced technology in the world all in the name of value and real world results.

Again, the facts simply don't comport with the above statement.


I think we understand that you appear to prefer the GT500. Good for you. Enjoy it, if you have one. It's a fine car. It's simply not the car for me or many others who contribute to Camaro5.

I doubt any of these threads regarding the testing of the GT500 and the ZL1 will change many, if any, minds on the subject.

[rez333]

Originally Posted by Wolverine

Here's the video....

Am I hearing right? It sounds like Randy gave the win to the GT500. Skip to 11:30

ZL1:
+ "far superior brakes"
- more understeer through a middle of a corner
+ on a bumpy road, the Camaro is going to take it
+ more sophisticated suspension
- chassis imbalance (understeer, then oversteer) - "push loose"


GT500:
+ Best bite, best steering
- needs a brake upgrade for track work
+ Better car with a brake upgrade for track work and probably the street too
+ Better balanced
+ "really puts the power down"

Thoughts?

[adamgl]

Originally Posted by PQ

Ok, so I watched the video and read the article.

No, I don't own either. And haven't even driven either.

But it sounds like you put some brakes on the Shelby and it's the superior car for racing all the way around. And kills the Camaro in the 1320. The Camaro being the 'easier' to drive.

Kinda surprising to me but it is what it is. What happened to the VASTLY superior suspension? Negated by the extra weight?

Almost follows the auto vs stick debate. The 'easier' to drive vs the 'funner' to drive. Gotta be a better driver to drive the Shelby.

Until I drive both that's all I can surmise.

There where 12 theoretical lead changes on the fast laps before the brake fade on the mustang. ZL1 would out corner the 500 and the 500 would pass it back on the straights. So I would say they're close on a road course. Mostly be a drivers race, also depends on what track it is. 1320 GT500 has the advantage always there.

[Bob Cosby]

Originally Posted by Wizard1183

Considering GM put this ZL-1 out for 2012 with 580HP then Ford releases their GT500 for 2013 AFTER seeing the HP rated ZL-1....

Ummm....Ford announced the 2013 GT500 would have 650+ HP the same day GM announced the numbers for the ZL1. Obviously Ford had to have been working on a brand new engine (5.8L) and thus 'upgraded' GT500 for more than a few hours after GM's announcement.

It also well known that the 2012 Boss 302 had almost as good numbers as the much more expensive 2012 GT500 - which is the reason Ford gives (take it for what its worth) for further improving the GT500.

The rest of your post is not worth commenting on.

[Scrappy Doo]

Originally Posted by PQ

Ok, so I watched the video and read the article.

No, I don't own either. And haven't even driven either.

But it sounds like you put some brakes on the Shelby and it's the superior car for racing all the way around. And kills the Camaro in the 1320. The Camaro being the 'easier' to drive.

Kinda surprising to me but it is what it is. What happened to the VASTLY superior suspension? Negated by the extra weight?

Almost follows the auto vs stick debate. The 'easier' to drive vs the 'funner' to drive. Gotta be a better driver to drive the Shelby.

Until I drive both that's all I can surmise.

THIS.

The cars are very close. I am not a mustang guy and I would get the zl1. The Shelby is a geat car though, and I wouldn't fault anybody for wanting one.

Not to mention that maybe 5% of these car's owners would ever push the car to it's limits anyway.

[Bob Cosby]

Originally Posted by PQ

Ok, so I watched the video and read the article.

No, I don't own either. And haven't even driven either.

But it sounds like you put some brakes on the Shelby and it's the superior car for racing all the way around. And kills the Camaro in the 1320. The Camaro being the 'easier' to drive.

Kinda surprising to me but it is what it is. What happened to the VASTLY superior suspension? Negated by the extra weight?

Almost follows the auto vs stick debate. The 'easier' to drive vs the 'funner' to drive. Gotta be a better driver to drive the Shelby.

Until I drive both that's all I can surmise.

Reasonable analysis - though I think it could be argued that "easier" and "funnier" could be the same to many people.

[Blue Menace]

Originally Posted by rez333

Am I hearing right? It sounds like Randy gave the win to the GT500. Skip to 11:30

ZL1:
+ "far superior brakes"
- more understeer through a middle of a corner
+ on a bumpy road, the Camaro is going to take it
+ more sophisticated suspension
- chassis imbalance (understeer, then oversteer) - "push loose"


GT500:
+ Best bite, best steering
- needs a brake upgrade for track work
+ Better car with a brake upgrade for track work and probably the street too
+ Better balanced
+ "really puts the power down"

Thoughts?

