Camaro VS Mustang Mega Thread - Page 230 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

JusticePete · 03-14-2011, 10:33 AM

Pedders / Saleen / Speed Lab parts are the same. Once we partnered with them it made no sense to sell under two main brands so all Pedders Mustang parts carry the Saleeen / Speed Lab name.

The Mustang did VERY well. The Camaro did bit better. The Camaro was no ordinary Camaro. Aside from a big RWHP advantage, the Camaro also had a full year of setup refinement since the first public track session. A year of setup development is an eternity. We'll run the Mustang again with a slightly revised setup as noted on page 14. It should be a full second faster or more.

That said, compare the Mustang we ran to the Z06. It is 2 seconds faster than a Z06 and can be ordered with a warranty through Saleen Dealers for the same price as a Z06.

Sax1031 · 03-14-2011, 01:47 PM

Yea didn't the Camaro have around 100 more wheel hp than the stang?

JusticePete · 03-14-2011, 02:07 PM

Yes it did, but that wasn't the difference. The data logging showed the Mustang out accelerated and out braked the Camaro. The Mustang outperformed the Camaro with the exception of cornering and putting power down out of the corners. Corners are where the extra weight from the Camaro IRS really shined.

To make the Mustang faster we had to reduce the rear sway bar diameter and go back to the 26mm bar, soften the rear coils and raise the rear ride height. The other area that really hurt the Mustang was the seating. A five point harness will hold the driver securely in place.

To make the Camaro better we want to move to a ZL1. It isn't for the RWHP. Gingerman is a suspension, brakes and tires course. We move to the ZL1 for improve weight distribution. Our ProCharger is on the front of the engine and in front of the front 'axle'. The LSA has the blower in the same position as the Mustang. Moving that weight further back will improve handling. The other advantages to the ZL1 are a stronger differential that will put power down in the highest G turns and the new sway bar locating points that make the rear bar more efficient.

The next time on track I expect the Mustang to be just over 1 second faster. I would expect the ZL1 to be 1.5 seconds faster. That has the Mustang vs Camaro race back to a virtual dead heat. Would a BOSS engine make a difference? Not that much because once again, this is a suspension, brake and tire track.

Now the ZL1 is just a pulley and tune away from 600 RWHP and a Speed Lab / Saleen blower on a BOSS would make some hair raising numbers. HUGE leaps in RWHP will reduce lap times by a couple of tenths.

Then we could add a five point harness to the Camaro...

8cd03gro · 03-14-2011, 02:23 PM

Would the potential gearing advantage of the new 6 speed have helped the mustang or was the mustang able to be geared well enough with the 5-speed that the 6 would have been negligible? Just wondering.

JusticePete · 03-14-2011, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

Would the potential gearing advantage of the new 6 speed have helped the mustang or was the mustang able to be geared well enough with the 5-speed that the 6 would have been negligible? Just wondering.

Based on data logging, the only help needed was with the rear suspension. It was very fast and the gearing seemed to be just about dead nuts on. When you watch the video with the data logging you can see the RPMs are about where you would want them for both the track and power band.

E.T. · 03-14-2011, 03:18 PM

I don't know what year Mustang GT this is, but regardless, here is a case of a V8 being beaten by a V6. It happens...

20Camaro11 · 03-14-2011, 03:30 PM

[QUOTE=E.T.;2959471]I don't know what year Mustang GT this is, but regardless, here is a case of a V8 being beaten by a V6. It happens...
QUOTE]

Mustang won it at the line......did someone say drivers race?

REEFBLUE93 · 03-14-2011, 04:13 PM

This would make for a great episode of Myth Busters! I have to admit, the 5th Gen V6 is pretty impressive for being a N/A six cylinder. Don't know if GM had "race car" in mind when they designed it so it will be interesting to see how they hold up after being run down the track repeatedly.