He clearly said the GT500 is the better car IF it gets a brake upgrade. As is, the Camaro was the better performer.

[shank0668]

Originally Posted by PQ

Ok, so I watched the video and read the article.

No, I don't own either. And haven't even driven either.

But it sounds like you put some brakes on the Shelby and it's the superior car for racing all the way around. And kills the Camaro in the 1320. The Camaro being the 'easier' to drive.

Kinda surprising to me but it is what it is. What happened to the VASTLY superior suspension? Negated by the extra weight?

Almost follows the auto vs stick debate. The 'easier' to drive vs the 'funner' to drive. Gotta be a better driver to drive the Shelby.

Until I drive both that's all I can surmise.

About 82hp. That has a big thing to do with it. Look at the lead the Shelby takes when you look at the map thing in straight aways. The only reason the Camaro kept up was because of a better suspension.

I am really impressed with the Gt500... Still would buy a ZL1, but I'm Biased.

I think the next generation of both cars will yield a significant improvement on the track. The Camaro really has a hard time now being underpowered and weighing more on it's sedan chassis.

[C5RocksC5]

Originally Posted by papawattz

Mustang fanboy WOW, Out on the highway someone in a GT 500 is gonna get over confident, try and race a ZL1 and end up just sitting there spinning it's tires. So out in the real world(streets) the ZL1 still wins

I am not a Mustang fanboy. You are hugely late on the argument you are using about the Shelby not putting its power to the ground. It seems to put the power to the ground just fine.

[oortcloud]

Originally Posted by Blue Menace

He clearly said the GT500 is the better car IF it gets a brake upgrade. As is, the Camaro was the better performer.

Yes, I think the big IF gets ignored by some here.

Road course the gt500 needs mods to keep up. 1/4 mile the zl1 needs mods to keep up.

And we're back to the endless mod loop equation.

[Blue Menace]

^^ good way to put it.

[LeviG]

Originally Posted by Bad@ssCamaro

The 1LE option for the SS does not come with the MRC system.

Other changes to optimize the 1LE for track-day use include:

Larger, 27-mm solid front stabilizer bar, and 28-mm solid rear stabilizer bar for improved body control
Higher-capacity rear-axle half shafts to cope with increased levels of traction
Strut tower brace for improved steering feel and response
ZL1-based 20 x 10-inch front and 20 x 11-inch aluminum wheels
285/35ZR20 Goodyear Eagle Supercar G:2 tires front and rear (identical to the front tires for ZL1)
ZL1 wheel bearings, toe links and rear shock mounts for improved on-track performance
ZL1 high-capacity fuel pump and additional fuel pickups for improved fuel delivery during high-cornering

Wasn't it going to have MRC at one point? I thought I'd read that somewhere a while back and I just hadn't heard any different since.

[PQ]

Wow, I thought I'd get the big flame thrower here. LOL

I really was being unbiased and honest so I guess I shouldn't have expected to get blasted.

Originally Posted by adamgl

There where 12 theoretical lead changes on the fast laps before the brake fade on the mustang. ZL1 would out corner the 500 and the 500 would pass it back on the straights. So I would say they're close on a road course. Mostly be a drivers race, also depends on what track it is. 1320 GT500 has the advantage always there.

I'm betting the Camaro would get the shelby on an auto cross where the horse power is largely negated.

Originally Posted by Scrappy Doo

THIS.

The cars are very close. I am not a mustang guy and I would get the zl1. The Shelby is a geat car though, and I wouldn't fault anybody for wanting one.

Not to mention that maybe 5% of these car's owners would ever push the car to it's limits anyway.

As hard as I drive my car I will NEVER push it to it's physical max.

A) I'm not a good enough driver
B) I don't race it enough

Originally Posted by Bob Cosby

Reasonable analysis - though I think it could be argued that "easier" and "funnier" could be the same to many people.

True. I was making a classless stab at 'Manly Manual' man.

Even the drivers said that the Camaro wins due to ease and sophistication.

Originally Posted by shank0668

About 82hp. That has a big thing to do with it. Look at the lead the Shelby takes when you look at the map thing in straight aways. The only reason the Camaro kept up was because of a better suspension.

I am really impressed with the Gt500... Still would buy a ZL1, but I'm Biased.

I think the next generation of both cars will yield a significant improvement on the track. The Camaro really has a hard time now being underpowered and weighing more on it's sedan chassis.

Not if GM doesn't get the Vette upgraded.