*DGthe3* · 03-14-2011, 04:56 PM

Unless I'm mistaken, this thread is about a Mustang GT from the 2000 MY and NOT 05-09 GT's. So all this talk about the newer cars is rather off topic. In fact, its getting deleted right after I hit submit ...

porcupinekiller · 03-14-2011, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Yes it did, but that wasn't the difference. The data logging showed the Mustang out accelerated and out braked the Camaro. The Mustang outperformed the Camaro with the exception of cornering and putting power down out of the corners. Corners are where the extra weight from the Camaro IRS really shined.

To make the Mustang faster we had to reduce the rear sway bar diameter and go back to the 26mm bar, soften the rear coils and raise the rear ride height. The other area that really hurt the Mustang was the seating. A five point harness will hold the driver securely in place.

To make the Camaro better we want to move to a ZL1. It isn't for the RWHP. Gingerman is a suspension, brakes and tires course. We move to the ZL1 for improve weight distribution. Our ProCharger is on the front of the engine and in front of the front 'axle'. The LSA has the blower in the same position as the Mustang. Moving that weight further back will improve handling. The other advantages to the ZL1 are a stronger differential that will put power down in the highest G turns and the new sway bar locating points that make the rear bar more efficient.

The next time on track I expect the Mustang to be just over 1 second faster. I would expect the ZL1 to be 1.5 seconds faster. That has the Mustang vs Camaro race back to a virtual dead heat. Would a BOSS engine make a difference? Not that much because once again, this is a suspension, brake and tire track.

Now the ZL1 is just a pulley and tune away from 600 RWHP and a Speed Lab / Saleen blower on a BOSS would make some hair raising numbers. HUGE leaps in RWHP will reduce lap times by a couple of tenths.

Then we could add a five point harness to the Camaro...

It would be much more interesting if you guys built a 2012 ZL1 and a 2012 GT500.
That would be one hell of crazy pair, modded and ripping up the track.

JusticePete · 03-14-2011, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porcupinekiller

It would be much more interesting if you guys built a 2012 ZL1 and a 2012 GT500.
That would be one hell of crazy pair, modded and ripping up the track.

The ZL1 is coming. Can the GT500 or whatever the next iteration be far behind?

porcupinekiller · 03-14-2011, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

The ZL1 is coming. Can the GT500 or whatever the next iteration be far behind?

The 2012 ZL1 will be available early in 2012 (about a year away). The 2012 GT500 is already showing up at dealers across the country. So..........you guys can pick up a GT500 and get started.

usa1camaro1969 · 03-14-2011, 07:43 PM

Wondering why I even bother posting in these. You left half the pages that didn't even have anything to say about the 2000 MY mustang and deleted a select few.

To the OP, stop asking if your car is faster or not and take it to the track. It'd your best bet to decide if it's worthy or not. You might actually enjoy it.

*DGthe3* · 03-14-2011, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usa1camaro1969

Wondering why I even bother posting in these. You left half the pages that didn't even have anything to say about the 2000 MY mustang and deleted a select few.

To the OP, stop asking if your car is faster or not and take it to the track. It'd your best bet to decide if it's worthy or not. You might actually enjoy it.

I deleted 30 posts regarding the 2005-2009 Mustang ... hardly a 'select few'

03-14-2011, 03:18 PM	#3212
E.T. Drives: 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Cleveland, OH Posts: 3,273	I don't know what year Mustang GT this is, but regardless, here is a case of a V8 being beaten by a V6. It happens... __________________

03-14-2011, 04:56 PM	#3215
DGthe3 Moderator.ca Drives: 05 Grand Am GT Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Niagara, Canada Posts: 25,366	Unless I'm mistaken, this thread is about a Mustang GT from the 2000 MY and NOT 05-09 GT's. So all this talk about the newer cars is rather off topic. In fact, its getting deleted right after I hit submit ... __________________ Note, if I've gotten any facts wrong in the above, just ignore any points I made with them __________________ Originally Posted by FbodFather My sister's dentist's brother's cousin's housekeeper's dog-breeder's nephew sells coffee filters to the company that provides coffee to General Motors...... ........and HE WOULD KNOW!!!! __________________ Camaro Fest sub-forum

03-14-2011, 07:43 PM	#3219
usa1camaro1969 Back on the dino-juice Drives: '10 LS + a few more Join Date: May 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 1,641	Wondering why I even bother posting in these. You left half the pages that didn't even have anything to say about the 2000 MY mustang and deleted a select few. To the OP, stop asking if your car is faster or not and take it to the track. It'd your best bet to decide if it's worthy or not. You might actually enjoy it. __________________ I wake up in the morning and I piss excellence. -Ricky Bobby America is all about speed. Hot, nasty, badass speed. -Eleanor Roosevelt, 1936

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03-14-2011, 10:33 AM	#3207
JusticePete Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 20,171	Pedders / Saleen / Speed Lab parts are the same. Once we partnered with them it made no sense to sell under two main brands so all Pedders Mustang parts carry the Saleeen / Speed Lab name. The Mustang did VERY well. The Camaro did bit better. The Camaro was no ordinary Camaro. Aside from a big RWHP advantage, the Camaro also had a full year of setup refinement since the first public track session. A year of setup development is an eternity. We'll run the Mustang again with a slightly revised setup as noted on page 14. It should be a full second faster or more. That said, compare the Mustang we ran to the Z06. It is 2 seconds faster than a Z06 and can be ordered with a warranty through Saleen Dealers for the same price as a Z06.

03-14-2011, 01:47 PM	#3208
Sax1031 Drives: 2000 Mustang GT Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Elgin,SC Posts: 2,707	Yea didn't the Camaro have around 100 more wheel hp than the stang?

03-14-2011, 02:07 PM	#3209
JusticePete Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 20,171	Yes it did, but that wasn't the difference. The data logging showed the Mustang out accelerated and out braked the Camaro. The Mustang outperformed the Camaro with the exception of cornering and putting power down out of the corners. Corners are where the extra weight from the Camaro IRS really shined. To make the Mustang faster we had to reduce the rear sway bar diameter and go back to the 26mm bar, soften the rear coils and raise the rear ride height. The other area that really hurt the Mustang was the seating. A five point harness will hold the driver securely in place. To make the Camaro better we want to move to a ZL1. It isn't for the RWHP. Gingerman is a suspension, brakes and tires course. We move to the ZL1 for improve weight distribution. Our ProCharger is on the front of the engine and in front of the front 'axle'. The LSA has the blower in the same position as the Mustang. Moving that weight further back will improve handling. The other advantages to the ZL1 are a stronger differential that will put power down in the highest G turns and the new sway bar locating points that make the rear bar more efficient. The next time on track I expect the Mustang to be just over 1 second faster. I would expect the ZL1 to be 1.5 seconds faster. That has the Mustang vs Camaro race back to a virtual dead heat. Would a BOSS engine make a difference? Not that much because once again, this is a suspension, brake and tire track. Now the ZL1 is just a pulley and tune away from 600 RWHP and a Speed Lab / Saleen blower on a BOSS would make some hair raising numbers. HUGE leaps in RWHP will reduce lap times by a couple of tenths. Then we could add a five point harness to the Camaro...

03-14-2011, 02:23 PM	#3210
8cd03gro Drives: 2005 STi corn fed Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,997	Would the potential gearing advantage of the new 6 speed have helped the mustang or was the mustang able to be geared well enough with the 5-speed that the 6 would have been negligible? Just wondering.

03-14-2011, 03:30 PM	#3213
20Camaro11 Drives: SS Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: not here Posts: 655	[QUOTE=E.T.;2959471]I don't know what year Mustang GT this is, but regardless, here is a case of a V8 being beaten by a V6. It happens... QUOTE] Mustang won it at the line......did someone say drivers race?

03-14-2011, 04:13 PM	#3214
REEFBLUE93 Account Suspended Drives: 1993 Rustang Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 941	This would make for a great episode of Myth Busters! I have to admit, the 5th Gen V6 is pretty impressive for being a N/A six cylinder. Don't know if GM had "race car" in mind when they designed it so it will be interesting to see how they hold up after being run down the track repeatedly.